New heating system installation

po12desimt

hi all. I need advice on central heating installation. i bought an old house with no central heating. there is absolutely nothing, only cold water tap in the kitchen and flush toilet. there is no water storage in the attic either. water comes straight from the mains. it is 3 bed two story mid terraced house built in early 1930... space is very limited. i am very tight with a budget as i am a single mum, not working, full time student. i wonder what i could do to reduce central heating installation cost? i need 6 radiators to install, planing to get a stove and an electric boiler. i would like a stove to be connected to a central heating as i have access to a source of turf for cheaper and i could use it to heat all the rads around the house in cold times. i am not currently considering gas or oil heating. after a few years i am thinking adding a solar heating option to a system. any advice? what my options are in space and cost savings? any reply is appreciated

Calahonda52

The first objective should be to reduce the energy demand in the existing dwelling.

You don't need 6 rads. You have decided you want 6 rads

"Cheaper turf" for a stove is a fool's paradise.

Have you rear access in this mid terrace/
Have u storage for solid fuel?
what above the cost of disposing of all the ash, plus the extra cleaning etc etc.

Solar Thermal Roof panels is another fool's paradise.

Given that its a '30s house you need to be cognisant of the structure of the walls if doing any insulation.

I don't know what you mean by electric boiler: day rate elec is 20 cents a Kwh
Gas is is c 5 cents..

My advice, insulate, with proper controlled ventilation
Go gas if its on the road: mid terrace u don't need grief with oil tank.
Look after the bairn(s)
Hit the books hard, really hard
Keep well

ps mosey around this site when on study breaks, lots here, even by ur's truly!

OwenM

Insulate first. Attic, windows and walls in that order. You may not need to do walls at all for now.

Your lucky that the house is mid terrace, your neighbours are contributing to keeping you warm.

If mains gas is on the road I would go with that otherwise an oil boiler, I have a boiler stove (heats rads and water) and an oil boiler(existing legacy) and I love the stove but there is work involved getting bulk fuel stored - the last thing you need is to be trucking buckets or bags of fuel through the house on cold winter evenings.

Because of the age of the house the floors are almost certainly solid so a plumber might want to have to kango out channels for the pipes, some will opt to tack them to the walls and box them in but this is short term thinking and looks awful. Digging channels takes time and money.

If finance is an issue then save for a while, and in the mean time use electric heaters in the bedrooms and a cheap water heater in the kitchen, light the open fire, put in an electric shower. It's not great but the shower isn't wasted money and the heaters would only set you back a couple of hundred.

Just rethinking the stove, a non boiler stove (aka a dry stove) isn't a bad idea, you won't need nearly as much fuel but it only heats one room and it's very cosy.

po12desimt

Thank you for reply.
More I look and think about this more I feel like my head is going to explode.
I don't have a space for oil tank, so I thought i could go for an electric combi boiler. but it seems is too expensive to run. in previous rented accommodation I had central gas heating and I was paying about 200-270 eu per single billing period(excl. electricity). in addition, I was often using a stove, but it would heat only the living room. I like fire and never had any issues of storing solid fuel or cleaning stove on daily basis. i thought if i could get stove connected to a central heating system in the house, i could balance my electricity bills... it is only my thoughts as i have no knowledge or experience or anyone who could explain me how the heating systems are combined and work either together or separately... I have tried to read other threads but comments that are there are all about the oil or gas heating, and/or upgrading an existing old heating systems. my position is a bit worse than of those who has at least some heating system, as i have absolutely plain house, with no insulation or heating....or even shower...

Calahonda52

OwenM has given good advice here which mirrors in part what I am saying.
What do you mean by: so I thought i could go for an electric combo boiler.

Model, make etc and we will find it, u can't post links.

You say 200/270 every two months for heat and I presume hot water: can you describe the accommodation?

What do you expect to pay in this house?

In many respects the fact that you have nothing is an advantage

You don't need the necessary complexity of a stove connected to rads, however if you are wedded to the idea then there is not much we can offer, its the wrong answer.

What state are the windows in?: unless they are in rag order then replacing them is perhaps not the best investment either, I think OwenM and I might differ here but its only at the edges, the central advice is the same, insulate, controlled ventilation and keep it simple for now.
What is your budget?

As I said before, you need to reduce the energy demand and then decide on the required heating: maybe just one or two rooms to begin with

OwenM

I agree, window replacement may not be necessary, check for obvious drafts from them, the real giveaway is condensation on the inside of the glass on a cold morning - these needs replacing.

As mentioned above do tell us details about the electric boiler.

OwenM

I did find this:
http://www.thermaflowheating.co.uk/electric-boilers/

but the largest boiler in their range is 12kw, above that you need a 3 phase electricity connection :O and that's not something you are going to consider, ESB Networks would find it amusing. A 12kw boiler might heat an A rated 2 bed terraced house. My house is semi-d with 9 rads and my oil boiler is 21kw and my stove is 17kw.

The SEAI publish fuel cost comparisons:
http://seai.ie/Publications/Statistics_Publications/Fuel_Cost_Comparison/Domestic-Fuel-Cost-Comparisons.pdf

Electricty space heating costs are at least 3 times that of oil or gas, I base this on usage of Band DD
( >=5,000 <15,000 kWh per annum).

po12desimt

Windows seems ok. i didn't noticed any condensation on the glass yet.

Trianco Aztec Electric boiler. that is something I had in my mind.

po12desimt

to get gas installed in the house is going to cost a lot of money, and i m very tight on budget as i have mentioned earlier. whatever works i m able to do i m doing myself in order to save for heating installation. i know it sounds crazy but i have no other choice. none of the financial institutions gives me loan because i m unemployed. also, there is no constructions or plumbing company that would agree to sign a contract that would allow me to repay charges for service over some period of time. besides that i m running out of time. summer is not going to be forever.

OwenM

It's rated at 11kw, seems to cost 1000.

If you use this for 10 hours a day from November to April and 3 hours a day from May to October (roughly) then using (wattage x cents/kwh x days x hours):

Winter electricity bills - monthly increase: 630 - A MONTH
Summer electricity bills - monthly increase: 190 - A MONTH

Lets look at outlay, all figures are very rough:

Electric
Boiler: 1k
6 x rads : 5k
Immersion: 1.5k

Gas
Mains Connection: 3k (wild guess)
6 x rads : 5k
Immersion: 1.5k
Gas Boiler: 2k

Oil
6 x rads : 5k
Immersion: 1.5k
Oil Boiler + tank: 2.5k


You might think the electric boiler is solving a problem but I'm afraid it isn't. You might scrape enough together to install it but then the electricity bill will kill you. I'd hate to see you go down this route and then be forced into installing a pre-pay meter which makes electricity even more expensive, adding maybe 5% onto the monthly cost. You'll end up sitting in a cold house in January waiting to get paid to turn on the heat... sorry.

My final thoughts:
Insulate. Get a stove (not a boiler stove), standalone plugin heaters for the bedrooms, electric shower and under unit heater for your kitchen sink, this is your cheapest same short term option. The only thing you throw out if you get a gas or oil boiler is the heaters in the bedroom.