Help needed

Bscan86

Hi all,
I'm in the process of applying for planning permission soon. The percolation test has passed and we're almost there on deciding who to appoint to do planning drawings. Then there are construction drawings to be done.
Here lies my dilemma, quite a few people have said to me that there are no need to get construction drawings done, that they are not necessary and that the planning drawings will do for building. I hope I don't come across as being paranoid but a seed of doubt has been planted in my head as to whether they're necessary or not. Any info is greatly appreciated.

DOCARCH

My tuppence worth...construction drawings are necessary.

Bscan86

DOCARCH wrote:

My tuppence worth...construction drawings are necessary.

Thank you for your reply. What in your experience is the biggest advantage of them? Would each tradesman not be well up on the current regs?

BryanF

Bscan86 wrote: »

Hi all,
I'm in the process of applying for planning permission soon. The percolation test has passed and we're almost there on deciding who to appoint to do planning drawings. Then there are construction drawings to be done.
Here lies my dilemma,

1. quite a few people have said to me that there are no need to get construction drawings done,
2. that they are not necessary
3. and that the planning drawings will do for building. I hope I don't come across as being paranoid but a seed of doubt has been planted in my head as to whether they're necessary or not. Any info is greatly appreciated.

1. Builders and a friends can tell you what ever they like.. This is the biggest investment you probably ever make.

There have been ~1000p of building guidance documents produced to explain new build regulations since 2008, how many people down the pub or builders will claim to know them all.

Builder: but sure I didn't price or build that because it wasn't on the drawing'...

2. Don't confuse the option of opting out building 'control' regulations, with your legal requirements to comply with building regulations, (& revenue, planning and health & safety regs also)

3. 2011 'Part L' (partly covered by the BER) will add significantlot to your build costs, where is that specified on your planning drawings? Have read the 2010 disabled access section of the building regs..

DOCARCH

Bscan86 wrote: »

Would each tradesman not be well up on the current regs?

Very simply....no. Not in my experience.

Are you building a house or extension?

mrsWhippy

We are about to embark on a build and are just about ready to start the construction drawings. Although they are going to cost a fortune, I don't know how else we could ensure that we are getting what we pay for from the builders, and that the house is going to be built the way we want it built! You are just leaving it up to their discretion otherwise. That's all well and good if you have hired a construction company that you trust .... but otherwise, I'd rather do it once and do it right.

Construction drawings also allow for a BoQ which for something like a new build, will be essential imo.

Bscan86

DOCARCH wrote:

Very simply....no. Not in my experience.

DOCARCH wrote:

Are you building a house or extension?

House.
My other half's brother built an extension last year and had no construction drawings. That's where I'm coming from.
So the preliminary BER is included in the construction drawings, that makes sense.

sydthebeat

Bscan86 wrote: »

Hi all,
I'm in the process of applying for planning permission soon. The percolation test has passed and we're almost there on deciding who to appoint to do planning drawings. Then there are construction drawings to be done.
Here lies my dilemma, quite a few people have said to me that there are no need to get construction drawings done, that they are not necessary and that the planning drawings will do for building. I hope I don't come across as being paranoid but a seed of doubt has been planted in my head as to whether they're necessary or not. Any info is greatly appreciated.

you are legally required to submit "building regulation compliant drawings" with your commencement notice

planning drawings WILL NOT do, people telling you otherwise are wrong (whether they 'GOT AWAY WITH IT' or not)

Bscan86

sydthebeat wrote:

you are legally required to submit "building regulation compliant drawings" with your commencement notice

sydthebeat wrote:

planning drawings WILL NOT do, people telling you otherwise are wrong (whether they 'GOT AWAY WITH IT' or not)

Thanks for that Syd,
Maybe I've been looking in the wrong places but it seems there isn't a concise table of procedures to follow when you want to build your own house. Am I right in that?

sky6

Design Drawing will just show you how pretty the house will look on paper. The Construction Drawings are what will show you how it's to be built. They're the most important set of Drawings for many reasons.
They'll show you the minimum standards the Builder has to adhere to for proper construction and Building Regs as per your Architect and Engineer. Anything less and you have no comeback.
As a lay person you'll get to see how the house is constructed and see things that you might want to change or query.
Just going with design drawings would be a massive mistake and as said already you will be paying for it for a long long time. Unless you win the Lotto of course.

Bscan86

I'm planning on going down the direct labour route. I presume this would make the construction drawings all the more necessary?

Calahonda52

Bscan86 wrote: »

I'm planning on going down the direct labour route. I presume this would make the construction drawings all the more necessary?

This assumes that the trades can interpret the drawings, coordinate with each other and will build what is required using the specified materials without any supervision which just wont happen, period.

You need to comply with the relevant TGD's
http://www.environ.ie/housing/building-standards/tgd-part-d-materials-and-workmanship/technical-guidance-documents
and this should help as well
https://www.nsai.ie/S-R-54-2014-Code-of-Practice.aspx

You need a detailed specification form the detailed makeup of the floor/wall/roof/door/window construction down to the colour and position of all the sockets ( tv, phone, internet, lighting, power, etc) and switches.

Bscan86

Calahonda52 wrote:

This assumes that the trades can interpret the drawings, coordinate with each other and will build what is required using the specified materials without any supervision which just wont happen, period.

Calahonda52 wrote:

You need to comply with the relevant TGD's

Calahonda52 wrote:

and this should help as well

Calahonda52 wrote:

You need a detailed specification form the detailed makeup of the floor/wall/roof/door/window construction down to the colour and position of all the sockets ( tv, phone, internet, lighting, power, etc) and switches.

Calahonda52 wrote:

This assumes that the trades can interpret the drawings, coordinate with each other and will build what is required using the specified materials without any supervision which just wont happen, period.

Calahonda52 wrote:

You need to comply with the relevant TGD's

Calahonda52 wrote:

and this should help as well

Calahonda52 wrote:

You need a detailed specification form the detailed makeup of the floor/wall/roof/door/window construction down to the colour and position of all the sockets ( tv, phone, internet, lighting, power, etc) and switches.

Thank you all for your information. It's very much appreciated.

Angry bird

Planning drawings are about as useful as a sketch on the back of a cigarette box when building. Besides the fact they're a legal requirement, the various trades will need them to put their respective bits. If anything I'd skimp on the planning drawings to the very basic detail to meet planning legal requirements. Do not skimp on construction drawings. Good luck.

Bscan86

Angry bird wrote:

Planning drawings are about as useful as a sketch on the back of a cigarette box when building. Besides the fact they're a legal requirement, the various trades will need them to put their respective bits. If anything I'd skimp on the planning drawings to the very basic detail to meet planning legal requirements. Do not skimp on construction drawings. Good luck.

Thanks for that.

Kigera

With regard to construction drawings, what would be an educated guess on how much they would costs?

Johnnyhpipe

Eg: A planning drawing will show a roof.

A construction drawing will show/specify finishes/weathering/insulation on marine ply on rafters/bridging/roof straps/hangers/fixings/counterbattens/ceiling.

Also, for planning, structural members wont be sized. How would a builder pour the correct width foundations? How would he size the joists/rafters etc without construction drawings?

I don't know how anyone could build off a planning drawing without making it up as they go along.