Would you keep or would you sell?

CiniO

3 years ago I got a 09 Civic 2.2 diesel.
Beautiful car which I really like.
It's comfortable, reasonably fast (8.5s 0-100km/h), nice looking (IMO), and while not big, it's fairly spacious inside. Also cheap to tax, and good on diesel.

When I bought it, it was 3.5 years and 130k km, and now it's 6.5 years old it's at 210k km.
Over those 3 years only problem I had, was wheel bearing which cost me €60 to fix. There was also small problem with A/C compressor which I solved myself with online howto and 2 hours of spare time. No other trouble which I'm fairly impressed.

However now I wonder.
At current mileage, there might be some major investments needed.
Clutch and flywheel are still originals I believe, so once those go (they can't last forever), I will have to fork out over €1000 to get it fixed.
I have a suspicion that exhaust manifold might be cracked, as sometimes there are some fumes inside cabin after starting the engine, and I know cracked manifold is common problem with those engines. If this turns out to be true, it will be also considerable cost. Original honda manifold is around €400, or aftermarket around €200. Unfortunately it's persumably very complicated to change it, so probably good few hundred for garage for labour. So we are talking about €500-€700 depending if I use original or aftermarket.
Also shock absorbers, while still working and passing NCT, are not like new anymore at 210k km, so they would need replacing soon to make car better gripping and handling. Another €500 for parts only for good quality set of shocks. I can fit them myself so no labour cost.
Also sooner or later there probably might be some smaller issues like droplinks, or other suspension elements, etc..
In general looks like I might need to fork out around €2500 over next year or so on this car.


And I wonder if it makes sense to keep it.
Would you reckon once I do the above, the car will last another 4-5 years and another 120-150k km without any major investments?

Alternatively I can sell it now, I guess around €8k is what I could get for it, and once I add this €2.5k which I'd need to invest in it anyway, I could buy something for €10.5k.
But now - are there any cars on the market for €10.5 which would last me 4-5 years and 120-150k km, without any major investments, and be as nice and fun to drive as my current civic, or am I actually more likely to achive this from my car now, after putting this €2.5k in it now?


Any thoughts?

CIP4

Basically to me what it comes down to is you like the car you know the car and as you said to keep it your looking at 2.5k euro. However after spending that you will have a pretty much perfect car which as you mind it could definitely last another 120-150k km will stuff go wrong yes probably, but sure stuff will go wrong with any car over that much mileage.

For 10.5k euro the way secondhand car prices are you would suprise yourself with how little you would buy for the money. Plus your down to a secondhand car with an unknown past to a certain extent and no matter how good you are at spotting bad cars you can still end up with a troublesome one and if you do 2.5k will be nothing to spend on it.

So ultimately if it was me and I liked the car I wouldn't dream of selling it when it's causing no trouble just needs a few bits and pieces done to keep it perfect. Even if you managed to get a well minded car that was perfect chances are it will cost you at least that to keep on the road for 150k km.

Cee-Jay-Cee

I think your being a little over optimistic in the price you could get for your car. A 7 year old civic with 210kms and a few problems and on its original clutch and flywheel is not going to make €8500.

€6000-7000 is probably a more realistic price given the mileage (which is the first thing people look at) I think so doing your calculations again, I'd imagine it would make more sense to spend the money on your current car. The car will easily do close to the sane mileage again with proper maintenance and servicing.

CiniO

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

I think your being a little over optimistic in the price you could get for your car. A 7 year old civic with 210kms and a few problems and on its original clutch and flywheel is not going to make €8500.

€6000-7000 is probably a more realistic price given the mileage (which is the first thing people look at) I think so doing your calculations again,

Well, looking at similar cars on donedeal, most are advertised way above €8k for private sales, and many above €10k from garages.
Mine is with full service history (using only original honda service items like filters). Castrol Edge 0w30 as oil, original honda coolant and original honda gearbox oil. All servicing done exactly to service book.
I strongly believe, I should be able to easily take €8k for it.

I'd imagine it would make more sense to spend the money on your current car. The car will easily do close to the sane mileage again with proper maintenance and servicing.

That sounds good

CiniO

CiniO wrote: »

......
That sounds good

Especially when you consider the clutch & manifold will quite likely not need doing within 12 months of each other

It would only make sense to sell it for €8k as is if you paid less than €12k for it imo 3 years ago, that'd be cheap motoring. Sterling is now as weak as it was in late 2014 but isn't back to where it was in 2013 so you also got a good exchange rate back when you bought it, iirc you went to a car supermarket in the UK.

CiniO

Augeo wrote: »

Especially when you consider the clutch & manifold will quite likely not need doing within 12 months of each other

I don't really know when will the clutch go, but I hardly can believe it lasting much longer, considering people say they normally last between 120k and 200k on those cars.

Manifold - I don't even know if it's cracked or not, but there is a possibility it is.

It would only make sense to sell it for €8k as is if you paid less than €12k for it imo 3 years ago, that'd be cheap motoring. Sterling is now as weak as it was in late 2014 but isn't back to where it was in 2013 so you also got a good exchange rate back when you bought it, iirc you went to a car supermarket in the UK.

Yeap, Cargiant.
Car cost me €10,500 3 years ago, and that's together with cost of flying there, driving car back (fuel, ferry), paying VRT, set of number plates, etc...

Del2005

You'd be crazy to sell a car that you know is good but needs some work, which you know roughly how much it'll cost, for a car you've no idea what condition it's in or what work is needed. Yes you could get another great car which gives no trouble or you could spend €10k on the new car and still get a €2k+ repair bill.

punisher5112

Op I get the wanting to change but if your looking for reliability you already have it them cars will go forever.

Honda are a fantastic machine and nothing in my eyes comes close.

They hold value well also.

I have Octavia with flywheel on its way since 120kmiles 150 now and still going.

Don't change till it badly needs it.

CiniO

CiniO wrote: »

.......
Yeap, Cargiant.
Car cost me €10,500 3 years ago, and that's together with cost of flying there, driving car back (fuel, ferry), paying VRT, set of number plates, etc...

Do you think €10,500 would buy a 2012 now ?

If so and you fancy doing the same again I can see why you are thinking about changing..... the risk being you mightn't get as good a one this time around, you did very well in the repair required dept the last 3 years.

Cee-Jay-Cee

CiniO wrote: »

Well, looking at similar cars on donedeal, most are advertised way above €8k for private sales, and many above €10k from garages.
Mine is with full service history (using only original honda service items like filters). Castrol Edge 0w30 as oil, original honda coolant and original honda gearbox oil. All servicing done exactly to service book.
I strongly believe, I should be able to easily take €8k for it.
)

There are 6 cars between 08 and 09 with similar mileage to yours (I used 180k kms as a lower limit) The cheapest is €5999 and the most expensive is €8950 and being sold by a dealer. If you genuinely want to sell yours then your going to have to price it realistically. €8500 is not realistic with 210k kms regardless of history and never having had a clutch a potential buyer will have to factor that into their offer.

Considering you have had 3 years driving out of the car and only paid €10k for it, your being unrealistic expecting to only have lost €2k in that time and spent virtually nothing on it in that time.

I'm in the market for a car at the moment and considering either a civic or an Accord but will be going to the UK for one as there is nothing next or near as good value here. A nice spec 2010 Civic EX/ES or Si with less than 80k miles and FSH can be landed here and VRT'd for less than €10k.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

.......There are 6 cars between 08 and 09 with similar mileage to yours............ A nice spec 2010 Civic EX/ES or Si with less than 80k miles and FSH can be landed here and VRT'd for less than €10k.

So to be fair an 09 Civic 2.2 diesel at 210k km for €8k would appeal to many imo.
And you should really disregard 08s when looking at comparisons to Cinio's imo.
An 80k 2000 Civic could well be close to needing a clutch too.

On a 6/7 year old car 80k or 120k miles doesn't really have a big effect on the price.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Augeo wrote: »

So to be fair an 09 Civic 2.2 diesel at 210k km for €8k would appeal to many imo.
And you should really disregard 08s when looking at comparisons to Cinio's imo.
.

In that case there are 2 others with similar mileage (;lower limit of 180k) one at €7150 and the other at €8250 with 200k kms on it and that particular car has been for sale for the last 3 months (at least) and the seller has renewed/bumped the ad several times without dropping the price and it remains unsold.

You can argue the cars worth all day long but it's only worth what someone is willing to pay and with that mileage and needing work then it's going to be difficult to sell without dropping the price significantly.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

.....and needing work .....

What work is needed?
What's a significant price drop?

All said and done you reckon €8k isn't right for a 2009 120k miler but just under €10k and a trip to England is good for a 2010 80k miler?

Makes no sense kid.

bear1

Keep it.
At the end of the day you need to go through the hassle of selling and whatnot and then spend more to get something as reliable.
I would rather spend that money on a car I know and like than play a game of how well has this car been looked after?
Besides, the clutch and flywheel aren't causing issues so why include that in the cost? Exhaust manifold issue I believe belongs only to the accord but q need to double check and if its 200e plus labour that's not bad.
A wheel bearing in 3.5 years of ownership in a modern car is fantastic going.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Augeo wrote: »

What work is needed?
What's a significant price drop?

All said and done you reckon €8k isn't right for a 2009 120k miler but just under €10k and a trip to England is good for a 2010 80k miler?

Makes no sense kid.

The mileage is over 130k and the car is on its original clutch and flywheel which are factors which will be considered by potential buyers. The cars I have been looking at are sub 80k as that is the maximum mileage I would consider. I do 10-15k kms miles a year so I'd have a minimum of 4 years driving before I'd hit 130miles/210k kms. It's a huge factor for me and worth the extra money.

At the end of the day he can sell for whatever he thinks it's worth. Whether he'll get that is another story. I have been playing the with the idea of buying an accord or civic since Christmas and have been watching them here and the U.K. and there hasn't been a single car appear for sale here that would have swayed me to buy at home. I have the money ready to buy, I just haven't seen the right car yet (I'm holding out for an accord but looking like I'll end up going for a civic in the end up) I know the prices and I've looked at and driven cars here so I'm giving my honest opinion.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

....... I do 10-15k kms miles a year so I'd have a minimum of 4 years driving before I'd hit 130miles/210k kms. It's a huge factor for me and worth the extra money.

lol, not even 10k miles per annum and you are going "investing" in a low mileage diesel

Cee-Jay-Cee

Augeo wrote: »

lol, not even 10k miles per annum and you are going "investing" in a low mileage diesel

Actually I'm looking at both petrol and diesel cars. There is little or no difference in the price of them in the uk but petrol accords are slightly dearer than their diesel equivalent.

I usually keep my cars for 4 to 5 years and so low mileage now means I can sell with below average miles in a few years again.

Zcott

I'm in the same boat with my Civic. It's a diesel 06, 157k miles, and it really needs an entire front suspension rebuild. The engine seems to be solid but there's a bit of rust underneath on the crossmember after I removed a heat shield a few years ago. The paintwork is in ok condition, and the clutch was done at 100k. I'm tempted to sell it up and move onto something bigger, but those Accords aren't cheap...

corks finest

CiniO wrote: »

3 years ago I got a 09 Civic 2.2 diesel.
Beautiful car which I really like.
It's comfortable, reasonably fast (8.5s 0-100km/h), nice looking (IMO), and while not big, it's fairly spacious inside. Also cheap to tax, and good on diesel.

When I bought it, it was 3.5 years and 130k km, and now it's 6.5 years old it's at 210k km.
Over those 3 years only problem I had, was wheel bearing which cost me €60 to fix. There was also small problem with A/C compressor which I solved myself with online howto and 2 hours of spare time. No other trouble which I'm fairly impressed.

However now I wonder.
At current mileage, there might be some major investments needed.
Clutch and flywheel are still originals I believe, so once those go (they can't last forever), I will have to fork out over €1000 to get it fixed.
I have a suspicion that exhaust manifold might be cracked, as sometimes there are some fumes inside cabin after starting the engine, and I know cracked manifold is common problem with those engines. If this turns out to be true, it will be also considerable cost. Original honda manifold is around €400, or aftermarket around €200. Unfortunately it's persumably very complicated to change it, so probably good few hundred for garage for labour. So we are talking about €500-€700 depending if I use original or aftermarket.
Also shock absorbers, while still working and passing NCT, are not like new anymore at 210k km, so they would need replacing soon to make car better gripping and handling. Another €500 for parts only for good quality set of shocks. I can fit them myself so no labour cost.
Also sooner or later there probably might be some smaller issues like droplinks, or other suspension elements, etc..
In general looks like I might need to fork out around €2500 over next year or so on this car.


And I wonder if it makes sense to keep it.
Would you reckon once I do the above, the car will last another 4-5 years and another 120-150k km without any major investments?

Alternatively I can sell it now, I guess around €8k is what I could get for it, and once I add this €2.5k which I'd need to invest in it anyway, I could buy something for €10.5k.
But now - are there any cars on the market for €10.5 which would last me 4-5 years and 120-150k km, without any major investments, and be as nice and fun to drive as my current civic, or am I actually more likely to achive this from my car now, after putting this €2.5k in it now?


Any thoughts?

Drive on,as a Honda driver myself, as long as she's serviced, safe,drive on,save a few bob,change when u have to

CiniO

Zcott wrote: »

I'm in the same boat with my Civic. It's a diesel 06, 157k miles, and it really needs an entire front suspension rebuild. The engine seems to be solid but there's a bit of rust underneath on the crossmember after I removed a heat shield a few years ago. The paintwork is in ok condition, and the clutch was done at 100k. I'm tempted to sell it up and move onto something bigger, but those Accords aren't cheap...

Entire front suspension rebuilt?
Did you priced what's required?
It's standard McPherson setup, so it's really only a set of wishbones, droplinks, and shocks. Shouldn't be too expensive I'd imagine.

When you say clutch was done at 100k miles, did you change flywheel as well? What was the cost?

Zcott

CiniO wrote: »

Entire front suspension rebuilt?
Did you priced what's required?
It's standard McPherson setup, so it's really only a set of wishbones, droplinks, and shocks. Shouldn't be too expensive I'd imagine.

When you say clutch was done at 100k miles, did you change flywheel as well? What was the cost?

The shocks are done, the top strut mounts are done, and the droplinks will probably need done as well. That 2.2 block is a heavy engine and there are plenty of speed bumps around my house. I haven't priced anything up yet but it'd be north of £500-600.

I did the clutch because it was slipping, and I took it to an indy Honda specialist. He said he'd changed loads of clutches on Civics and not once did the flywheel, so that's what I went for. At 157k now the updated clutch is solid and the flywheel seems fine. I think it was around £500 for the entire job, but it was slipping quite badly and needed done.

The engine light is on at the minute with an inlet manifold runner control problem, possibly related to a gunked-up EGR valve, but it drives ok. I do love this car but it's at the stage where I need to either invest in it or shift it on.

ShadowHearth

Op, you know your car, you know what's wrong with it and what needs fixing.
There are plenty of people like you who sell cars, which need fixing up, it's almost impossible to buy a perfect car with all stuff done, chances are you will buy a car for that 10.5k and put another 2k, because seller got wrid of it just like you.

In my opinion if you are happy with car and it was reliable for you, then keep it. Devil you know is better then the one you don't know.

Gael23

If €2500 is all you can put with it then I wouldn't change. It would be a different story of you were getting hassle. Maybe try and get more cash together over the next year or so and change then.