Will the phone upgrade treadmill ever stop?

Sh1tbag OToole

Not so long ago I was using a PC that was made 10 years ago and it was still quite usable. Have a laptop that is 8 years old but it is starting to fall apart now.

Phones and tablets though are a different story, after two years they usually fall apart, can't be updated and generally become crap. This is how it used to be to some extent with PC's and laptops as well but things have improved as far as I can see.

Still a far cry from the analogue phone system, where you can just plug in a 80-year old phone and make a call on it. I hate spending a load of money every few years to get a palm-sized device that looks the same as the old one simply because the old one became unusable.

Will we ever get to the point where the physical limit of what can be packed into a phone is reached or where the devices are just 'good enough' and there is no point in packing more in? The death of Moore's law has been looming for years but each time it draws close Intel brings out another box of new technology from it's basement and all the other manufacturers play catch-up

Kidchameleon

3d processors will be a fad for a few years. Physical phones will disapear eventually (10 years or so) replaced by overlay glases. These glases will then give way to ocular implants. All processing will be done remotely

Your Face

Man is obsolete.

Alf Stewart.

I remember when this whole site was just empty megabitings.

Dirty Dingus McGee

You don't have to buy a new style phone.

I have a normal mobile phone that you just make calls and texts on.No amount of new technology is going to make a phone like that obsolete.

briany

I've been waiting for modular phones to come out for a while but the whole thing seems to be stuck in limbo as far as a worldwide rollout is concerned. I'm one of those people who thinks that phones are designed to fail on you in one way or another, a good example of planned obsolescence. Project Aura is promising with basically building a phone out of 'blocks' as is the Raspberry Pi phone projects I see around the Internet.

the evasion_kid

Your Face wrote: »

Man is obsolete.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkyUMmNl4hk

Riesen_Meal

I must be 3 years with my Nexus 5 phone at this stage, when I originally payed 350 or whatever quid for it I said to myself if it lasts 3 years I'll be happy, and it has - I can't afford another phone at the moment if it were to die...

My 8 year old Macbook gave up the ghost a few weeks ago, purchased second hand, I had it 3 or 4 years...

I had an Acer laptop that lasted about 7 years previous to that...

I think the last thing I bought that went tits up was a launch day Xbox 360

Soooooo, I need a new Mac (for music nowt else) and maybe a phone when this eventually dies a death...

FortySeven

If the battery was easily replaced I would happily keep this HTC one forever.

kneemos

Kidchameleon wrote: »

3d processors will be a fad for a few years. Physical phones will disapear eventually (10 years or so) replaced by overlay glases. These glases will then give way to ocular implants. All processing will be done remotely

Always either 10 or 20 years for the big innovation.


Just buy Samsung,they last forever.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

Everyone says oh iPhones are a pile of ****e. I got my first iPhone in 2008. I changed it to an new iPhone in 2012. I had the screen replaced and the battery replaced and the phone is good as new. There's not a scratch on it. I'll change it in sept/oct when the new iPhone comes out but in 8 years I've had two phones.

Oedo

Do a factory reset and your phone will probably be as good as new (excusing the scratches and scuffs).

My phone was becoming very laggy and slow and I factory reset it and it's nice and fast again.

kavanada

^^^Trig?! 😉

RobertKK

My iPhone 6 plus fell onto the ground last December and the screen is cracked in several places, but it works perfectly.
I didn't bother getting it repaired as it will be cheaper to wait and get an upgrade.

endacl

RobertKK wrote: »

it will be cheaper to wait and get an upgrade.

Sincerely doubt it, depending on plan and contract.

Eugene Norman

I change every two years. Obsolescence because technology is getting better is a good thing. The only reason you would keep a MacBook from 2010 is because of the slowdown in moores law.

That's bad news.

entropi

As much as Moore's Law continues to stand, if quantum computing ever makes it to handheld devices (if they'll even exist at the same time that is), that may just stop such upgrades, save for design changes.

PirateShampoo

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Everyone says oh iPhones are a pile of ****e. I got my first iPhone in 2008. I changed it to an new iPhone in 2012. I had the screen replaced and the battery replaced and the phone is good as new. There's not a scratch on it. I'll change it in sept/oct when the new iPhone comes out but in 8 years I've had two phones.

Think technically you've had 3.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

:rolleyes:

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Think technically you've had 3.

No?
iPhone 3.
iPhone 5.
Waiting for the iPhone 7.

Dropped my phone and smashed a screen
Battery wasn't staying charged so I changed the battery (after 3 years).

2.

tomwaterford

RobertKK wrote: »

My iPhone 6 plus fell onto the ground last December and the screen is cracked in several places, but it works perfectly.
I didn't bother getting it repaired as it will be cheaper to wait and get an upgrade.

It's chaeap enough for a screen


I'm after getting several

PirateShampoo

LexieOnRale wrote: »

:rolleyes:


No?
iPhone 3.
iPhone 5.
Waiting for the iPhone 7.

Dropped my phone and smashed a screen
Battery wasn't staying charged so I changed the battery (after 3 years).

2.

Is it really the same phone after you've changed the battery and screen?

It's a bit like getting your Noes and Tits done trying to pass them off as your old ones.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

Well here, If I can change a screen and a battery every 3/4 years and not have to upgrade, even better!

Gunslinger92

Mr.S wrote: »

I change phones every year or less, between upgrades and buying outright and reselling, you never spend that much money. Plus it's nice to have the latest over priced smartphone YET still no phone has a decent ****ing battery.

Sigh.

I find the battery life on the iPhone 6s excellent

Zillah

In September I'll have had my Galaxy Note 3 for 3 years. Once I was finished the mandatory 2 year contract I dropped it down to 25 quid a month. Battery is still great. I feel pretty much zero desire to upgrade - phones haven't done a single new thing in years. I am not spending 600 quid for a phone that will possess advantages that exist only on paper.

Gonna run this thing into the ground.

endacl

Zillah wrote: »

In September I'll have had my Galaxy Note 3 for 3 years. Once I was finished the mandatory 2 year contract I dropped it down to 25 quid a month. Battery is still great. I feel pretty much zero desire to upgrade - phones haven't done a single new thing in years. I am not spending 600 quid for a phone that will possess advantages that exist only on paper.

Gonna run this thing into the ground.

Same with my 4s. Don't want to upgrade because a 4s is a good size for a phone. I don't want a pocket telly.

When this dies, I'll be downgrading to the dumbest of dumb phones. Something I only have to charge once a week. At which point I'll lose the data plan, the monthly bill will be even cheaper, and I won't waste so much time on here.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

endacl

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Not this consumer. I want a 'phone'. Useful features to include, and be limited to:
1. Make and take calls.
2. Send and receive text messages.
3. More than a days battery life from a charge.
4. No... That's it really....

riclad

Buy an android phone ,you can change the battery ,put in an sd card .
my phone is a year old,
it does everything .
I see new phones ,with special camera modes,hdr photos etc etc
A 5 inch android phone can do anything .
I see no reason to buy a new phone every year.
iphones are a status symbol ,
and if you want the new os to run fast you might want a new phone,
plus there apple fans who just buy anything apple makes .
140 Euro will get you a good phone that,ll last 3 years at least .
I see no need to get the latest os ,by buying a new phone .
I used an iphone,
i see no big difference between android vs apple ,
apart from you cant remove the battery in an iphone.
phones are like laptops ,
a 2 year old phone,laptop is powerful enough for most people

Eugene Norman

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Is it really the same phone after you've changed the battery and screen?

It's a bit like getting your Noes and Tits done trying to pass them off as your old ones.

It's the same phone with a new screen and a battery. stupid argument. It's like saying somebody who replaced his car battery and wind screen has a new car.

Eugene Norman

endacl wrote: »

Not this consumer. I want a 'phone'. Useful features to include, and be limited to:
1. Make and take calls.
2. Send and receive text messages.
3. More than a days battery life from a charge.
4. No... That's it really....

The problem is calling these computer devices in our hands "phones". You have a phone, most people don't.

Winterlong

I love new sh1t so I do.

For Forks Sake

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Everyone says oh iPhones are a pile of ****e. I got my first iPhone in 2008. I changed it to an new iPhone in 2012. I had the screen replaced and the battery replaced and the phone is good as new. There's not a scratch on it. I'll change it in sept/oct when the new iPhone comes out but in 8 years I've had two phones.

You have a case of Triggers Broom going on there. If the phone was as good as new it's still have it's original components aboard.

tomwaterford

For Forks Sake wrote: »

You have a case of Triggers Broom going on there. If the phone was as good as new it's still have it's original components aboard.

Such as its memory/hard drive??? (or whatever you call what works the phone)

Pac1Man

If the guts of the phone is the same, it's the same phone. The battery and arguably the screen could be classed as consumables.

Sh1tbag OToole

Eugene Norman wrote: »

I change every two years. Obsolescence because technology is getting better is a good thing. The only reason you would keep a MacBook from 2010 is because of the slowdown in moores law.

That's bad news.

It isn't, I always had a hunch that Intel had a stockpile of 30 years or more of tech pretty much ready to be rolled out sitting in their basement, releasing it only as fast as AMD and the lads making ARM chips forced them to.

Each time something new comes out I just wonder "why the hell couldn't they make that 2 years ago, or 10?"

Sh1tbag OToole

Pac1Man wrote: »

If the guts of the phone is the same, it's the same phone. The battery and arguably the screen could be classed as consumables.

A battery is a consumable item with a limited cycle life time of about 500 or so. I don't know how you would consume a screen unless you use it for 10 years and it becomes too dim (although AMOLED seems to have cut this down to far fewer years), most screens that have to be replaced are smashed by the owner.

Cienciano

endacl wrote: »

Not this consumer. I want a 'phone'. Useful features to include, and be limited to:
1. Make and take calls.
2. Send and receive text messages.
3. More than a days battery life from a charge.
4. No... That's it really....

You forgot:
5. Stream an xhamster video in at least 720p and no sound comes from the phones speakers cos your headphones are in and you're in the jacks.
6. Handy google maps locations of gloryholes in dublin.

As long as my phone can do that, I'm happy

uch

I still use a Nokia 3210, only problem is you cant stick in yer jox as it doesn't vibrate

Pac1Man

Sh1tbag OToole wrote: »

A battery is a consumable item with a limited cycle life time of about 500 or so. I don't know how you would consume a screen unless you use it for 10 years and it becomes too dim (although AMOLED seems to have cut this down to far fewer years), most screens that have to be replaced are smashed by the owner.

That's why I said arguably. It's not unlikely that a screen may be smashed during it's lifetime.

KomradeBishop

The main thing driving phone upgrades, I think is the way that phone operating systems and program developers, deliberately obsolete old operating systems - with the superficial bells and whistles of new operating systems, pushing the limits of an old phones hardware, before any program tries to use up anything - and programs which require bugger all resources, which provide an incredibly simple service which can easily work on anything, demanding the latest operating system when there's no need.

The operating systems (in the case of Android) also seem to be designed to have a very weird memory management system, which keeps enough crud around or in the wrong place in memory, to gradually use up your resources unnecessarily.

Phones don't have the long-term-stability that desktop computer OS's have - yet they should.

Phone's don't do anything all that special. There are almost no programs for a phone, that are resource hungry enough, to really require updated hardware - not unless you want to play e.g. resource heavy games.

Most of the things a phone can do, most of the programs you have, can work almost as well as just a web page, not a program - things such as the Facebook app, literally spy on your microphone in order to target advertising to you, and many others waste your resources in various ways.

If you know how to clean crud off of your computer - e.g. Autoruns, Process Explorer - there's no reason you can't do the same with your phone, using equivalent tools. I didn't want a smartphone, but since I was given one as a gift 3 years ago, I reckon I can make it last at least 6-8 years.

Capt'n Midnight

endacl wrote: »

Not this consumer. I want a 'phone'. Useful features to include, and be limited to:
1. Make and take calls.
2. Send and receive text messages.
3. More than a days battery life from a charge.
4. No... That's it really....

Scrounge an old Nokia, budget a fiver for a new battery to be on the safe side.

You'll easily get a week from a charge.


At the moment 3 are offering 4G phones.
I might be tempted except they can't even offer 3G service in parts of Dublin :rolleyes:

Sh1tbag OToole

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Scrounge an old Nokia, budget a fiver for a new battery to be on the safe side.

You'll easily get a week from a charge.


At the moment 3 are offering 4G phones.
I might be tempted except they can't even offer 3G service in parts of Dublin :rolleyes:

They should re-release the 3310 with support for 4G networks

Capt'n Midnight

entropi wrote: »

As much as Moore's Law continues to stand, if quantum computing ever makes it to handheld devices (if they'll even exist at the same time that is), that may just stop such upgrades, save for design changes.

I won't hold my breath for quantum computing , still don't understand how it can magically solve stuff , and even if it could how it could sole it using so few bits.

Moore's law is still here in sense of the original transistor count doubling time. What's happened is that clock speeds haven't gone up in the last decade. In the past smaller transistors were faster. Now heat and capacitance are problems. The recent performance increase are chips have gotten smarter so take less clock cycles to do stuff and more cores so can multi-task and memory has gotten faster too.

There is still good mileage in silicon and it will still be used as a substrate if a new technology is developed. Satellite TV has been using 11GHZ for yonks now and Saorsat is on 22GHz so magic could happen.

Amateur radio is allowed use 250GHz https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1-millimeter_band

Sh1tbag OToole

KomradeBishop wrote: »

The main thing driving phone upgrades, I think is the way that phone operating systems and program developers, deliberately obsolete old operating systems - with the superficial bells and whistles of new operating systems, pushing the limits of an old phones hardware, before any program tries to use up anything - and programs which require bugger all resources, which provide an incredibly simple service which can easily work on anything, demanding the latest operating system when there's no need.

The operating systems (in the case of Android) also seem to be designed to have a very weird memory management system, which keeps enough crud around or in the wrong place in memory, to gradually use up your resources unnecessarily.

Phones don't have the long-term-stability that desktop computer OS's have - yet they should.

Phone's don't do anything all that special. There are almost no programs for a phone, that are resource hungry enough, to really require updated hardware - not unless you want to play e.g. resource heavy games.

Most of the things a phone can do, most of the programs you have, can work almost as well as just a web page, not a program - things such as the Facebook app, literally spy on your microphone in order to target advertising to you, and many others waste your resources in various ways.

If you know how to clean crud off of your computer - e.g. Autoruns, Process Explorer - there's no reason you can't do the same with your phone, using equivalent tools. I didn't want a smartphone, but since I was given one as a gift 3 years ago, I reckon I can make it last at least 6-8 years.

Computers used to be the same in the 90's. You'd have to buy a new one to run the latest version of Word that didn't do a whole lot extra to the previous version, but it supported the new DOC format that all the cool kids were using.

Yet eventually it calmed down. You can pick up a Core 2 Duo computer from the mid 2000's and still use it away grand for everyday stuff. If you tried the same with a PC from 1995 and 1985 the one from 85 would be an antique in comparison

snubbleste

uch wrote: »

I still use a Nokia 3210, only problem is you cant stick in yer jox as it doesn't vibrate

nokia 3200 here :cool:
Battery lasts 5 days after 12 years! It vibrates and get this, you can just insert your own paper designs as the cover. It has internet and a basic camera also.
Most cool

Superhorse

Have my HTC 5 years now and replaced the battery 3 times at 25 quid a pop. Very happy with that considering the abuse it gets. Had it mounted on my motorbike as a sat nav in Northern Spain only recently and it fell off at 130klms an hour bouncing down the road in it's silicone cover and still works fine today. Brilliant piece of kit but for the life of me I can't understand people who change their phone every other year for the latest thing at 600 euro a go seems madness.

Discodog

My Nexus 5 is two years old. I have no desire to change it because it does everything I need perfectly. I have adjusted to the relatively poor battery life.

I recently got a 5 inch Chinese smartphone for a friend. It was €100 & surprisingly good. We are brand obsessed. In everday use can you really even tell the difference between processors ? Maybe if you are gaming but not in normal use.

The real culprits are the developers - are you listening Boards :pac:
We have created this new job & they can't allow thing to remain the same otherwise they are out of work. Is each operating system update really better ? I won't have my apps on auto update because often the update is worse.

The big problem is that the developers have run out of ideas that the public actually want. You wait eagerly for the new model or operating system & then whoopy it gives you extra emojis.