DIY AI, Economics of it??

Conelan

Hi All,
Part time suckler farmer here and just wondered about yer opinions on what size of herd would ye say would be minimum to make DIY AI worthwhile? Have 20 cows calving here each year and so far managing to work with the local AI technician but being part time it isn't easy. DIY sounds ideal as insemination could be done earlier/later to suit work life better. Any opinions or costings would be great.
Thanks

ganmo

Look at the syncing AI option also

from the IGA beef conference this year

His second trial focused on breeding management and the use of AI. He examined the use of synchronisation and fixed-time AI on over 2,205 cows. He compared the cost of using a stock bull, which was €52 per cow per year for a 30-cow suckler herd. While using synchronisation with fixed-time AI on a herd of the same size cost between €47 and €62 per cow per year.

Milked out

Between the course and Ai equipment it cones to circa 1000 I think, may be cheaper. Would advise against getting a secondhand flask unless you knew for a fact it was never empty of liquid N. To keep topped up for the year with liquid N is 190 or so. After that it's the handiness as you say and the arm or service fee you save. What's the service charge for Ai man, is it a tenner per cow and is there a call out fee as well? So say for the 20 cows 1.5 straws per cow would be 30 serves that be 300 each year anyway saved. Advantages are you could do washouts as well after training, have whatever straws you want in your own pot. Disadvantage would be initial year or two settling into it to build confidence and initial outlay

patsy_mccabe

Is it easy do AI? I get the feeling it is a very hard thing to master. Have you ever tried getting on calving ropes onto a calf that is well inside a cow? I'd imagine it is something like that.

Milked out

Tbh some take to it straight away, others take time and some not at all. It took a bit of confidence to build up for me, but I was never short of practice. Do all my own here, get Ai man if I'm gone for wkend or have a lot on. I'd say go for it and do the course. There are practical days so you will get practice in.
It's not like getting ropes on a calf at all, the cervix is flexible and generally curved and basically u try to manipulate it to try and get the gun through it. Cervix may be the width of a tag pen in a heifer or a tumbler glass in an older cow or depending on how long calved she is

tanko

Milked out wrote: »

Tbh some take to it straight away, others take time and some not at all. It took a bit of confidence to build up for me, but I was never short of practice. Do all my own here, get Ai man if I'm gone for wkend or have a lot on. I'd say go for it and do the course. There are practical days so you will get practice in.
It's not like getting ropes on a calf at all, the cervix is flexible and generally curved and basically u try to manipulate it to try and get the gun through it. Cervix may be the width of a tag pen in a heifer or a tumbler glass in an older cow or depending on how long calved she is

+1
Plenty of practice, once you get confident at it you'll do it without even thinking about what you're doing.
I still find some heifers hard enough to do and sometimes get the local Ai man to do them. Do you find them trickier than cows?

Milked out

tanko wrote: »

Milked out wrote: »

Tbh some take to it straight away, others take time and some not at all. It took a bit of confidence to build up for me, but I was never short of practice. Do all my own here, get Ai man if I'm gone for wkend or have a lot on. I'd say go for it and do the course. There are practical days so you will get practice in.
It's not like getting ropes on a calf at all, the cervix is flexible and generally curved and basically u try to manipulate it to try and get the gun through it. Cervix may be the width of a tag pen in a heifer or a tumbler glass in an older cow or depending on how long calved she is

+1
Plenty of practice, once you get confident at it you'll do it without even thinking about what you're doing.
I still find some heifers hard enough to do and sometimes get the local Ai man to do them. Do you find them trickier than cows?

Yeah I find heifers a bit more difficult, my own patience improving was probably the thing that improved it. There may always be one every year for whatever reason I can't get. Some heifers then there is no bother. I Ai once a day when outside, and when heifers are inside I Ai when I see them have a locking gate in pen with them.

carrollsno1

Rough outline of the cost for beef Ai here at home with technician only do about 8 cows this year most weve done in a few years stockbull with the rest €27 (i think) for first serve and €8 for repeat up to 2nd repeat i think how much are the straws going to cost you to buy for your own flask i dont know but it would definitly cost more than €8 for your repeats im not knocking DIY AI i done the course and would love to do it but im not ina position to do it at the moment unfortunatly as its a skill i dont want to lose

J.O. Farmer

Milked out wrote: »

Between the course and Ai equipment it cones to circa 1000 I think, may be cheaper. Would advise against getting a secondhand flask unless you knew for a fact it was never empty of liquid N. To keep topped up for the year with liquid N is 190 or so. After that it's the handiness as you say and the arm or service fee you save. What's the service charge for Ai man, is it a tenner per cow and is there a call out fee as well? So say for the 20 cows 1.5 straws per cow would be 30 serves that be 300 each year anyway saved.

It's 300 saved but then you deduct the 190 to keep the flask topped up so it's really only 110 saved and with the 1000 initial setup costs it'll take 9 years to pay back.
With those numbers the economics are not the reason for diy AI. The convenience is a better reason.

Conelan

Thanks all,
Yeah it looks like its a case of putting a value on the convenience side of it so and doing a bit more searching about the course and equipment costs. "Milked Out" could I just ask, if I was trained and set up how does the ordering of straws work?? do you collect or someone deliver? is there a limit like so many per cow? assuming tank is kept topped up is there a lifespan on the straws? can you get straws from any of the AI companies or do you stay with the company you do the training with? Thanks in advance for any answers.

50HX

i'd be slow to invest

like a lot of things AI is an art, i know plenty of fella's that tried and failed

to be a good AI technician with good conception rates it takes years of practice

you can order as many straws as you want, munster, bova etc will deliver or you can collect from the stations, buy whatever from whoever you want

straws will last for years as long as the tank is kept topped up and there is no pulling out of straws and touching them with bare hands to see what they are - keep each pot labelled

i think the bigger question is your part time suckler farming ( like most suckler farmers inc myself) how feasible is AI in the first place with respect to spotting heat - unless you have someone at home to do it for you

your looking at 4 times a day checks to spot heats

bogman_bass

Have you a good technician in your area? If so stick with him. When you have a pot the temptation is to buy a bit of this and a bit of that and end up with more straws than you can use

j banks

Did Ai course a few years back ,picked up technique fairly quickly. Did course with Genexel found yer man to b an excellent teacher, he reckoned lads that were good with their hands ie handy picked it up easily. A bit of practice and you'll get it no problem economics of it up to your self figures quoted above are bang on

patsy_mccabe

The guy that does AI for me is retiring this year. Same guy now for 10 years or so. Sound man and never a problem with him. Very few repeats.
Hope his replacement is as good.