How hygienic is your local hospital ?

Impetus

How hygienic is your local hospital or nursing home?

I came across this 'checklist' published by the California Dept of Public Health.
http://tinyurl.com/cleanhospitals

In times of financial cutbacks, cleaning standards are likely to be under pressure. This implies a growth in hospital acquired diseases.

This document looks at virtually every source of transfer of bacteria, viruses, fungi, etc - covering every likely contact point and the required procedure to keep them safe.

Guy:Incognito

It hasnt killed me. What more can I ask of a hospital?

bodice ripper

My local hospital is the Lourdes in Drogheda, and I wouldn't go in there with two X chromosomes, regardless of the hygiene.

Berserker

Impetus wrote: »

In times of financial cutbacks, cleaning standards are likely to be under pressure.

I wouldn't agree with you on that. The hospitals were far cleaner a few decades ago when the amount of money pumped into the healthcare system was far less. Staff need to take the time to follow the cleaning procedures properly, instead of rolling out the old "that's not my job" line, sponsored by their trade union of choice. I go to the Hermitage in Dublin myself and whilst the level hygiene isn't that bad, it's not great.

The Backwards Man

When I was wee, hospitals smelled of Jeyes Fluid and Dettol. Nowadays they smell of Guinness farts and bad feet.

Impetus

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

It hasnt killed me. What more can I ask of a hospital?

And you crossed the road yesterday, without being involved in a motor accident.

Lucky you. One wonders what the statistics for hospital acquired diseases look like? By statistics I mean real hard numbers - not massaged numbers to make performance look better than the reality.

Aside from being discharged alive, one wonders how many people are being given antibiotics to prevent/kill hospital acquired diseases? Especially broad spectrum antibiotics. The world is running out of antibiotic solutions to illness, as bacteria become immune to even the strongest antibiotics. Antibiotic abuse is partially driven by dirty hospitals.

Also broad spectrum antibiotics can destroy the good bacteria in the stomach, leading to fungal infestation over the entire body. Which can take years to get rid of using lots of expensive medicines and restrictive diets. eg Candida albicans.

galljga1

The Backwards Man wrote: »

When I was wee, hospitals smelled of Jeyes Fluid and Dettol. Nowadays they smell of Guinness farts and bad feet.

That's only when you're there.

corner of hells

Berserker wrote: »

I wouldn't agree with you on that. The hospitals were far cleaner a few decades ago when the amount of money pumped into the healthcare system was far less. Staff need to take the time to follow the cleaning procedures properly, instead of rolling out the old "that's not my job" line, sponsored by their trade union of choice. I go to the Hermitage in Dublin myself and whilst the level hygiene isn't that bad, it's not great.

Tis alright. . The rabbits are great entertainment in the early morning too.

Impetus

Berserker wrote: »

I wouldn't agree with you on that. The hospitals were far cleaner a few decades ago when the amount of money pumped into the healthcare system was far less. Staff need to take the time to follow the cleaning procedures properly, instead of rolling out the old "that's not my job" line, sponsored by their trade union of choice. I go to the Hermitage in Dublin myself and whilst the level hygiene isn't that bad, it's not great.

I'd agree. Back in the day when most hospitals were managed by nuns, rather than civil servants, Irish hospitals were clean places. It is not a function of money if the motivation is there. But I suspect that the restriction of money is being used as an excuse to cut back, which sometimes may mean cleaning. Please read the checklist http://tinyurl.com/cleanhospitals - cleaning requires a very thorough approach.

Wibbs

They were far more sterile places in decades past. They simply had to be, before the widespread use of antibiotics came along. You can even see that in the design of the old ones. Walls that meet floors with a curved surface, the easier to keep clean and more hard surfaces full stop.

Sh1tbag OToole

California can go f**k itself. Everything causes cancer there anyway and it's full of tech hipsters with a screenful of JavaSh1t infront of them paying $6,000/mo for a shoebox apartment

Impetus

Sh1tbag OToole wrote: »

California can go f**k itself. Everything causes cancer there anyway and it's full of tech hipsters with a screenful of JavaSh1t infront of them paying $6,000/mo for a shoebox apartment

I can't see the connection with cancer. Most cancers are not caused by dirty hospitals.

Impetus

A few links to info on Hospital infections in IRL:


http://www.hpsc.ie/A-Z/MicrobiologyAntimicrobialResistance/InfectionControlandHAI/Surveillance/HPSCSurveillance/File,15278,en.pdf


http://www.hpsc.ie/A-Z/MicrobiologyAntimicrobialResistance/InfectionControlandHAI/Surveillance/HospitalPointPrevalenceSurveys/2012/PPS2012ReportsforIreland/File,13788,en.pdf


http://www.hpsc.ie/A-Z/MicrobiologyAntimicrobialResistance/InfectionControlandHAI/Surveillance/

Impetus

An MIT article on using Viruses to kill bacteria (rather than using antibiotics).

https://www.technologyreview.com/s/409905/using-viruses-to-kill-bacteria/

Superbugs infect more than 1.2 million patients a year in the US.....

hairyslug

I've been put in quarantine in two different hospitals, both times with the same infection. First time, I was in a locked room, no visitors and docs came into me in something resembling a hazmat suit, 2nd time round, I was given a mask and when it was time for my ward to be cleaned, I was wheeled out into the open area of the hospital

When matrons were in charge of hygiene in British hospitals, every ward had it's own full-time cleaner. When cleaning was outsourced to cut costs and contracts given to the best-priced instead of the best practice, that's when standards began to plummet.

I don't know if cleaning is outsourced or partially outsourced in Irish hospitals, but I suspect it is.

K-9

The Backwards Man wrote: »

When I was wee, hospitals smelled of Jeyes Fluid and Dettol. Nowadays they smell of Guinness farts and bad feet.

That would be the Nuns, somebody had to mention them!

Letterkenny isn't bad, the 2 floods cleaned it out.

milehip

K-9 wrote: »

That would be the Nuns, somebody had to mention them!

Letterkenny isn't bad, the 2 floods cleaned it out.

Aye they were devils for the porter!

uck51js9zml2yt

St James and the mater are fine.
Wouldnt go near beaumount . Its safer to sleep in a landfill.

Impetus

hairyslug wrote: »

I was given a mask and when it was time for my ward to be cleaned, I was wheeled out into the open area of the hospital

A chain (of medical / bio security safety) is as strong as its weakest link.

Wards are another issue. Contagiously sick people should be in private rooms to prevent the spread of whatever ails you. The Irish hospital 'system' does not have enough private rooms to accommodate this issue.

The Dutch medical system has reduced hospital acquired infections by increasing the number of private rooms.

Hospitals should be there to heal illness. It seems to me that the debate in Ireland is focused on private -v- pubic based on some form of twisted British class war view of the world.

Impetus

Candie wrote: »

When matrons were in charge of hygiene in British hospitals, every ward had it's own full-time cleaner. When cleaning was outsourced to cut costs and contracts given to the best-priced instead of the best practice, that's when standards began to plummet.

I don't know if cleaning is outsourced or partially outsourced in Irish hospitals, but I suspect it is.

While it is good to focus on cleaning responsibility like you mention, wards are bad when it comes to contagious diseases. 19th century technology.

Aside from that, it takes a lot more than clean floors etc to keep a hospital environment safe. Please read http://tinyurl.com/cleanhospitals

Impetus

Impetus wrote: »

Aside from that, it takes a lot more than clean floors etc to keep a hospital environment safe. Please read http://tinyurl.com/cleanhospitals

Cleaning operatives should be properly trained in all aspects of cleaning, disinfection and sterilization, and I never suggested that clean floors was all it took to contain disease.

Badly Drunk Boy

Will somebody please read http://tinyurl.com/cleanhospitals ?!?!?!

Badly Drunk Boy

Badly Drunk Boy wrote: »

Will somebody please read http://tinyurl.com/cleanhospitals ?!?!?!

It's almost like people already know about the issues and this isn't the first they've heard of it.

foggy_lad

St Lukes Hospital in Kilkenny has to be one of the dirtiest hospitals in the country. People from the area get transferred from Dublin hospitals well on the mend and after a few days in this awful death house they usually get infections requiring them to be returned to the original hospital they were in.

Physiotherapy does not exist for most patients as it is almost 100% geared towards geriatric patients. hygiene is poor despite the best efforts of staff, the main issue being that geriatric patients are kept on wards with other surgical patients and the older patients are usually incontinent and there is a far greater risk from them for other surgical patients.

Impetus

Candie wrote: »

It's almost like people already know about the issues and this isn't the first they've heard of it.

The more you know, the more you don't know.

PARlance

Walked into Castlebar hospital a few weeks ago and was greeted by the dirtiest lobby I've ever seen. Rubbish, newspapers, spilt coffee cups, general dirt all over the place.

It was 9:30am on a weekday, you could almost forgive it if it was the early hours of a busy weekend.

Impetus

foggy_lad wrote: »

St Lukes Hospital in Kilkenny has to be one of the dirtiest hospitals in the country. People from the area get transferred from Dublin hospitals well on the mend and after a few days in this awful death house they usually get infections requiring them to be returned to the original hospital they were in.

Physiotherapy does not exist for most patients as it is almost 100% geared towards geriatric patients. hygiene is poor despite the best efforts of staff, the main issue being that geriatric patients are kept on wards with other surgical patients and the older patients are usually incontinent and there is a far greater risk from them for other surgical patients.

It seems to me that (simplistically) there are two classes of patients. Those who are ill, old, infirm etc but who are not contagiously ill. The old are more receptive to many bacteria and viruses spread by the contagiously ill people. There needs to be separation. A firewall. If you have a broken leg, typically you are not a threat to anybody else from a biological infection perspective.

Then there is the contagiously ill, who need extra isolation, strict hygiene procedures etc. to prevent the spread of disease.

Corruptedmorals

There was a fun article a few years back that listed the amount of times various hospitals had to call out pest control companies, made for unpleasant reading.

I'd love to see statistics on hospital-acquired infections in Tallaght. Their obstacle course of dry soap in front of the main entrance is genius, I always see people using it that I'd expect to charge by it. All hospitals should have the same.

The hospital I work in is extremely old. It's very clean and thankfully isn't acute with usually very short inpatient stays.

My name is URL

Lourdes is my local hospital too. It's not great

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/hospital-patients-given-baby-wipes-to-clean-themselves-34744514.html

That's from just a few days ago, for example

Hospital patients given baby wipes to clean themselves

Our Lady of Lourdes Hospital in Drogheda has apologised to patients and their families after water leaked through the ceilings of some of its wards.

Impetus

Corruptedmorals wrote: »

I'd love to see statistics on hospital-acquired infections in Tallaght. Their obstacle course of dry soap in front of the main entrance is genius, I always see people using it that I'd expect to charge by it. All hospitals should have the same.

Public toilet facilities should be contactless everywhere. Hospitals, airports etc. No door handles - ideally no doors. Soap should be dispensed automatically on hand detection, underneath the nozzle. Taps should not require to be switched on or off, especially with the hand. The water temperature should be low (to save energy and avoid scalding, and bacteria spread). The water in Dublin Airport T2 is above hand hot, and wastes energy.

Paper towels are best. The worst, in terms of spreading contamination are air dryers, especially those of the air blade variety, without uv sterilization. They spread hand bugs all over a shared toilet environment

Toilets should have UV lights to disinfect them when they are not occupied. All it takes is one or more ultra-violet lamps and a motion detector and time switch. UV light kills bugs without the need for chemicals. In the same way as a beach in a typical Caribbean island is bug free. The UV from the sun is a great disinfectant.

Speaking of airport toilets, Irish airport toilets are particularly filthy. It paints a picture to me as a visiting Irish person. No doubt the same to a tourist or business traveller. Urine on the floor in a gents toilets. Badly designed, cheapo urinals. No paper towels option. Door contact on entry and exist at many locations. Smell. Compare and contrast with other airports - where the toilets are generally spotless - eg Paris CDG, Rome FCO, Zurich, Copenhagen, and Amsterdam and Barcelona to a lesser extent.

It wasnt me123

Hospitals should enforce the visiting hours - stop having heaps of people wandering all over the place - impossible to keep wards clean and tidy when there are constantly visitors in and out.

My local hospital is South Tipperary General Hospital and its a cess pit - constantly on the list of dirtiest hospitals and I know of at least 3 people that have caught serious infections there, one almost died.

milehip

PARlance wrote: »

Walked into Castlebar hospital a few weeks ago and was greeted by the dirtiest lobby I've ever seen. Rubbish, newspapers, spilt coffee cups, general dirt all over the place.

It was 9:30am on a weekday, you could almost forgive it if it was the early hours of a busy weekend.

In fairness the few occuations Ive been in Castlebar I found it reasonable,and from what you saw it could have been somewhat prevented by people binning their own waste.