Dublin Bus. How do you ask to pay your fare

Seve OB

So I'm not a frequent user of the bus these days, but way back when I was a chisler I used to get the bus to school, work, pubs, all over the place.

We never used to tell the driver where we were off to, but instead just told him what fare we wanted. Eg, 25 pence when we were off to school. Or maybe 85 when I was an adult going a short distance.

So mostly when I do get the bus now I have no clue what the fares actually are. I now have a leap card for the occasions I am getting public transport. Normally I get on and as I mostly go the distance, I swipe the machine on the right. Sometimes though, I only be going a short distance so ask the driver go bring me wherever!

Today though, I'm only going a few stops, but have no idea of the name of where I'm getting dropped off, can hardly just ask him to bring me down the road! I was thinking it would be much easier to just ask for a specific fare like we used to in the old days.

So what is the protocol nowadays and what way do the rest of you ask for your fares? By value or by destination?

loyatemu

Seve OB wrote: »

So I'm not a frequent user of the bus these days, but way back when I was a chisler I used to get the bus to school, work, pubs, all over the place.

We never used to tell the driver where we were off to, but instead just told him what fare we wanted. Eg, 25 pence when we were off to school. Or maybe 85 when I was an adult going a short distance.

So mostly when I do get the bus now I have no clue what the fares actually are. I now have a leap card for the occasions I am getting public transport. Normally I get on and as I mostly go the distance, I swipe the machine on the right. Sometimes though, I only be going a short distance so ask the driver go bring me wherever!

Today though, I'm only going a few stops, but have no idea of the name of where I'm getting dropped off, can hardly just ask him to bring me down the road! I was thinking it would be much easier to just ask for a specific fare like we used to in the old days.

So what is the protocol nowadays and what way do the rest of you ask for your fares? By value or by destination?

I'm an infrequent user and usually state my destination. A lot of people seem to state the fare though. DB fare system is stupid, it should be tag on/tag off for Leap and flat fare for cash.

rx8

Just slap your card on top of the drivers machine and say "One Fifty bud ".
It'll be grand.

liger

rx8 wrote: »

Just slap your card on top of the drivers machine and say "One Fifty bud ".
It'll be grand.

That is an excellent way to get a standard fare of 100 euro.

Place your Leap card on drivers machine and state your destination. Then you can avoid an awkward conversation with the revenue protection guys.

foggy_lad

You can use the Dublin bus website real-time information to see what stop you will be going to, search by route, enter your route and choose the direction of travel and it will list all the stops from start to end of the route.

eg: route 145 http://www.dublinbus.ie/RTPI/Sources-of-Real-Time-Information/?searchtype=route&searchquery=145

Seve OB

liger wrote: »

That is an excellent way to get a standard fare of 100 euro.

Place your Leap card on drivers machine and state your destination. Then you can avoid an awkward conversation with the revenue protection guys.

I sense there was a bit of his tongue lodged firmly in his cheek when he said that!

Anyway as it happens, that's what I said earlier on. Sure I was only going about 6 stops

Seve OB

loyatemu wrote: »

I'm an infrequent user and usually state my destination. A lot of people seem to state the fare though. DB fare system is stupid, it should be tag on/tag off for Leap and flat fare for cash.

This actually makes sense but this is Ireland so no point in doing it that way.

I think in London it is flat fare of 2quid when you use your oyster but something crazy like a flat fare of 4 or 5 bucks if you pay cash

Spanish Eyes

Say where you are going. (Figure it out before you board lol) End of. Easy peasy. Driver has the knowledge! I think....

Anyway, with the LEAP it's either 1.50 or 2.05 unless you use the X bus. 2 or 2.70 cash.

Might be more in the outer suburbs, but that's not me LOL.

callaway92

Seve OB wrote: »

This actually makes sense but this is Ireland so no point in doing it that way.

I think in London it is flat fare of 2quid when you use your oyster but something crazy like a flat fare of 4 or 5 bucks if you pay cash

No cash anymore in London. Just Oyster Card/Contactless

Seve OB

callaway92 wrote: »

No cash anymore in London. Just Oyster Card/Contactless

When did that happen? I'm sure deck all paid with cash anyway with the price being basically double.

DB could and should learn a few things from them

ProudDUB

If you know where you are going is only down the road, then surely you know of a landmark, near to your stop, that you could mention to the driver....a school, a pub etc. The driver would know then how many stages of the journey you are going on and how much your fare is. The fare is calculated by stages. Or you could just look it up on the Dublin Bus website.

Vic_08

Seve OB wrote: »

When did that happen? I'm sure deck all paid with cash anyway with the price being basically double.

DB could and should learn a few things from them

TfL buses went cashless 2 years ago.

I am sure DB would also like to abolish cash payments but cash fares are regulated and there has been considerable resistance from government to previous attempts to rationalise and streamline fares.

A flat fare on leap would be the simplest to run as is done in London but with bus journeys in Dublin being considerably longer than London it is more difficult to justify a compromise fare.

As it is with the current fare long journeys on Leap are very cheap in comparison to short ones; a 1/2 mile trip is €1.50, all the way to Balbriggan from the city centre is only €1.10 more

IMO tag on only for full remaining route fare and tag off for discount for lower fare would be preferable to the current method but there are technical difficulties with it that the current system avoids.

_Kaiser_

It's been about 2 ywars since I was last on a bus but I just stated the fare and reminded myself that the fact that it was near double what it previously would have been a few years earlier for the same distance on quite possibly the same bus (or another AV/X anyway) is precisely why I don't use the "service".

LXFlyer

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

It's been about 2 ywars since I was last on a bus but I just stated the fare and reminded myself that the fact that it was near double what it previously would have been a few years earlier for the same distance on quite possibly the same bus (or another AV/X anyway) is precisely why I don't use the "service".

Presumably you were paying by cash?

You are aware that cash fares have been increased by much higher percentages deliberately to encourage people to use LEAP instead.

_Kaiser_

lxflyer wrote: »

Presumably you were paying by cash?

You are aware that cash fares have been increased by much higher percentages deliberately to encourage people to use LEAP instead.

Bottom line is that LEAP card or not, public transport is still far too expensive, awkward, and unreliable to tempt people out of cars.

But then this is the same company that sold off perfectly usable buses that UK companies and ones at home happily snapped up and put into service (I'm seeing quite a few early AVs still around the place), and then hiked fares in a declining market during a recession.

Whatever about LUAS, DB remains the choice for those only with no better options.

dfx-

Stating the fare to the driver is the easiest and most reliable way of getting your fare.

Far too often, using any placename can be a gamble about whether the driver has an idea, even if you use one that is on the internal displays and on the voice displays. For example, "Redmond's Hill" is a place unknown to many drivers as is "Mespil Road"

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

But then this is the same company that sold off perfectly usable buses that UK companies and ones at home happily snapped up and put into service (I'm seeing quite a few early AVs still around the place), and then hiked fares in a declining market during a recession.

A lot of those early AVs were in excellent workable condition, sold purely by the number on their reg plate.

LXFlyer

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Bottom line is that LEAP card or not, public transport is still far too expensive, awkward, and unreliable to tempt people out of cars.

But then this is the same company that sold off perfectly usable buses that UK companies and ones at home happily snapped up and put into service (I'm seeing quite a few early AVs still around the place), and then hiked fares in a declining market during a recession.

Whatever about LUAS, DB remains the choice for those only with no better options.

Well I think you do have to accept that if people switched to LEAP, the fare increases were minimal over the original cash fares.

At the same time government funding was cut - there was a distinct move to try to shift more of the funding burden onto customers - especially season ticket holders.

It's all very well saying DB did this, DB did that, but politics has played a significant part in all of this.

All of those decisions that you are criticising in that post were actually made by the NTA and not Dublin Bus.

They decide on the PSO fleet age, fares etc.

Dublin Bus is the operator these days - the NTA is the regulator.

12 years is the industry norm for fleet replacement - I'm not sure I'd want to go back to the days of buses breaking down ad nauseum every day as they certainly used to when the fleets were older.

We all know that DB does not suit your commute, and I would be the first to agree about the lack of orbital services, but for plenty of people on radial routes it clearly does work.

_Kaiser_

dfx- wrote: »

A lot of those early AVs were in excellent workable condition, sold purely by the number on their reg plate.

From what I've seen and even read here they are still far superior to some of the gimmicky rubbish that's been purchased since.

lxflyer wrote:

12 years is the industry norm for fleet replacement - I'm not sure I'd want to go back to the days of buses breaking down ad nauseum every day as they certainly used to when the fleets were older.

Regardless of "industry norms" elsewhere, just because something is "old" doesn't mean you throw it away if there's no other reason to. Comparisons to the 70s and 80s when equipment was far older and less reliable generally is a bit of a fallacy, as evidenced by the fact that these early AV's (and indeed even older RH/A/V's) are still in daily service with new operators.

_Kaiser_

lxflyer wrote: »

All of those decisions that you are criticising in that post were actually made by the NTA and not Dublin Bus.

They decide on the PSO fleet age, fares etc.

Dublin Bus is the operator these days - the NTA is the regulator.

Must be great for one side to be able to shift the blame/responsibility to the other while the paying customer loses out

Do you think the average customer knows or gives a toss about which administration made which decision? All they see is increased fares for the same (or reduced) services.

Gimmicks like Wi-Fi and onboard announcements in Irish are grand if you have the fundamentals right, but DB/NTA/whoever!! have a lot more work to do in that regard first.

LXFlyer

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Must be great for one side to be able to shift the blame/responsibility to the other while the paying customer loses out

Do you think the average customer knows or gives a toss about which administration made which decision? All they see is increased fares for the same (or reduced) services.

Gimmicks like Wi-Fi and onboard announcements in Irish are grand if you have the fundamentals right, but DB/NTA/whoever!! have a lot more work to do in that regard first.

It's not about "shifting blame" but apportioning it correctly.

Well there is a fundamental issue here and that is the funding of public transport - for all the moaning you're doing here, the real problem is that no government is prepared to fund it adequately.

The announcements in Irish are an obligation under the OLA - there's no option out of that - can you point me to any Irish political party that has even hinted at abolishing that? While many people complain about it, no politicians seem to have expressed an interest in repealing that Act.

If the PSO subsidy is cut dramatically, what option is left but to increase fares if the companies are to remain solvent?

Frankly your beef is with the politicians on that one.

Many people (including myself) use the wifi and find that useful - times have changed and wifi is frankly something many people expect on public transport.

LXFlyer

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

From what I've seen and even read here they are still far superior to some of the gimmicky rubbish that's been purchased since.

Regardless of "industry norms" elsewhere, just because something is "old" doesn't mean you throw it away if there's no other reason to. Comparisons to the 70s and 80s when equipment was far older and less reliable generally is a bit of a fallacy, as evidenced by the fact that these early AV's (and indeed even older RH/A/V's) are still in daily service with new operators.

If you are going to encourage people to use public transport, you need a modern fleet.

12 years is long enough to warrant replacement, as I said it is the industry norm and that does count for something. and I certainly don't view that as an issue. I'd far prefer to see the fleet kept updated.

The Olympians were disposed of as there was a need to have a fully accessible fleet.

_Kaiser_

lxflyer wrote: »

It's not about "shifting blame" but apportioning it correctly.

Well there is a fundamental issue here and that is the funding of public transport - for all the moaning you're doing here, the real problem is that no government is prepared to fund it adequately.

When they're throwing away perfectly good vehicles for no other reason than they're (supposedly) "old" I'd say the issue isn't necessarily funding but how it's spent - include staff wages and positions in that.

The announcements in Irish are an obligation under the OLA - there's no option out of that - can you point me to any Irish political party that has even hinted at abolishing that? While many people complain about it, no politicians seem to have expressed an interest in repealing that Act.

Many people (including myself) use the wifi and find that useful - times have changed and wifi is frankly something many people expect on public transport.

And as I said above these are all fine if you have the core service running correctly.. but we managed for decades without announcements without any issues with the OLA, and WiFi, while nice to have, is hardly an essential in a country where you can get 15GB+ of data for €20 per month with no contract.

I think most people would rather see the money used to improve the actual reliability of the service first and then worry about these "frills" later.

Seve OB

I was just wondering if you state your fare or state your destination when you getting board.

No real interest in the state of the fleet, company, nta, db, av, rh, Wi-Fi, GB, OLA, blah blah.

Thanks to those who did respond though, seems to me like it's 50/50. So good to know you can still get on and ask for the fare like the good old days. Shame it's not 25 pence anymore though

LXFlyer

Seve OB wrote: »

I was just wondering if you state your fare or state your destination when you getting board.

No real interest in the state of the fleet, company, nta, db, av, rh, Wi-Fi, GB, OLA, blah blah.

Thanks to those who did respond though, seems to me like it's 50/50. So good to know you can still get on and ask for the fare like the good old days. Shame it's not 25 pence anymore though

Yes once you know the fare, you can of course still ask for it.

I used to state the destination, until a driver lost the rag with me and asked me if it was €1.40 or €1.90 (as it was at the time). I told him he should know his own route.

I have noticed a lot of the time that if I request a €1.50 fare, I'll be asked where I'm going. Presumably because it doesn't usually get you very far.

coylemj

Karsini wrote: »

I used to state the destination, until a driver lost the rag with me and asked me if it was €1.40 or €1.90 (as it was at the time). I told him he should know his own route.

Bad hair day? I hear people boarding all the time and a lot of them state a destination, never heard anyone getting anything like that abuse.

Karsini wrote: »

I have noticed a lot of the time that if I request a €1.50 fare, I'll be asked where I'm going. Presumably because it doesn't usually get you very far.

€1.50 covers a journey of up to 3 stages so for example on the 46A it would only get you from D'Olier St. to Leeson St. bridge.

When you state a destination or a fare, the driver presses one of a set of buttons on his machine, I'm guessing that when you state a destination, he presses the button showing the stage point beyond your intended destination if your destination is not listed as a stage point, that fare is then deducted from your Leap card.

If your journey is >13 stages you should validate against the reader on the right so the vast majority of fares paid when slapping your Leap card on the driver's reader would be €2.05 as that covers 4 to 13 stages inclusive. Most of my trips involve a €2.05 deduction on the driver's reader so I just ask for that fare and it's never been questioned.

punisher5112

It's Real easy state fare and destination then no problems.

I find a lot are trying the 1.50 to go all the way or most of it.

LXFlyer

The reason many drivers will ask where people are going when they ask for a €1.50 fare is that it's the lowest fare, and unfortunately there is that element of the population out there that will try to get away with asking for that fare regardless of where they are going.