How to you do a steep hill start with the foot parking brake in a 30kwh leaf

yqtwqxqm

I had a 30 kwh leaf for a few days.
Couldnt figure out how to do a hill start on a steep hill with it though.
When the car is in gear it rolls back or forward when in D or R, depending on whether you are doing a forward or reverse hill start.
It only stands still when the parking brake is on.

With the old leaf and the electric parking brake all you did was put it on and the car would release it by itself as you press the accelerator.

Can figure out how to do it with the new leaf at all.

Congrats, bet you notice a hell of an improvement from the original leaf ?

Hill starts are an absolute doddle in the leaf.

All you got to do is follow this in exactly this order.

1. With your ( right) foot firmly on the foot brake , put the car in drive or b if you want to go up the hill or put the car in reverse if you want to reverse up the hill.

2. Release the foot operated hand brake with your left foot keeping your right foot firmly on the normal brake pedal.

3. Keeping your right foot firmly on the brake after releasing the hand brake now move your left foot to the normal brake pedal and release your right foot keeping firm pressure on the brake pedal with your left foot.

4. Press the accelerator until you feel the car wanting to move then release your left foot and the car will move forward without moving backwards or move backwards if you want to reverse.

It's all second nature after a while and you can do it pretty quickly. On some smaller hills it shouldn't roll back while in drive or B but always have your left foot handy just in case, if you need to stop on a steep hill for a while and need the handbrake then just press P for park and use the handbrake.

Practice with no one around first if you can.

highdef

I think this is the method for all automatics and is the reason why brake pedals in automatics are so big... To accommodate two feet for the aforementioned procedure.

Yeah I used to do this in the Prius and A4.

But once you do it a few times it's a quick and painless process that's far easier than in a manual car.

Skatedude

highdef wrote: »

I think this is the method for all automatics and is the reason why brake pedals in automatics are so big... To accommodate two feet for the aforementioned procedure.

I've driven automatics for years and never had to hold the break with my left foot for hill starts, just put it in drive, take my foot off the break and then put it on the accelerator to move off, car never rolls backwards.

However I've always driven old big engined auto's. Is it different with small engines and electrics?

The Leaf won't roll back on smaller hills, though we all might have different views on what a large / small hill is.

Depends on the car I suppose. The A4 and Prius were the same on some steeper hills, found myself having to left foot brake while giving them some gas.

The 08+ A4's now have Hill Hold and won't release the handbrake until the accelerator is pressed.

Padraig Mor

Skatedude wrote: »

I've driven automatics for years and never had to hold the break with my left foot for hill starts, just put it in drive, take my foot off the break and then put it on the accelerator to move off, car never rolls backwards.

However I've always driven old big engined auto's. Is it different with small engines and electrics?

This - works just fine, I've never had a problem in the Leaf. I would be extremely hesitant to use left foot braking - leave that to the professionals!

Oafley Jones

Slightly alarmed that you'd have to do this in a leaf. Particularly in a vehicle that has instant torque. Seems like a recipe for disaster. Amazed that the leaf won't hold itself.

k123456

Deleted User wrote: »

Congrats, bet you notice a hell of an improvement from the original leaf ?

Hill starts are an absolute doddle in the leaf.

All you got to do is follow this in exactly this order.

1. With your ( right) foot firmly on the foot brake , put the car in drive or b if you want to go up the hill or put the car in reverse if you want to reverse up the hill.

2. Release the foot operated hand brake with your left foot keeping your right foot firmly on the normal brake pedal.

3. Keeping your right foot firmly on the brake after releasing the hand brake now move your left foot to the normal brake pedal and release your right foot keeping firm pressure on the brake pedal with your left foot.

4. Press the accelerator until you feel the car wanting to move then release your left foot and the car will move forward without moving backwards or move backwards if you want to reverse.

It's all second nature after a while and you can do it pretty quickly. On some smaller hills it shouldn't roll back while in drive or B but always have your left foot handy just in case, if you need to stop on a steep hill for a while and need the handbrake then just press P for park and use the handbrake.

Practice with no one around first if you can.

Is this the same procedure for 24kw 2016 leaf

yqtwqxqm

Ijn the old original leaf the break would come off automatically when the accelerator was pressed enough.
The new one is a disaster for hill starts as far as i can see.
I have a small drive way on a hill with about a 15 degree incline. The front of the car where the charger is is going to be 6 inches from a tree when i start off. No room for error at all.
Ive only had it on a test drive but hill starts are important for me.
I cant go from a leaf into an ice, as i have to drive the ice often and use the left foot on the break in the leaf.
Its just asking for a prang in one of them.
They should have made the car so it can hold itself from rolling the opposite direction when its in gear.
Its definitely a recipe for disaster as a previous poster has said.
Good luck if anyone has to ever park on a steep slope with a wall right in front of them
They wont even have practised a hill start like this until they have to do it.

sgalvin

I find it amazing that it doesn't have it the hill hold function. The hardware (abs pump and wheel sensors) is already fitted it is only software.

This is not a new idea. My 2003 smart roadster auto had it as did our grand scenic auto and my fluence ze has it.

Try a quick hill start in a manual Mercedes with foot operated parking brake- like exciting ballet!

yqtwqxqm wrote: »

Ijn the old original leaf the break would come off automatically when the accelerator was pressed enough.
The new one is a disaster for hill starts as far as i can see.
I have a small drive way on a hill with about a 15 degree incline. The front of the car where the charger is is going to be 6 inches from a tree when i start off. No room for error at all.
Ive only had it on a test drive but hill starts are important for me.
I cant go from a leaf into an ice, as i have to drive the ice often and use the left foot on the break in the leaf.
Its just asking for a prang in one of them.
They should have made the car so it can hold itself from rolling the opposite direction when its in gear.
Its definitely a recipe for disaster as a previous poster has said.
Good luck if anyone has to ever park on a steep slope with a wall right in front of them
They wont even have practised a hill start like this until they have to do it.

yqtwqxqm

sgalvin wrote: »

I find it amazing that it doesn't have it the hill hold function. The hardware (abs pump and wheel sensors) is already fitted it is only software.

This is not a new idea. My 2003 smart roadster auto had it as did our grand scenic auto and my fluence ze has it.

Try a quick hill start in a manual Mercedes with foot operated parking brake- like exciting ballet!

If it does hold the car I havent figured it out.
I see a leaf making significant contact with a wall the the bottom of a hill for some people in the future

It will hold it on a small hill alright, but not anything over 10 degrees id imagine. Certainly not a near 15 degree one anyway.
Huge flaw in the car as far as im concerned.

sgalvin

Did a quick search for leaf manual 2015 PDF
Seem to gotten the USA one but "hill assist" is listed on page 5-25

Can't image it is a feature they would disable for certain markets?

yqtwqxqm wrote: »

If it does hold the car I havent figured it out.
I see a leaf making significant contact with a wall the the bottom of a hill for some people in the future

It will hold it on a small hill alright, but not anything over 10 degrees id imagine. Certainly not a near 15 degree one anyway.
Huge flaw in the car as far as im concerned.

k123456

k123456 wrote: »

Is this the same procedure for 24kw 2016 leaf

Yes. Not an issue. Believe me.

People are really making a huge issue over nothing, it's a very very simple thing to do a hill start in a Leaf even on the steepest hills you will find. Much Much easier than doing a hill start in a manual car.

Why they haven't a hill start function is because they removed the Auto handbrake for some reason. Even so I find hill starts perfectly simple. I had to do the same in the MK II Prius and the B6 A4 Multitronic.

If you are driving in the Leaf and come to a complete stop on a hill and can leave it in Drive, just brake as normally then slide your left foot to the brake and when you want to move again press the accelerator and lift your foot off the brake. Don't give it too much throttle of course or you could rear end the car in front, but this is kind of normal with any automatic.

It's always safest to put the car in Park and use the foot operated handbrake of course but there are times in crawling traffic this isn't an option.

yqtwqxqm

sgalvin wrote: »

Did a quick search for leaf manual 2015 PDF
Seem to gotten the USA one but "hill assist" is listed on page 5-25

Can't image it is a feature they would disable for certain markets?

Must try that. Why wouldnt they just prevent the car rolling back when its in gear anyway and not just for 2 seconds as that says. Seems a bit stupit to fo it for 2 seconds only.

That would explain why I had different behaviour every time i took my foot off the break to try a hill start.
Maybe i was waiting more than 2 seconds sometimes.
I remember first thinking oh the car is holding. Then thinking, no its not holding.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ru3JtiyGF0

Hill start assist is listed in the specs of Irish leafs on the Nissan.ie website.

It operates for 2 seconds max. I must try it again I never realised the Leaf had it.

sgalvin

The 2 seconds is just to get your foot from the brake to accelerator pedal to avoid handbrake hill starts not as a full auto handbrake.

If it stayed on you couldn't just roll forward as you probably do when say parking on a slope rather than moving to accelerator to release and back to the brake again immediately to move 1 meter.

yqtwqxqm wrote: »

Must try that. Why wouldnt they just prevent the car rolling back when its in gear anyway and not just for 2 seconds as that says. Seems a bit stupit to fo it for 2 seconds only.

Would anyone rather do a hill start in a leaf using the very simple method I described or in a Manual car ?

I will try the 2 seconds hill hold function when I get the change, I never know it had it in the first place.

BoatMad

I flip off the parking with right foot on brake , transfer feet , left foot brake and away you go.

I also have just fliped of the parking while applying accelerator , works as well

In traffic just left foot brake

Is this complicated guys ?

Padraig Mor

I'm not sure what all the confusion is about. My 2015 Leaf has Hill hold and I've never had an issue using it. My last car was a big engined auto and I haven't noticed any particular difference.

BoatMad

BoatMad wrote: »

Is this complicated guys ?

Seemingly so.

yqtwqxqm

Everyone always thinks that hill starts are easy, until they try one in my driveway.
Or on a steep hill with another car behind them.
Several, including the tesco delivery guy from last night, have tree bark in their bumpers now
In fact without that tree i might have cars in my front wall fairly often.

On any other hill i'll do a hill start without any brakes. I wont even think of it. Car might roll a tiny bit and i'll gun the accelerator no problem.

Hill starts are a lot more difficult with a tree in front of you on a steep hill.
Add to that that I only moved in last week and on any day you might be driving both an automatic and a stick shift, and it makes getting it 100% correct very important.

This is a hill near my house, slightly less steep than my drive.
I challenge anyone to park on that hill, put a traffic cone 6 inches in front of you and reverse up the hill from a stop without rolling into the traffic cone in a leaf.

https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.2004654,-6.1186472,3a,75y,213.33h,70.37t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sO5W2LZnci49bur4EGWhZgw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Below is the hill going down to the house. You can see how steep it is from the start here, but when you turn down right in front of the house it gets even steeper. We are going to modify the driveway, but that will be a while yet before thats done. I'll post a picture of the parking spaces when i get home. I thought hill starts were a doddle until last week too.

https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.1843469,-6.1347854,3a,75y,66.22h,72.82t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1suP_TgGLklwmNmXlKEvLQAw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

You have perfect control in the leaf with left foot on the brake and right foot on the accelerator. Far greater than in any manual.

yqtwqxqm

Deleted User wrote: »

You have perfect control in the leaf with left foot on the brake and right foot on the accelerator. Far greater than in any manual.

I find I dont. Foot on brake and accelerator at the same time does not compute for me. Especially when i have to change cars so often. But im willing to try the hill assist technique and see how that works when i get home

It's completely 2nd nature to me now.

yqtwqxqm

Deleted User wrote: »

It's completely 2nd nature to me now.

It would be fine if it was the only car i had to drive.

yqtwqxqm

yqtwqxqm wrote: »

It would be fine if it was the only car i had to drive.

I do have to drive the diesel now and again. Unfortunately.

yqtwqxqm

Deleted User wrote: »

I do have to drive the diesel now and again. Unfortunately.

Reverse starting from a steep hill every time you change?

BoatMad

Doing what you suggest in a 2.5 T pickup with a slippy handbrake is " fun" , the leaf is a doddle

There is a hill start feature on the leaf , but it seems to drop out quite quick

I agree however that the decision to dump the electric handbrake was daft. I wonder was it the U.S. Market influence , where parking brake pedals are much more common

But with the motor and electronics the leaf shouldn't budge on hills except in the direction you want , so it's strange there isn't a comprehensive system

yqtwqxqm

yqtwqxqm wrote: »

Reverse starting from a steep hill every time you change?

No, but it's really not difficult , steep hill starts are really handy once your used to it.

Skatedude

Wow, based on these posts, you need left foot breaking on a leaf? i've been driving for 35 years plus and i have never used left foot breaking ever., is there something different on electric vehicles? Not been sarcastic, just curiousness?

Esel

Foot-operated handbrake???

Know what you meant, I think....

No forget about the handbrake, this is left foot braking the normal brake pedal.

However, I nor I don't think many people here were aware the Leaf has a hill hold feature where it will sense you're on a hill and after you depress the brake pedal it will hold that brake pressure for 2 seconds max and prevent you rolling back.

I must try it out.

BoatMad

Skatedude wrote: »

Wow, based on these posts, you need left foot breaking on a leaf? i've been driving for 35 years plus and i have never used left foot breaking ever., is there something different on electric vehicles? Not been sarcastic, just curiousness?

few automatics till recently had hill hold. SO Id like you to tell me how you performed hill starts on a foot brake based ICE automatic, without left foot braking

the Leaf has hill hold anyway for 2 secs , tried it yesterday

zilog_jones

A traditional torque converter auto box will crawl in D with no throttle, which will hold the car to an extent hills. Doesn't work so well on steep hills. Guess he's never driven in Cork city

cruizer101

BoatMad wrote: »

few automatics till recently had hill hold. SO Id like you to tell me how you performed hill starts on a foot brake based ICE automatic, without left foot braking

the Leaf has hill hold anyway for 2 secs , tried it yesterday

Maybe I'm doing something wrong but for me hill start has always included using the handbrake.

In manual find biting point let of handbrake and accelerate.

In auto, handbrake on, right foot on brake, right foot to accelerator and handbrake off as feel car push forward.

I really don't get these foot operated parking/handbrake, to me the handbrake allows for better control. Like others have said left foot braking just feels wrong, I've done it once or twice and end up standing on the brakes, not saying I couldn't learn to do it but why should I, it makes no sense to me to change the system.

zilog_jones

Left foot braking gives the same amount of control as you would in a manual with a handbrake, and it's easier too. You will get used to it.

BoatMad

Any way the leaf has hill hold for 2secs , or you can just ease the throttle on , and flick off the parking brake as it moves

cruizer101

cruizer101 wrote: »

Maybe I'm doing something wrong but for me hill start has always included using the handbrake.

In manual find biting point let of handbrake and accelerate.

In auto, handbrake on, right foot on brake, right foot to accelerator and handbrake off as feel car push forward.

I really don't get these foot operated parking/handbrake, to me the handbrake allows for better control. Like others have said left foot braking just feels wrong, I've done it once or twice and end up standing on the brakes, not saying I couldn't learn to do it but why should I, it makes no sense to me to change the system.

NO No.

Right foot on brake, put car in drive, release foot operate handbrake with left foot keeping right foot on normal brake pedal, keeping right foot on normal brake pedal move left foot to brake pedal and right foot to accelerator then press the accelerator and you will feel the car wanting to move then carefully release the foot brake.

If you give the car too much accelerator and lift off the brake too quickly the car can accelerate quickly so be careful.

Once you do it a few times it's extremely simple.

But try the hill hold function first, and remember it works for 2 seconds only.

cruizer101

I think you misunderstand me I'm not talking about the leaf or any car with foot operated parking brake.

I was more responding to BoatMads: SO Id like you to tell me how you performed hill starts on a foot brake based ICE automatic, without left foot braking

Following on from this I don't see why the handbrake has been gotten rid of, it seems a perfectly useful bit of equipment to me

Uhh, this all sounds very complicated. I have never ever used parking brake on any vehicle on hill start (parking on steep hills excepted of course). Finnish driving test does allow for a very limited backwards move on hill starts but with practice there won't be any.

On leaf: Sitting on hill. Move the right foot from brake to accelerator and press it gently. Literally it could not be easier. I have never felt the car wanting to move back at all probably due to that hill assist that I didn't even know was there. On automatics the left foot should just have a holiday.

On manual gearbox: Left foot on clutch, right on brake pedal. Quickly move right foot from brake to accelerator and begin to press it while releasing the clutch off quickly to the biting point and then continue easing it without letting the engine revs to rise too much. It has worked on any vehicles I have driven from Peugeot 205 1.1 -> MAN 12 ton lorry once you familiarize yourself with the biting point. Current Sprinter van we have, for example, needs a fair bit of throttle to go but with the above technique things just work without toasting the clutch by slipping it for more than a second or so even on a silly gradients. And in icy conditions or ferries etc. it makes sense to stop at the bottom of the hill if you think you may need to stop due to traffic jam.

Padraig Mor

[Deleted User] wrote: »

NO No.

Right foot on brake, put car in drive, release foot operate handbrake with left foot keeping right foot on normal brake pedal, keeping right foot on normal brake pedal move left foot to brake pedal and right foot to accelerator then press the accelerator and you will feel the car wanting to move then carefully release the foot brake.

If you give the car too much accelerator and lift off the brake too quickly the car can accelerate quickly so be careful.

Once you do it a few times it's extremely simple.

But try the hill hold function first, and remember it works for 2 seconds only.

Or simply hold down brake pedal with right foot, release parking brake with left foot, transfer right foot to accelerator and off you go. Works for me - not really sure why people are making it complicated - it really isn't. It's probably easier for me in that my last car had the same parking brake arrangement (ie pedal) as the Leaf.

yqtwqxqm

I tried the hill assist.
It works and you dont have to use left foot braking.
Would you fail your driving test left foot braking i wonder?

zilog_jones

I don't see why you would fail your test as long as you can do whatever is necessary with whatever feet. I'm sure you can brake with your left foot all the time if you wanted.

And as others have said it's pretty much the done thing on steep hills with a traditional auto box - why else would the brake pedal be so wide?

simdan

Oafley Jones wrote:

Slightly alarmed that you'd have to do this in a leaf. Particularly in a vehicle that has instant torque. Seems like a recipe for disaster. Amazed that the leaf won't hold itself.

The leaf will definitely hold itself on a hill start. He wasn't sure how to use the foot break..

samih

samih wrote: »

Uhh, this all sounds very complicated. ... On leaf: Sitting on hill. Move the right foot from brake to accelerator and press it gently. Literally it could not be easier. I have never felt the car wanting to move back at all probably due to that hill assist that I didn't even know was there. On automatics the left foot should just have a holiday.

As said before Leaf is so easy on hill starts and no need for left foot braking or parking brake. Just right foot brake and go using the instant torque. If you start messing with the parking brake you're just making it difficult for yourself.