DMP Prisoners Books released

Hermy

As per a post from Irish Genealogy News UCD Digital Collections have made the recently discovered Dublin Metropolitan Police's Prisoners Books available on line.

Hermy

On a related note, does anyone know where is the best source for info on DMP men?

hblock21

This is one area of research I would like to find out more on also. I believe there is not much information available on the DMP men. I my researching DMP10545, Patrick Cleary, who joined in 1903.

shanew

I have an index to DMP if that helps, one of Jim Herlihy's books, gives service numbers, year of birth and place of birth, usually as civil parish and county. As far I know the actual records are in the Garda Museum in Dublin Castle

shanew

hblock21 wrote: »

....researching DMP10545, Patrick Cleary, who joined in 1903.

There are three Patrick Clearys listed, DMP10545 was born in 1881 in Powerstown, Co. Tipperary

KildareFan

There's a page on Facebook for RIC descendants - https://www.facebook.com/groups/126602292427/

hblock21

shanew wrote: »

hblock21 wrote: »

....researching DMP10545, Patrick Cleary, who joined in 1903.

There are three Patrick Clearys listed, DMP10545 was born in 1881 in Powerstown, Co. Tipperary

Yes, that's him. He was only a member for a few months. Can you tell me the title of that book please so I can add it to my references. I presume it gives no further details.
Thanks.

shanew

Title : The Dublin Metropolitan Police, A complete Alphabetical Guide of Officers and Men 1836 to 1925, by Jim Herlihy (original print 1997, reprinted 1999 & 2001)

the format of the Alphabetical listings are name, service number, year of birth, civil parish of birth, county of birth

Hermy

I have a few RIC men in my tree but this is the first DMP man that has turned up.
He was John Norris, born in Kilkenny in 1880 as per the 1911 Census.

Hermy

shanew wrote: »

Title : The Dublin Metropolitan Police, A complete Alphabetical Guide of Officers and Men 1836 to 1925, by Jim Herlihy (original print 1997, reprinted 1999 & 2001)

the format of the Alphabetical listings are name, service number, year of birth, civil parish of birth, county of birth

Does that book in turn correspond to service records similar to the RIC book?

shanew

Same idea as the RIC index and registers. In the preface to the book he thanks the curator of the Garda Museum and mentions a Register of Service containing 12,566 names. I believe format of the service history is similar to that used for RIC records

shanew

Hermy wrote: »

.....
He was John Norris, born in Kilkenny in 1880 as per the 1911 Census.

John Norris, DMP10369, born 1878, Whitechurch, Co. Kilkenny

Hermy

shanew wrote: »

John Norris, DMP10369, born 1878, Whitechurch, Co. Kilkenny

Thanks for that Shane - gives me a head start.

shanew

Whitechurch c.p. is Carrick on Suir PLU - a couple of John Norris birth in Co. Kilkenny around the right time, but this one looks like the best match to me :

Name John Norris
Event Type Birth
Quarter and Year Oct - Dec 1878
Registration District Carrick-On-Suir
Volume 4 / Page 580

corresponds to this extracted record - dob 26 Oct 1878, parents James Norris, Bridget Kennedy

the place of birth* is given as Killinerry, which may be a misreading of Killonerry, which is one of just six townlands in Whitechurch civil parish. (*some of these extracted records mistakenly caption this as father's birth place)

Hermy

That looks right - thanks again.
Based on the Whitechurch reference I had picked out this census return as likely.

Earnest

The Garda Museum may have original records for the Dublin Metropolitan Police, but they're not helpful if you call. However, the National Archives have records on microfilm which give age at joining, height, previous occupation, name of person recommending them for service, divisions attached to, dates of promotion, records of good service pay, and date of discharge. If I remember rightly, you need the number from Jim Herlihy's book to find the right record.

There is a British Parliamentary Paper listing pensioners (possibly only higher ranks) in 1884: Estimates for civil services for the year ending 31 March 1885, House of Commons Sessional Papers 1884 (57) LII.1.

Irishuna

unfortunately the garda museum is closed, as per email this morning, 22.7.16 -
I had been looking for RIC and DMP info on some of my gggrand uncles.

i don't have their numbers. so am stumped!!

john mcdonell b 1865 i think - scotland - both R.I.C and dmp.

william mcdonell b 1870 mayo

duncan mcdonell ? brother

really annoying that you have to have their number to search on the National ARchives or Kew records.

spurious

You can get their numbers from Jim Herlihy's book. If you are on Facebook there is a fairly active group for descendants of and those with an interest in the RIC. Jim posts there and often gives lots of useful info.

Not seeing them in my list of the DMP men.

Hermy

You should be able to get their service number and record from Pearse Street library.

EDIT: Too slow!

Irishuna

cheers spurious, and hermy, im actually on the facebook page.
im in Galway. and dont fancy trecking up to dublin, at the minute.

im sure the facebook page can help.

tabbey

Irishuna wrote: »

cheers spurious, and hermy, im actually on the facebook page.
im in Galway. and dont fancy trecking up to dublin, at the minute.

im sure the facebook page can help.

I assume a library in Galway should have copies of Jim Herlihy's books (DMP & RIC), but it might not be so easy to find a copy of the service record microfilms.