How long are we going to tolerate the illegality of drugs? (serious question)

pure.conya

John Gilligan was just handed the means to make millions!

Christy Kinahan was allowed to make over e1,000,000,000 and is so powerful today that nothing can stop him, he can order hits on whomever, wherever and whenever he likes, all from the comfort of his hideouts/investments in the costa and around the world.

All this was facilitated by prohibition in this failed "war on drugs".

I for one am sick of it!

How long are you going to tolerate the illegality of drugs?

independent.ie/opinion/columnists/david-mcwilliams/ theres-a-very-easy-way-to-destroy-murderous-drugs-gangs-for-good-34744559. html

PS. If you support the stupid failed war on drugs - you support the gangs

electrobanana

pure.conya wrote: »

John Gilligan was just handed the means to make millions!

Christy Kinahan was allowed to make over e1,000,000,000 and is so powerful today that nothing can stop him, he can order hits on whomever, wherever and whenever he likes, all from the comfort of his hideouts/investments in the costa and around the world.

All this was facilitated by prohibition in this failed "war on drugs".

I for one am sick of it!

How long are you going to tolerate the illegality of drugs?

independent.ie/opinion/columnists/david-mcwilliams/ theres-a-very-easy-way-to-destroy-murderous-drugs-gangs-for-good-34744559. html

Not sure.. few weeks i suppose.

Temptamperu

Yeah! heroin for everyone!!!!

Mr. CooL ICE

I've got a stag in 3 weeks. If they could be legal by then, that would be great.

diomed

Do you think those criminals will retire if drugs are legalised?
Are they going to sign on and say that their business went bankrupt?

pure.conya

diomed wrote: »

Do you think those criminals will retire if drugs are legalised?
Are they going to sign on and say that their business went bankrupt?

no but if their core business was legalised and the products were produced and sold at a fraction of the blackmarket cost they wouldn't stand a chance. I don't really give a damn about what the criminals would do if their business went bankrupt, all I care about is that they stop being the ones exclusively making, selling and profitting from recreational drugs

uch

My tolerance for the oul gear is fuked, hence why I gave it up

kidneyfan

Heroin was the LAST thing she needed!
https://www.theguardian.com/music/2016/may/24/evvol-julie-chance-as-a-closeted-lesbian-in-dublin-life-wasnt-easy-then-i-found-heroin

B.A._Baracus

pure.conya wrote: »

no but if their core business was legalised and the products were produced and sold at a fraction of the blackmarket cost they wouldn't stand a chance. I don't really give a damn about what the criminals would do if their business went bankrupt, all I care about is that they stop being the ones exclusively making, selling and profitting from recreational drugs

Here's the thing tho, not all drugs would ever be legalised.
Scumbag drug dealers would still be selling the extremely hard stuff.

bodice ripper

As long as it facilitates criminalising the lower classes.

I know how that reads, unfortunately I feel it to be true.

Echoes675

pure.conya wrote: »

no but if their core business was legalised and the products were produced and sold at a fraction of the blackmarket cost

Who's to say the legal vendors of these products are going to charge less? It may cost less to manufacture wholesale and you'd be getting a higher quality product but these will be businesses. Just like any other, they'll charge as much as the market will allow.

There'll probably still be a black market for these things just like there's a black market for ciggies and booze.

candy-gal1

For as long as we are all sheep, or most of us, i say!

talking_walnut

diomed wrote: »

Do you think those criminals will retire if drugs are legalised?
Are they going to sign on and say that their business went bankrupt?

Maybe they'll go into politics like the Kennedys did after Prohibition ended in the States!

I'm being flippant but it is a good example. Prohibition-era Kennedys chased the big bucks in illegal booze and were smart enough to turn the wealth they made into a dynasty. They probably had to do some unsavoury things to make that money originally, but they're generally thought of as one of the "great American families" now.

The illegal status of things like drugs and alcohol has been shown to not reduce the use of them (alcohol abuse went up during Prohibition I believe). By keeping them illegal, we're putting money in the hands of people willing to flaunt the laws and who don't care about the health and well being of the end user (or anybody else by the looks of it).

Ironically, I think most drug dealers would end up signing on as the vast majority are small-time and small-profit. The ones at the top will move onto something else, but that's no reason to leave them with the golden goose they currently have. Make them work hard for their illegal gains. Some of them might decide to turn their attentions to more legitimate occupations and bring benefit to our society.

Someday people will look back at the "War on Drugs" the same way we currently look back at "Prohibition". An ill thought-out experiment that had a near universal negative impact on society and peoples health.

stimpson

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Here's the thing tho, not all drugs would ever be legalised.
Scumbag drug dealers would still be selling the extremely hard stuff.

It's not a popular opinion, but I'd argue that it's more important to legalise the hard stuff than the weed. Give out pure heroin on prescription with a doctors supervision and you'd see a massive drop in crime volumes and an easing of the pressure on the health service.

Dr Crayfish

Joe Duffy crowd can't handle beer being sold after 10:30pm. This will never happen in Ireland in my lifetime. I don't even know why we bother discussing it. It seems the majority of voters here are God fearing narrow minded people. We wont even allow abortion ffs.

kneemos

I suspect they'd involve themselves more in our everyday lives in the form of armed robberies,hijackings,prescription drugs,burgularies,black market selling...etc.

pure.conya

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Here's the thing tho, not all drugs would ever be legalised.
Scumbag drug dealers would still be selling the extremely hard stuff.

in actual fact, you're wrong. The chatter amongst the higher ups is that drugs will have to be decriminalised, in fact the word has come down from Brussles that each EU country since last has to add prostitution and illicit drugs black markets to their GDP. To those watching the way attitudes have been shifting the last few years, including McWilliams, it's a matter of when and not if anymore. Portugal (thank you xx) is being used to highlight the fact decriminalising drugs and their use leads to a drop in drugs use, drop in HIV and other health problems, freeing up of police and court hours etc.

eoin_mcg wrote: »

Who's to say the legal vendors of these products are going to charge less? It may cost less to manufacture wholesale and you'd be getting a higher quality product but these will be businesses. Just like any other, they'll charge as much as the market will allow.

There'll probably still be a black market for these things just like there's a black market for ciggies and booze.

if the state lets companies produce and profit from the drugs trade then yes nothing will change which is why we need to go the route of the state producing and selling just above the marginal production costs, nobody could compete against such a business model, not even Kinahan! the cigs and booze black markets exist for one reason alone, the price of each is ridiculously expensive!

DEFTLEFTHAND

Cigarettes are legal and the blackmarket trade is worth millions per annum.

It's simple, all gangs have to do is undercut the state.

pure.conya

kneemos wrote: »

I suspect they'd involve themselves more in our everyday lives in the form of armed robberies,hijackings,prescription drugs,burgularies,black market selling...etc.

only a fraction of the profits available in these career choices, you can do a lot less jobs, takes a lot more planning and a lot more risk of being caught

pure.conya

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Cigarettes are legal and the blackmarket trade is worth millions per annum.

It's simple, all gangs have to do is undercut the state.

it's even simpler for the state, undercut the gangs and hey presto, the arse has fallen out of the black market and the criminals are back on the dole and stone broke!

talking_walnut

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Cigarettes are legal and the blackmarket trade is worth millions per annum.

It's simple, all gangs have to do is undercut the state.

The cost of cigarettes is almost entirely down to tax. The government has traded-off the benefit they get from the tax on cigarettes against increases in blackmarket trade due to the increased tax. If the tobacco companies set their own price, there'd be nobody undercutting them.

This balancing act is what governments do every year with the Budget. Despite what you probably think, they're quite good at it.

B.A._Baracus

pure.conya wrote: »

in actual fact, you're wrong. The chatter amongst the higher ups is that drugs will have to be decriminalised, in fact the word has come down from Brussles that each EU country since last has to add prostitution and illicit drugs black markets to their GDP. To those watching the way attitudes have been shifting the last few years, including McWilliams, it's a matter of when and not if anymore. Portugal (thank you xx) is being used to highlight the fact decriminalising drugs and their use leads to a drop in drugs use, drop in HIV and other health problems, freeing up of police and court hours etc.

In actual fact I'm 'wrong'?
Seriously dude? :pac:

We are talking about what if's here... But my what if is wrong while your what if is right huh? Yet we are both talking through our arses as neither one of us knows the future.

By all means disagree with me. That's what makes a conversation but 'in actually fact you're wrong'.. Seriously?

looksee

I am quite willing to tolerate the illegality of drugs indefinitely.

Rezident

looksee wrote: »

I am quite willing to tolerate the illegality of drugs indefinitely.

Which drugs? Should caffeine and alcohol also be banned? As long as a plant with proven medicinal benefits is against the law despite it's widespread use, the whole area of laws on drugs is risible.

I have to give €50 to murderers like Christy Kinahan every week or two because I'm not allowed grow a plant in my own house!? That law and everyone supporting it cannot be taken seriously. It is out of touch with reality.

Guy:Incognito

There should be a quota on things like drugs, and the amount someone can thank posts. Certain people clearly have an addiction.....................

Rezident

OPs dead right, we have put up with this lunacy for too long. When weed is legal here - as it is in the 30 or 40 more progressive countries already - we will look back on these dark ages when people were forced to donate money to murderers because the government is hopelessly out of touch.

We could end the no. 1 income stream of all these scumbags and dealers and murderers in one common sense move, like they did in Amsterdam and

• Argentina
• Australia
• Belgium
• Belize
• Canada
• Chile

Oh I haven't got time to type out all of the countries that have legalised, decriminalised or just plain allow weed (Google it you won't believe how many countries are ahead of us on this one). It's just common sense.

Even 25 states in the US allow it 'for medicinal purposes'. We are on the wrong side of history here. And fueling gangs of murderers simultaneously. Imagine if all that money went to support Irish businesses and the Revenue Commissioners and lowered our taxes instead?

rubadub

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Cigarettes are legal and the blackmarket trade is worth millions per annum.

It's simple, all gangs have to do is undercut the state.

And billions is made in taxes. People are able to decide if they want to buy the regulated stuff and many do, just like most do not buy blackmarket alcohol as they do not want to take the risk. Also with the likes of weed and beer many would decide to make their own to have full control over it and avoid excise tax.

Blackmarkets exist for loads of goods, not sure what point you are making? not to bother legalising taxable things as some will find a way around paying the tax?

Riders Of Rohan

At least 7 more hours