Airport, New Runway

martinn123

There is a Fingal Planning thread, but maybe this news deserves it own space.

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/dublin-airport-build-320-million-7705984#ICID=sharebar_twitter

http://www.dublinairport.com/gns/at-the-airport/latest-news/16-04-07/daa_To_Build_New_Runway_At_Dublin_Airport.aspx

1200 Construction jobs, completion by 2020.

Good news for the area, except maybe if you live in Portmarnock.:eek:

Dizzyblonde

It's great news, lots of employment for the area

plodder

Apparently, the project includes a new control tower, three times the height of the present one. That'll be quite a significant landmark in the surrounding area:

Here's a picture of what it will look like, next to the current one.

Arthur Daley

Any views on impact of this in swords? I remember in 2006 it was not felt to be a massive impact in noise pollution, but kind of hard to see how it wouldn't be, and I thought the likes of ridgewood were adding themselves to the ' uproar' campaign portmarnock had running. At the end of the day airport runways have to go somewhere in every city on the planet.

dslamjack

It will also high light yet again the need for the full implementation of Metro North, the 2 project's really need to be done in conjunction with each other.
While the new runway is self financing in it's own right ,it will now take a decision from the next government on the finance and size and start date for Metro North.
Residents objection's are a bit late at this stage,but Airport authority spokeswoman Siobhán Moore said about 40 households would be eligible for relocation grants as a result of the second runway, and an unquantified number of houses would be eligible for noise insulation.
It is unfortunate for people in Malahide/Portmarnock ,and what can only be expected when deciding to live in the flightpath of a major international airport.
A Spanish company CLH Group is to construct and operate a new aviation fuel storage facility at the airport that will increase existing capacity six fold at a cost of 40 million, that project will take 3 years and create more job's in construction.

neris

plodder wrote: »

Apparently, the project includes a new control tower, three times the height of the present one. That'll be quite a significant landmark in the surrounding area:

Here's a picture of what it will look like, next to the current one.

it was costing them 320 million to build it yesterday now with the control tower they are saying 370 million. listening to some of the news reports and "experts" they think they might be able to attract extra business in from Heathrow as their having difficulty getting their new runway through. Can only be a good thing for jobs, tourism and new destinations to go to. On the fuel aswell they are still trying to get the underground pipeline from Dublin Airport through objections.

dslamjack

I can well understand objections to a major fuel line like that (Don't mention Eirgrid +and Shell to sea)let alone the job's of all the fuel tanker drivers that keep the Airport supplied.
The original cost was 250 million in 2007,and looking at the figures to cut the Metro North project in half cost 190 million,and Minister Paschal Donohue said the revised project will also take much longer to deliver than the original proposal and will now not be in place until after 2027.
A record 25 million passengers travelling in 2015. Passenger numbers continue to grow strongly in 2016 with double digit growth recorded in the first two months of this year alone,they predict 30,000 new job's could be created over the next 20 years.

LXFlyer

dslamjack wrote: »

I can well understand objections to a major fuel line like that (Don't mention Eirgrid +and Shell to sea)let alone the job's of all the fuel tanker drivers that keep the Airport supplied.

And yet people are quite happy to have natural gas piped along every street in the city and into their homes??

It's the usual hypocritical nonsense.

dslamjack

Originally posted by lxflyer ;= And yet people are quite happy to have natural gas piped along every street in the city and into their homes??

Yes indeed good ole Nimbyism ... like the folk down the country last week (in Shannon)I think living on a housing estate next to a graveyard complaining about an crematorium being built.
At least it won't be like Newlands cross,ye'd need a sherpa,and a guide and satellite sat nav to find it,and it is slap bang in the middle of one of the largest housing estates in the city.
I mean if you decide to live beside a major cemetery,what do you expect,it's like folk who move to the country and complain about manure/silage smell's or cock's crowing.
The same with folk in Malahide/Portmarnock,if you decide to live in the glide/flightpath of a major airport,ye can hardly complain about noise.
They should be greatfull the old BAC1-11'a and Boeing 707's or Tristar's ain't about any more,now they were right noisy and smelly to boot.

dslamjack

I see the T1 terminal,the Arrival's and façade is to be totally redeveloped in a 10 million euro development and a new office campus adjacent to the former Aer Lingus HQ,6/7 storey office block's with 700 space multi storey car park and sky bridges linking the buildings to the main Terminal's.
Along with the new runway some amount of work and permanent job's will be created.
The new government will I presume be under tremendous pressure to deliver the finance for the original plan of the Metro North to be delivered because failure to do so would leave the Airport isolated commuter and transport wise at the rate passenger numbers are rising.
But it is great news for the whole of Fingal and employment in the area.
I have to say the office project look's impressive here ..http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/daa-to-go-ahead-with-next-phase-of-offices-at-dublin-airport-34648962.html ...... http://www.independent.ie/regionals/fingalindependent/news/t1-to-get-10m-makeover-34637054.html

dslamjack

I was wondering when Michael O'Leary would get around to have a pop at his ''friends'' in the D.A.A.
It seem he reckons that the new runway should cheaper than the 320 million quoted.
He loves the D.A.A , Michael does .... http://www.breakingnews.ie/business/cost-concerns-regarding-new-runway-for-dublin-airport-735315.html

neris

dslamjack wrote: »

I was wondering when Michael O'Leary would get around to have a pop at his ''friends'' in the D.A.A.
It seem he reckons that the new runway should cheaper than the 320 million quoted.
He loves the D.A.A , Michael does .... http://www.breakingnews.ie/business/cost-concerns-regarding-new-runway-for-dublin-airport-735315.html

Hes right any time a public body goes to spend in this country they end up paying way over the top and the public body or givt dont give a fcuk

martinn123

neris wrote: »

Hes right any time a public body goes to spend in this country they end up paying way over the top and the public body or givt dont give a fcuk

Well that's because they need to '' Consult'' a Consultant, who charges a '''Consultancy Fee'', which out-weights any savings the original proposition may have contained.

How much did those ''Modular houses'' in Finglas cost as opposed to the original estimate.

I suppose the C n AG will produce a report in a few years and all will proclame '' Outrage''

E-Voting Machines, anyone?

neris

neris wrote: »

Hes right any time a public body goes to spend in this country they end up paying way over the top and the public body or givt dont give a fcuk

In virtually every country.

MOL railing against Govt/DAA shocker, whatever next.

dslamjack

He's a ticket that Michael O'Leary, he want's to close all the cycle path's and ban cycling as well.
As martinn say's above ,once ye get ''consultant's'' involved ,you may throw your hat at it.
I'm not a great fan of big Mick,but I remember him being interviewed once and being asked about ''consultant's'' - ''What pay 12 over weight ,over paid losers to sit around a table for 12 months only to tell you what your own,over paid management team,should have told you in the first place'',is what he said,and he was right.
Just as well nobody mentioned the new children's hospital at 750 million(not even fitted out)to him or he would have thrown a right wobbler.

Shawn Michaels

Will it comfortably take A380s?

dslamjack

Originally posted by Shawn Michaels -- Will it comfortably take A380s?

I'm no expert, but the new runway is just over 3 thousand meters (around 10,000 feet) , it would just about squeeze in ,I think ,but having said that does the new T2 terminal have gates designed for the A380 ? ... you would hope so.

Well I answered my own question here ... http://www.northcountyleader.ie/2015/08/25/dublin-airport-preparing-for-super-jumbo/

http://flyinginireland.com/2016/04/emirates-to-add-two-additional-a380-aircraft-as-route-network-grows/

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057277222/11

Between the jig's n reels , the new runway will just about meet the requirements for an A380 ,and like wise at a pinch ,it will fit in at T2 .

L1011

The existing runway will take an A380 at the fuel load needed for the destinations its likely to fly to (Dubai, Abu Dhabi, New York if Willie Walsh isn't running his thoughts too fast currently). Nobody is ever going to fly an A380 close to its full range from Dublin. Taxiways and a dual bridge stand are the issues, not the runway.

martinn123

Public meetings to view plans, over the next 2 weeks

http://www.independent.ie/regionals/fingalindependent/news/public-invited-to-runway-meetings-34816753.html

The first one will be held at Roganstown Hotel & Country Club, Naul Road, this Friday, June 24 from 1pm to 8pm and the following day (Saturday, June 25) from 10am to 6pm.
A second round of meetings will be held in the Grand Hotel, Malahide on Friday, July 1 from 1pm to 8pm and on the Saturday from 10am to 6pm.

Arthur Daley

martinn123 wrote: »

Public meetings to view plans, over the next 2 weeks

http://www.independent.ie/regionals/fingalindependent/news/public-invited-to-runway-meetings-34816753.html

So I went along to this. Really the purpose of it is to get feedback on the proposals to lift the ban on flights operating from 11pm to 7am for the new runway. The current permission for the runway provides a restriction on flights operating during those hours. Are folks aware of this? I will add mt own feedback on it, that it might be considered in stages/a compromise position, but not carte blanche given to lifting these restrictions from day one.

But I would encourage anyway who lives anywhere around the airport flight paths to check this out, and consider giving your feedback.

Too late complaining about it in 2020.

Arthur Daley

https://www.dublinairport.com/north-runway/scoping-process-for-proposal-to-change-permitted-operations

dslamjack

As you say Arthur,it will be too late complaining in 2020 ,Aer Rianta/DAA were never good neighbour's to the people in the locality,they nearly depopulated area's bordering it's land's through the use of compulsory purchase order's.
I think it is a foregone conclusion that the DAA will get's it's way,but as you say Arthur if people in the surrounding area's and flightpath's don't complain now and lodge submission's and their concern's it will be too late in the future.

carltonleon

Possibly a silly questions but Where can you see the existing flight paths or the proposed flight paths ?

expectationlost

they say these new EU rules apply re noise from airports they seemed to get rid of any rules and want a "balanced approach"
massive company on one side people on the other....?
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=celex%3A32014R0598

plodder

carltonleon wrote: »

Possibly a silly questions but Where can you see the existing flight paths or the proposed flight paths ?

As regards noise, you could just draw a straight line either side of each runway for 10 to 15km and that gives an idea of the areas most affected by arriving aircraft. The maps at the link below would give you an idea though they are not related to aircraft noise (and the distances look less than 10k)

For what it's worth I live directly under the path for the north/south runway, and even at this time of year when you'd have windows open at night, I think it's only a minor annoyance, that you get used to. Granted, it's not used as much as the main east/west runway.

http://www.transport.ie/sites/default/files/publications/aviation/english/erm-public-safety-zones-report/maps-proposed-public-safety-zones-dublin-airport.pdf

Arthur Daley

The aviation forum thread on this started veering off along the lines of 'well if you don't like it, don't live near an airport'. So that is fairly useless. The permission has been there for more than a decade, but the lifting of restrictions on night time operation of the new runway is a recent development that crept under the radar in recent weeks.

For such a potentially major change to those living along the flight paths I am surprised how low profile this has been, you'd have to go out of your way to find a local politician breaking radio silence on it.

The public consultation event showed some noise 'contours' but I'm not sure they stood up to questioning very well. In particular the likes of holywell in swords and kinsealy on one side and st margarets/ridgewood maybe even river valley on the other side should consider pushing back on the night time operations. And the there are folks in howth/malahide/portmarnock affected by the existing flightpath who need to think of their current flightpath moving a km northwards. There may be other areas opening up to be affected by this that need to consider their feedback.

plodder

plodder wrote: »

For what it's worth I live directly under the path for the north/south runway, and even at this time of year when you'd have windows open at night, I think it's only a minor annoyance, that you get used to. Granted, it's not used as much as the main east/west runway.

OT slightly, but it looks like there's going to be a lot more of this for a year starting in September. The article in the Times is obviously more concerned about the southside (:rolleyes:), but in reality it's going to affect north county Dublin more.

Night flights over south Dublin during runway overhaul

LXFlyer

plodder wrote: »

OT slightly, but it looks like there's going to be a lot more of this for a year starting in September. The article in the Times is obviously more concerned about the southside (:rolleyes:), but in reality it's going to affect north county Dublin more.

Night flights over south Dublin during runway overhaul

Really? It mentions more areas of the northside than the southside.

plodder

lxflyer wrote: »

Really? It mentions more areas of the northside than the southside.

The headline, the first paragraph, the caption on the photo, and this:

The works mean there will be two alternative approaches to the airport. One comes from the northwest over mainly rural areas like The Naul in north Co Dublin.

However, the other path comes in from the east and requires pilots to gradually descend over areas such as Bray, Shankill, Blackrock, Clontarf and Artane before finally reaching Santry when aircraft are around 275m (900ft) above the ground.

.. suggest slightly greater concern for the southside. While the population affected is a lot higher, it doesn't say anything about which direction is more frequently used.

jwwb

#prayforD4

LXFlyer

plodder wrote: »

The headline, the first paragraph, the caption on the photo, and this:

.. suggest slightly greater concern for the southside. While the population affected is a lot higher, it doesn't say anything about which direction is more frequently used.

I was focussing more on the article itself - the second paragraph you quote names three northside areas and three southside areas.

Khannie

jwwb wrote: »

#prayforD4

Reminded me of this: