ATH First Round Match #4 Connemara Man vs Imnotthehulk (next vote wins)

beakerjoe

The next bout in Around The Horn features Boards draft vet C-Man vs the man who claims not to be Bruce Banner.

You both know the rules by now, so heres your question :


Q4 4. Sting v The Undertaker is always one dream match that could of happened but didnt. It could of happened at WM31 but we got HHH hogging Sting and Taker battling Bray Wyatt instead.

Besides this match, If you could book one WrestleMania match that we haven't seen, and should have, what would it be and why?"

Note that these matches must have been possible, so talent must have been on the books at the same time for a match to occur. Eg Andre vs Big Show doesn't count

Good luck fellas

Imnotthehulk

As soon as I read the question one match came to mind. One of my personal favourites, who was taken from us all far too early, against someone who is regarded as one of the greatest of all time.

Eddie Guerrero

Vs

Shawn Michaels

You all know Shawn Michaels, as I said, one of the greatest of all time. Before he retired HBK had a hall of fame career, was undoubtedly a great wrestler, but also one who had issues. When he returned to WWE in 2002 he seemed to have those issues sorted, he came back a more mature, and rounded individual, and really hit his prime. Michaels was so good at stealing the show at Wrestlemania year in year out he achieved the nickname Mr Wrestlemania.

Eddie, also returned to WWE in 2002 having seemingly put his own personal differences behind him. 2002 was of course when the Brand Extension went into effect, meaning that HBK and Eddie were kept apart. For the rest of his career Eddie was a smackdown staple, establishing the brand as part of the Smackdown 6, before eventually becoming a much beloved champion and main eventer. People loved Guerrero.

Before Guerrero passed away there were (reportedly) plans for Wrestlemania 22 to feature a match between the Guerrero and HBK, and to build the match around their career parallels. If this had happened at any Wrestlemania I have no doubt we'd still be talking about it up there with Steamboat/Savage or any other match you feel like mentioning.

connemara man

now sorry for my delay.

I read the question and one person came to mind and the year came to mind and like my competitor I have chosen

the year: 2002

Wrestler 1: Shawn Michaels

his opponent: The Rock

in 2002 rock returned to Smackdown to this reception

and Shawn Michaels returned to this

The Rock is unquestionably the most watchable star to come out of the WWE the charisma he has is incredible. and in 2002 his return had him back in his home of Smackdown.

Shawn Michaels returned and went on to have some of the best matches in career and had one hell of a indian summer in his career retutrned into the NWO on Raw.

These two men are some of the first that I think of when I think Wrestling

Given how they returned and the star power it had well the fued... It almost writes it self

Imnotthehulk

The Rock is an amazing choice.

But there are a couple of reasons why this match could never have happened at Wrestlemania 2002

The first problem with a match at Wrestlemania in 2002 is that HBK didn't return until June 2002, a few months after the event. The Rock left in August 2002 to film The Scorpion King, he wouldn't return to the ring until February 2003.

The second, bigger problem, is The Rock actually hated Shawn Michaels at the time. Back in the day, when the Rock was a teen, HBK had apparently been quite rude to his grandmother Lia Maivia at a wrestling show. Then, in the nineties as The Rock's star was rising in the business HBK (and company) tired their best to undermine him at various stages, including trying to convince Vince that he should be replaced by Triple H in the main event of Wrestlemania IV.

In fact, according to an interview with Jim Ross in 2014, Shawn Michaels talked about the possiblity of a program with the Rock upon his return in 2002, only for the electrifying one to turn it down: "I can remember many, many years ago, as I came back," Michaels said, "Pat Patterson asked about that and I said, 'Sure, whoever you want.' But he wasn't interested, and that was it."

The animosity from The Rock to HBK at the time was still very much in effect. Apparently this didn't ease off until after the 2008 Hall Of Fame when The Rock inducted his Grandfather.

So even when the two men were active on the books at the same time a match just wasn't possible as long as The Rock bore a grudge against Shawn Michaels.



The only thing preventing my Dream Match from happening was bad timing. Eddie Guerrero vs Shawn Michaels could've happened at any stage over the few years they were on the roster together, but Wrestlemania 21 would have been the perfect time, and we all know how amazing a match it would've been. Neither man had any animosity between each other, and this was a match being planned for Wrestlemania 22.

connemara man

Imnotthehulk wrote: »

The Rock is an amazing choice.

But there are a couple of reasons why this match could never have happened at Wrestlemania 2002

The first problem with a match at Wrestlemania in 2002 is that HBK didn't return until June 2002, a few months after the event. The Rock left in August 2002 to film The Scorpion King, he wouldn't return to the ring until February 2003.

I got my dates confused I knew I'd get something wrong in this post.

with their respective returns in 2002 and Rocks leaving for Scorpion king one hell of a build could have been put together for Wrestlemania 2003 Shawn Michaels taking out the Rock (giving him time to film) his return for Wrestlemania to exact revenge.

We have the clarity of hindsight and know what happened at that Wrestlmania (between the Rock and Stone Cold) but I am booking from the year before hand

Imnotthehulk wrote: »

The second, bigger problem, is The Rock actually hated Shawn Michaels at the time. Back in the day, when the Rock was a teen, HBK had apparently been quite rude to his grandmother Lia Maivia at a wrestling show. Then, in the nineties as The Rock's star was rising in the business HBK (and company) tired their best to undermine him at various stages, including trying to convince Vince that he should be replaced by Triple H in the main event of Wrestlemania IV.

In fact, according to an interview with Jim Ross in 2014, Shawn Michaels talked about the possiblity of a program with the Rock upon his return in 2002, only for the electrifying one to turn it down: "I can remember many, many years ago, as I came back," Michaels said, "Pat Patterson asked about that and I said, 'Sure, whoever you want.' But he wasn't interested, and that was it."

The animosity from The Rock to HBK at the time was still very much in effect. Apparently this didn't ease off until after the 2008 Hall Of Fame when The Rock inducted his Grandfather.

So even when the two men were active on the books at the same time a match just wasn't possible as long as The Rock bore a grudge against Shawn Michaels.

This is actually my reason why it should have happened, most feuds tend to feel flat because there's no real chemistry, and some of the best blur the lines between Kayfabe and reality ie Edge and Hardy, Shawn Michaels and Brett Hart hell you could even say the Invasion angle and more.

When Wrestling s at its best you cant quite tell if whats hapening is real or not. take CM Punks pipe bomb and the next couple of months.

Vince and crew should have got the two together and should have banged their heads together and got them to do it.

I have no doubt that it would have been gold.

Imnotthehulk wrote: »

The only thing preventing my Dream Match from happening was bad timing. Eddie Guerrero vs Shawn Michaels could've happened at any stage over the few years they were on the roster together, but Wrestlemania 21 would have been the perfect time, and we all know how amazing a match it would've been. Neither man had any animosity between each other, and this was a match being planned for Wrestlemania 22.

I agree if it wasn't for circumstance then they would have eventually had the big match. I'm not sure it would have made a Wrestlemania match (Thats personal opinion more than anything else)

Original premise of this question is: If you could book one WrestleMania match that we haven't seen, and should have, what would it be and why?

Eddie vs Shawn is a great pick but one I think is born out of sentiment due to circumstance. Like you said it was meant to happen.

The Rock and Shawn never happened and never looked like happening because of genuine animosity and that is why it Should have happened.

Imnotthehulk

This is actually my reason why it should have happened, most feuds tend to feel flat because there's no real chemistry, and some of the best blur the lines between Kayfabe and reality ie Edge and Hardy, Shawn Michaels and Brett Hart hell you could even say the Invasion angle and more.

I’m not so sure that the match would have been gold. Heat doesn't equal chemistry.
The reason that Edge / Hardy feud seemed so electric at the time was because Hardy was treated so badly by the WWE. He was fired for reasons fans deemed unfair. This was a prototype Daniel Bryan movement. Except Hardy had about half the charisma Bryan. The fans wanted this to be an amazing feud, but in reality it ended up being something of a wet fart, with one terrible match and one decent match. If Hardy feuded with Edge without being fired first, it would just have been another mid card bore fest.


The Invasion angle also was a famously watered down version of what fans actually wanted. We wanted to see Steve Austin vs Goldberg, ‘Taker vs Sting, instead we watched WWE wrestlers face a bunch of WCW and former ECW midcarders, with a number of WWE main eventers switching from one side to the other (and back again) in an effort to make things interesting.

When Wrestling s at its best you cant quite tell if whats hapening is real or not

I think this is what was written on WCW’s tombstone after Vince Russo was done with it.

Again look to WCW, it's politics, it's behind the scenes shenanigans to see plenty of flat feuds despite it's participants having heat with each other.

Heat doesn't make feuds. It can add to one, but that's rare, and not always the case.

I would also point to HBK's match with Hulk Hogan at Summerslam in 05 ... he essentially made a mockery of the whole event. HBK was untouchable in WWE at this time, knowing full well that as he wasn't carrying the company he no longer needed to make every match a classic, and in the match with Hogan he was all about himself. Unhappy with the situation around the match HBK turned it into a mockery, a sham. Given the fan's apathy towards Hogan it may have been fun to watch, but it robbed us of a serious legend v legend match, instead giving us a comedy match.

Original premise of this question is: If you could book one WrestleMania match that we haven't seen, and should have, what would it be and why?

Eddie vs Shawn is a great pick but one I think is born out of sentiment due to circumstance. Like you said it was meant to happen.

The Rock and Shawn never happened and never looked like happening because of genuine animosity and that is why it Should have happened.

What's wrong with sentiment. Especially when this sentiment concerns one of the greatest wrestlers to ever step into the ring. As anyone who was a fan of wrestling at the time knew, people loved Eddie Guerrero, when he was a heel, we loved to hate him.

HBK and Guerrero didn't have any beef. They were both at the top of their games wrestling wise. This match could easily have happened at Wrestlemania 19 or 21. A full blown feud culminating in a match at Wrestlemania, we'd probably be regarding it as a Savage/Steamboat level match.

connemara man

On my phone so I can't multi quote.

Those feuds that ended poorly had that initial raw emotion involved that got everyone interested searching had that because of the touch of reality involved.

If WWE booking couldn't capitalise in that well that's a discussion for a different ATH question.

It might be on WCWs tombstone but as an audience member when done right ala the pipe bomb it draws us in to the story that bit more.

The Problem with using the Hogan Match as a defence of your selection is that it's also goes against your own. There's nothing to say that Michaels would have been any different for your hopeful Savage/Steamboat level match.

nothing is wrong with sentiment but it does bring a tinge of rose tinted glasses view on something and that can skew objectivity on the pros and cons as you are making an emotional decision.

The Rock was lightning in a bottle IMO a pure showman and to pit him against Shawn Michaels the show stopper would have created a feud we'd be talking about for years.

The Rock vs Shown Michaels was my choice

The Showman vs the showstopper is why it should have happened

beakerjoe

Poll added

beakerjoe

Poll bump

beakerjoe

Another draw with 8 votes a piece, BH will open the bout for sudden death, next vote wins it