No RTE channels in SD

PabloAndRoy

Recently my local ISP (not one of the big players) increased my uplink speed to a respectable 5 mbps.

With this it is now possible to stream from my home TV system (tvheadend accessing Saorview & Freesat). This is great as I can now access my home system in the family motorhome via 4G where that signal is strong. As far as I am aware my home TV licence covers me for this.

The 5 mbps is not enough for HD streams so I can only stream SD channels. This is fine as the motorhome tv is small and I don't really need HD. So this is fine for most of UK & Ireland channels except for the flagship Irish big 2 RTE 1 and RTE 2 which are not available to me in SD.

I find it odd that the two primary channels (for which we pay our TV licence) are not available in SD FTA. Is there not a requirement to broadcast both SD & HD or are all of the Saorview approved boxes HD capable?

In most situations I can use the UHF ariel in the camper to get Saorview, so hopefully I can get my fill of fair city when on the road (/s)

As an aside I am wondering about the legal implications of accessing this outside of Ireland. So when I go on holidays or on business abroad, I can plug into the local broadband and watch (most of) the UK & Ireland channels through my home distribution system. Does my TV licence cover me for this?

mansize

Your TV licence only covers the house on the address

mansize

If your motor home has a tv you require a separate licence for that

Watching it on a computer, with no tv does not

icdg

Without addressing the copyright issue, the reason they do not broadcast in SD is yes, all Saorview boxes are HD capable, so they don't want to waste space (and money) transmitting both SD and HD version.

What you are trying to do is very much "power user" stuff, and not a scenario RTE have contemplated. And as I say there are copyright issues with it - especially if you are making that stream available to all and sundry over the open internet.

Incidently while we can't provide legal advice here do be aware that TV licence only covers the premises for which it is licenced.

PabloAndRoy

mansize wrote: »

If your motor home has a tv you require a separate licence for that

Watching it on a computer, with no tv does not

Are you sure about this?

I am not.

Having looked at the legislation just now, I am not convinced a motor home (i.e campervan) requires a licence.

Broadcasting Act 2009:

“premises” means land, a vehicle, a structure of any kind whether
attached or affixed to the land or not and includes a part of a building
occupied as a separate dwelling whether or not the occupier with any
other person shares any portion of it or any accommodation, amenity
or facility in connection with it;

“vehicle” means a vehicle other than a mechanically propelled
vehicle (within the meaning of section 3 of the Road Traffic Act
1961) capable of being lived in being a caravan or a mobile home.

section 3 of the Road Traffic Act 1961 defines this as:

“mechanically propelled vehicle” means, subject to subsection (2)
of this section, a vehicle intended or adapted for propulsion by
mechanical means, including—
(a) a bicycle or tricycle with an attachment for propelling it
by mechanical power, whether or not the attachment is being used,
(b) a vehicle the means of propulsion of which is electrical or
partly electrical and partly mechanical,

Here is the section about granting a licence in the Broadcasting Act 2009:

5.—(1) The appropriate authority may, subject
to this Act and on payment of the prescribed fee
(if any) grant to any person a licence to keep and
have possession of apparatus for wireless telegraphy
in any specified place in the State or to keep
and have possession of apparatus for wireless telegraphy
in any specified ship or other vessel or
aircraft.

....

(5) For the purposes of this Act and any regulations
under section 6, a vehicle is itself deemed
to be a place separate and distinct from the premises
in which the vehicle is ordinarily kept, and
place and specified place shall in this Act and in
any such regulations be read accordingly

IANAL but my reading of this is that a campervan (as a mechanically propelled vehicle) is not considered a vehicle as defined in the Act.

PabloAndRoy

icdg wrote: »

Without addressing the copyright issue, the reason they do not broadcast in SD is yes, all Saorview boxes are HD capable, so they don't want to waste space (and money) transmitting both SD and HD version.

What you are trying to do is very much "power user" stuff, and not a scenario RTE have contemplated. And as I say there are copyright issues with it - especially if you are making that stream available to all and sundry over the open internet.

Incidently while we can't provide legal advice here do be aware that TV licence only covers the premises for which it is licenced.

The stream is absolutely not available to "all and sundry" .. it is restricted to my own access control rules .. which are strict and not accessable to anyone other than me. This usage scenario definitely falls under "fair use"/"fair dealing" as it is private .. there is no copyright issue here.

I have no interest in providing this for anyone other than myself. Now if these were public multicast streams that would certainly be illegal, no question about it.

mansize

I have advised, if you believw different then so be it

PabloAndRoy

mansize wrote: »

I have advised, if you believw different then so be it

Yeah i just read the act and interpreted it ..

mansize

http://www.businesspost.ie/licences-on-the-move-2/

PabloAndRoy

PabloAndRoy wrote: »

here is another one from 2008

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/licence-inspectors-to-launch-summer-blitz-on-caravans-26454889.html

both prior to the 2009 act. The act itself does not seem to have provision for it.

it is not clear and seems to be a grey area. I have asked the issuing agent via email for advice

STB.

PabloAndRoy wrote: »

Recently my local ISP (not one of the big players) increased my uplink speed to a respectable 5 mbps.

With this it is now possible to stream from my home TV system (tvheadend accessing Saorview & Freesat). This is great as I can now access my home system in the family motorhome via 4G where that signal is strong. As far as I am aware my home TV licence covers me for this.

The 5 mbps is not enough for HD streams so I can only stream SD channels. This is fine as the motorhome tv is small and I don't really need HD. So this is fine for most of UK & Ireland channels except for the flagship Irish big 2 RTE 1 and RTE 2 which are not available to me in SD.

I find it odd that the two primary channels (for which we pay our TV licence) are not available in SD FTA. Is there not a requirement to broadcast both SD & HD or are all of the Saorview approved boxes HD capable?

In most situations I can use the UHF ariel in the camper to get Saorview, so hopefully I can get my fill of fair city when on the road (/s)

As an aside I am wondering about the legal implications of accessing this outside of Ireland. So when I go on holidays or on business abroad, I can plug into the local broadband and watch (most of) the UK & Ireland channels through my home distribution system. Does my TV licence cover me for this?

Believe it or not the DVB-T infrastructure was not built to facilitate people running their own streaming services!

Your problems are of your own doing in trying to pipe TV through internal streaming with limited bandwidth out. I take it whatever system you have does not transcode on the fly. Most of the latest Linux boxes do transcode, meaning your network wont fall over trying to produce a 20meg HD stream for you to try and intercept with a 4g connection.

For the UK channels, you only need filmon.com. That already provides free SD streams of the UK channels, in Ireland and the UK.

PabloAndRoy

STB. wrote: »

Believe it or not the DVB-T infrastructure was not built to facilitate people running their own streaming services!

Your problems are of your own doing in trying to pipe TV through internal streaming with limited bandwidth out. I take it whatever system you have does not transcode on the fly. Most of the latest Linux boxes do transcode, meaning your network wont fall over trying to produce a 20meg HD stream for you to try and intercept with a 4g connection.

For the UK channels, you only need filmon.com. That already provides free SD streams of the UK channels, in Ireland and the UK.

My internal network has no problem distributing 4 x HD streams over IP to 4 TV points in the house.

My backend software (tvheadend) does provide transcoding but the very humble RPi that runs my backend doesn't have the grunt to make it happen.

I did have a look at filmon last year before I built this system .. Its not great to be honest and doesn't provide all of what is on freesat, But i guess it might get you by over 4g. Personally I prefer my private set up. The leap from internal to external is just a bit of port forwarding and DDNS.

icdg

Look, I think this thread veers too much into the legal advice territory, and the OP appears to have made up his own mind anyway on the law. In such circumstances, and the question of why RTE only broadcast in HD having been answered, I think closing the thread at this point is the correct course to take