Tractors with dirty wheels on roads.

JumpShivers

Should tractor drivers not be obliged to hose/brush down their wheels before venturing onto public roads with muck oh their wheels? If I’m not mistaken, it is a serious offence in France to do this and farmers / driver of tractors are obliged by law to carry a brush in the tractor and leaving muck on the road is punishable by a very heavy fine.

Only the other day my other half and I paid to get out car washed and waxed. I know you are taking a risk going onto public roads and the car is bound to get dirty at some stage, but this took the piss.
Before anyone asks, yes, we DID keep our distance between ourselves and the tractor, but there was still muck and debris flying off the wheel dirtying up the car again. There was even a couple of grape-sized stones that were flung up at the windscreen.

What if the stones had chipped or cracked the windscreen? Would his insurance have to cover it? What if he refused to pull over to acknowledge the damage? We’d have a claim on our policy. Worse still would be some unfortunate cyclist getting whacked in the face with this.

coylemj

This is Ireland, farmers can do what they like.

tradhead

Surely this is either a wind-up or one of the most ridiculous first world problems ever?!

Kristopherus

I thought it was an offence not to clean up the roads dirtied by the wheels of agricultural vehicles/machinery.

VincePP

Keep a bigger distance next time.

No law in france about that. Same as no law in france about carrying spare bulbs - everyone thinks france has weird driving laws.

Muahahaha

As a motorbiker I wish farmers would do something about this, wet mud on the roads can be like ice to motorbikers, especially if you come across it on a bend and are already leaning over

blondchick

Would you like the tractors to stop and go through the wash on the way out of the fields? Oh I forgot there isn't one. One of those things. What do you expect them go do?

John_Rambo

tradhead wrote: »

Surely this is either a wind-up or one of the most ridiculous first world problems ever?!

Love the "first world problem" posts! Motorbike riders have an awful first world problem with sliding down roads on their bums and smashing in to trees and ditches. I think a farmer in Northern Ireland was done for mucking up the road, covering cats eyes and markings.

Damien360

John_Rambo wrote: »

Love the "first world problem" posts! Motorbike riders have an awful first world problem with sliding down roads on their bums and smashing in to trees and ditches.

Let me put it this way so. Motorbike rider slides off bike on greasy road and bike slams into family car. Either way people are getting hurt.

I came across a filthy road out of a field in monasterevin and I could follow the trail of dirt to the farmers house a half mile away. It was on a bend which was no problem for me but I could see the danger for bikers and warned one on the way back down the same road later. Is it too much to ask that the excess dirt is removed before exiting on to a road ?

John_Rambo

Damien360 wrote: »

Let me put it this way so. Motorbike rider slides off bike on greasy road and bike slams into family car. Either way people are getting hurt.

I came across a filthy road out of a field in monasterevin and I could follow the trail of dirt to the farmers house a half mile away. It was on a bend which was no problem for me but I could see the danger for bikers and warned one on the way back down the same road later. Is it too much to ask that the excess dirt is removed before exiting on to a road ?

I'm in agreement with responsible use or roads and clean ups after mega muck spillages dude! I honestly don't think it will happen though.

KatW4

Some farmers do clean up the road after themselves. My boyfriend and his dad come out with a road sweeper and clean up after themselves.

dev100

blondchick wrote:

Would you like the tractors to stop and go through the wash on the way out of the fields? Oh I forgot there isn't one. One of those things. What do you expect them go do?

See what happens if there's an accident because of crap on the road . The farmer would feel his ASS hole clenching with a summons and a costly claim . I know of an agri contractor who left oil or diesel slick on a road and a car overturned . Cops followed the slick back to his yard .

You will see some having a rotary brush cleaning the road for that reason .

It's mostly dumper lorries pulling out onto road when dumpling soil in fields are the biggest culprit .

Btw a little muck doesn't bother me either

dev100

KatW4 wrote:

Some farmers do clean up the road after themselves. My boyfriend and his dad come out with a road sweeper and clean up after themselves.

Fair play to them

KatW4

dev100 wrote:

Fair play to them

Didn't stop a neighbour reporting them to the council in the 5 minutes it took them to get the road sweeper out.

I do hate driving through mucky roads but I think people need to give them a break too.

the_pen_turner

the main reason for crap on the roads (besides selfish idiots) is farmers that don't have proper drainage inside the gate, that's the area there the most traffic is and its usually full of water .
also trailers with double wheels pull a lot of crap out between the 2 tires.

my uncle has a farm and one field is down the road a bit. he was sick of cleaning the crap off the road all the time so he fixed it.
he put a strip of stone one the way in/out that is higher than the field and put a drainage channel beside it . it is fenced off so the cattle cant get onto it and muck it up.
once a year he scrapes it and puts more stone on it. now there is no crap on the road and he never has to clean up.

one the plus side too he can pull in off the road before opening the gate.

dev100

KatW4 wrote:

Didn't stop a neighbour reporting them to the council in the 5 minutes it took them to get the road sweeper out.

KatW4 wrote:

I do hate driving through mucky roads but I think people need to give them a break too.

Nice neighbours

snaps

Here in Poland, especially the rural area I live, it is policed very heavily. Its all traffic that has to keep the roads clean of mud. A few weeks ago I witnessed the Police following dirt tracks back to a wood business and they were told to clear the roads from mud.

Its one thing you often see at the end of the working day, people outside businesses sweeping mud off roads.

GM228

Kristopherus wrote: »

I thought it was an offence not to clean up the roads dirtied by the wheels of agricultural vehicles/machinery.

A local authority can give notice to the farmer to remove it from the road.

It's an offence to deposit anything on a road which may present a hazard to other road users under the Roads Act 1993 so they should be cleaning their wheels before entering the roadway.

In the UK almost identical wording is in the Highways Act 1980 and most authorities and indeed legal representatives of farmers have confirmed that mud, slurry etc is covered by this and so is illegal for farmers to allow mud fall onto the road from their tractors. It's been confirmed in the UK that they can also be done for dangerous driving and I suppose that could also come into play here.

In 2011 Cork Co. Co. also confirmed and highlighted this to local farmers.

http://www.thejournal.ie/cowpat-gate-cork-farmers-told-to-clean-up-after-their-cattle-232575-Sep2011/

Fatswaldo

blondchick wrote: »

Would you like the tractors to stop and go through the wash on the way out of the fields? Oh I forgot there isn't one. One of those things. What do you expect them go do?

Clean their vehicles! I work for a construction company - we have to install wheel washes on large sites to clean muddy vehicles and on smaller sites we use smaller power washers to do the same. Same rules apply for farmers.

Jawgap

tradhead wrote: »

Surely this is either a wind-up or one of the most ridiculous first world problems ever?!

I'd see it as a moderately serious safety issue (worries about damaged paint aside).

There's a farmer near us doesn't give a sh1t - or rather he does, but he gives all the sh1t to the road. He leaves the road in an awful mess around his yard (which drains on to the road) meaning in wet weather it's muddy and slippy and in icy weather there's usually a small strip of ice across the road.

It's bad enough in a car, but trying to get through his 'debris' on a motor bike or pedal bike is not easy - I always pity anyone swinging round the bend who doesn't know what a dirt bird he is.

Complain to the council and your told you live in an agricultural area :rolleyes:

ongarite

Laws like the OP suggesting apply to construction machinery with dedicated road sweepers & power hoses knocking off loose mud/gravel before entering public roads.

I can't understand why something like this couldn't apply to farm machinery, which can be just as large & heavy as dumper trucks.

Fatswaldo

It does apply, same legislation (for last 23 years!). Roads Act 1993 as previously posted by another

GM228

ongarite wrote: »

Laws like the OP suggesting apply to construction machinery with dedicated road sweepers & power hoses knocking off loose mud/gravel before entering public roads.

I can't understand why something like this couldn't apply to farm machinery, which can be just as large & heavy as dumper trucks.

It applies to any road user. Construction, commercial and agricultural or even a private car (not that a car could drop as much as a tractor).

CJhaughey

Jawgap wrote: »

Complain to the council and your told you live in an agricultural area :rolleyes:

Write to them and quote the 1993 SI to them and specifically section 76 No 13(b)
Make it clear that they have responsibility for this and that a duty of care falls on them as the local authority in charge of the road.
Copy this to the NRA as well.

Jawgap

CJhaughey wrote: »

Write to them and quote the 1993 SI to them and specifically section 76 No 13(b)
Make it clear that they have responsibility for this and that a duty of care falls on them as the local authority in charge of the road.
Copy this to the NRA as well.

I did point out the obligation (though not the statute) and followed up in writing making it clear that in the event of any incident they were now on notice.

I didn't think to copy the NRA (or whatever they've called now) or, for that matter, the RSA, but I did mention it once to the local traffic sergeant (who comes along occasionally to the school parents' council meetings) - he promised to have a word with the farmer, but basically said it's a 'roads' rather than a 'traffic' issue.

The daft thing is - as a few have pointed out - a nearby construction site has wheel washes in place for heavy traffic coming off their site!

Muahahaha

In fairness to farmers most do't have the space to be installing wheel washes between their farm gate and the road. But what they could do is get a stiff yard brush and scrub the main lumps of mud off the rear tyres where of their tractor where mud mainly gets lodged.

There was a motorbiker killed in the Lake District only last summer due to a farmer spreading muck on the roads. It is a freak event in the grand scheme of things but at the same time a family is left without a brother all because a farmer was irresponsible and didn't clean his tyres. Its not much to ask when others could potentially lose their lives from this negligence

Fatswaldo

Fatswaldo wrote: »

Clean their vehicles! I work for a construction company - we have to install wheel washes on large sites to clean muddy vehicles and on smaller sites we use smaller power washers to do the same. Same rules apply for farmers.

Its totally impractical to expect a farmer who is spending his day driving in and out of a field going about is work in the limited time he has to keep stopping and hosing down the tractor it would take ages to do it. There may be no running water either and the risk of something like a powerhose being stolen if left in a field is extremely high.

Some people need to catch a hold of themselves, this is Ireland and agriculture is part of our country just because you sit in an office everyday doesn't give you some right to tell farmers to keep off the roads who are putting food on your table and trying to earn a lively hood for themselves. People who suggest things like tractors shouldn't be on the road at certain time or that they should have to clean the tractor after every time leaving a field which could be 10's of times per day haven't even got the slightest ounce of a clue about the practicalities and difficulties of farming.

BronsonTB

MAG Ireland has brought up this issue a few times.

Famers/All road users are responsible to clean up if they make an excessive mess on the roads. Local Council are suppose to enforce it with fines if not adhered too.

bladespin

Emmet Breezy Flannel wrote: »

Its totally impractical to expect a farmer who is spending his day driving in and out of a field going about is work in the limited time he has to keep stopping and hosing down the tractor it would take ages to do it. There may be no running water either and the risk of something like a powerhose being stolen if left in a field is extremely high.

Some people need to catch a hold of themselves, this is Ireland and agriculture is part of our country just because you sit in an office everyday doesn't give you some right to tell farmers to keep off the roads who are putting food on your table and trying to earn a lively hood for themselves. People who suggest things like tractors shouldn't be on the road at certain time or that they should have to clean the tractor after every time leaving a field which could be 10's of times per day haven't even got the slightest ounce of a clue about the practicalities and difficulties of farming.

Sorry but that is just madness.

You're responsible for the mess you leave behind, there's a good possibility that- in the case of an accident the farmer could be held responsible.
How could you live with yourself if someone died as a result of this kind of negligence? A pat on the back at a good day's work?

tradhead

bladespin wrote: »

Sorry but that is just madness.

You're responsible for the mess you leave behind, there's a good possibility that- in the case of an accident the farmer could be held responsible.
How could you live with yourself if someone died as a result of this kind of negligence? A pat on the back at a good day's work?

To be fair, there's a big difference between an accident being called by excessive muck being left on the road (which the farmer could try to go back and brush off, if it was particularly bad) and people giving out about their newly washed cars and saying that farmers should have to wash their wheels every time they leave the farmyard. The latter is just ludicrous!

There's a shocking amount of bad feeling towards farmers in this thread, it's really not nice.

Jawgap

Emmet Breezy Flannel wrote: »

Its totally impractical to expect a farmer who is spending his day driving in and out of a field going about is work in the limited time he has to keep stopping and hosing down the tractor it would take ages to do it. There may be no running water either and the risk of something like a powerhose being stolen if left in a field is extremely high.

Some people need to catch a hold of themselves, this is Ireland and agriculture is part of our country just because you sit in an office everyday doesn't give you some right to tell farmers to keep off the roads who are putting food on your table and trying to earn a lively hood for themselves. People who suggest things like tractors shouldn't be on the road at certain time or that they should have to clean the tractor after every time leaving a field which could be 10's of times per day haven't even got the slightest ounce of a clue about the practicalities and difficulties of farming.

No one is suggesting they be pristine, just that the time is taken to knock the worst of the muck off, close valves on tanks properly etc.

And while yes, farmers put food on all our tables, are they also not supposed to be custodians of the environment.......and I didn't even mention the taxpayer funded subsidies and support they receive from all of us

freedominacup

Emmet Breezy Flannel wrote: »

Its totally impractical to expect a farmer who is spending his day driving in and out of a field going about is work in the limited time he has to keep stopping and hosing down the tractor it would take ages to do it. There may be no running water either and the risk of something like a powerhose being stolen if left in a field is extremely high.

Some people need to catch a hold of themselves, this is Ireland and agriculture is part of our country just because you sit in an office everyday doesn't give you some right to tell farmers to keep off the roads who are putting food on your table and trying to earn a lively hood for themselves. People who suggest things like tractors shouldn't be on the road at certain time or that they should have to clean the tractor after every time leaving a field which could be 10's of times per day haven't even got the slightest ounce of a clue about the practicalities and difficulties of farming.

I'm a farmer and the practicalities are you lput out warning signs to let motorists know about slippery conditions and heavy machinery crossing/turning while you are working. If conditions are very bad you need to make some effort during the day to clean the road and when you are finished a tanker of clean water will go most of the way to getting the road back to normal.

Wheel washes etc for a job that may only last a couple of hours are not remotely practical and the comparison doesn't with a site running for months doesn't stand up. I've seen plenty of wheel washes on sites over the years. Not too many of them worked a lot of the time.

Doctors differ and patients for as they say. In this area the council gangers/foremen would be in fairly lively to remind you of your obligations if conditions were bad. No one really expects a road sweeper standing by while the job is ongoing but everyone expects the road to be cleaned once the job is complete. Simple really.

GM228

Jawgap wrote: »

I did mention it once to the local traffic sergeant (who comes along occasionally to the school parents' council meetings) - he promised to have a word with the farmer, but basically said it's a 'roads' rather than a 'traffic' issue.

"Roads" or "traffic" makes no odds, it's an offence and should be investigated as such by the Gardaí if a complaint is made.

Muahahaha

Emmet Breezy Flannel wrote: »

Its totally impractical to expect a farmer who is spending his day driving in and out of a field going about is work in the limited time he has to keep stopping and hosing down the tractor it would take ages to do it. There may be no running water either and the risk of something like a powerhose being stolen if left in a field is extremely high.

Some people need to catch a hold of themselves, this is Ireland and agriculture is part of our country just because you sit in an office everyday doesn't give you some right to tell farmers to keep off the roads who are putting food on your table and trying to earn a lively hood for themselves. People who suggest things like tractors shouldn't be on the road at certain time or that they should have to clean the tractor after every time leaving a field which could be 10's of times per day haven't even got the slightest ounce of a clue about the practicalities and difficulties of farming.

Its nothing to do with people who work in offices telling farmers what to do, it is in the Road Traffic Act that they are obliged not to create hazardous conditions on the roads. Motorbikers have lost their lives because of mud on the road so while some farmers may think it is harmless it clearly is not when the worst consequence is someone losing their life.

No-one is asking farmers to build wheel washes or have power washers at the ready. A simple yard brushing of the rear tyres of a tractor would get rid of the vast majority of the muck that ends up on their tyres. It is literally 90 seconds work. I don't think that is too much to ask, if I was a farmer I'd rather do that than have the death of someone innocent on my conscience due to not doing it.

selectamatic

Jawgap wrote: »

No one is suggesting they be pristine, just that the time is taken to knock the worst of the muck off, close valves on tanks properly etc.

And while yes, farmers put food on all our tables, are they also not supposed to be custodians of the environment.......and I didn't even mention the taxpayer funded subsidies and support they receive from all of us

I'd agree with all said here except for the last bit.
The reasoning behind subsidies is to allow farmers to provide cheap food to the masses, it was pioneered by the uk government after wwII to solve the problems surrounding rationing and food shortages and has been around ever since. Fresh produce is being sold at artificially low prices so if subsidies were gotten rid of it'd just result in food going up in price, something which would be disastrous given the current cost of living and the gap between the minimum wage and the "living wage" and also the struggles of those close to the poverty line. Subsidies are there for a reason, to think the government are just throwing out free money to farmers for no reason at all is extremely naive.

Relating to mucky tractor wheels I find driving at low speed with one pair of wheels very near the verge for the first couple of hundred yards after leaving a field to be a very effective method of limiting the amount of muck lost on the road, so much so that whats lost really causes no issues to other road users as whatever little falls off is out of the path of other road users tyres. It's the lads swinging out onto the road and flooring it driving sh1te up the height of the roof of the tractor that takes the p1ss really.
Also those wheel washers on construction sites are usually ridiculously ineffective, at least most of the ones I've seen on Irish sites anyways.

screamer

Fatswaldo wrote: »

Clean their vehicles! I work for a construction company - we have to install wheel washes on large sites to clean muddy vehicles and on smaller sites we use smaller power washers to do the same. Same rules apply for farmers.

Yep they just don't follow them. Same for cow **** when they let their cows cross the roads and the state of the road outside farmers places all eaten away from the cow ****. They should be fined and charged for not cleaning up after themselves. It'll take a few legal cases where the crap they leave on the road causes accidents and they have to sell sizeable portions of their land to pay compo before they change their behaviour.

irishgeo

Jawgap wrote: »

I'd see it as a moderately serious safety issue (worries about damaged paint aside).

There's a farmer near us doesn't give a sh1t - or rather he does, but he gives all the sh1t to the road. He leaves the road in an awful mess around his yard (which drains on to the road) meaning in wet weather it's muddy and slippy and in icy weather there's usually a small strip of ice across the road.

It's bad enough in a car, but trying to get through his 'debris' on a motor bike or pedal bike is not easy - I always pity anyone swinging round the bend who doesn't know what a dirt bird he is.

Complain to the council and your told you live in an agricultural area :rolleyes:

The guards might be a better option. If there is a complaint they generally have to follow it up.

gctest50

irishgeo wrote: »

The guards might be a better option. If there is a complaint they generally have to follow it up.

Grants for underpasses is what should be done

https://www.facebook.com/cumminsvoortman/posts/126683214171352

http://www.farmersjournal.ie/precast-walls-make-underpass-a-fast-job-162388

where possible of course

Noccy_Mondy

I often drive a tractor and there's nothing you can do with dirt on the wheels (esp this time of year with the land so wet and mucky) coming out of a field, you'd be all day cleaning the dirt off. What I try to do is drive with one wheel close/on the verge and the other in the centre bit (between where the car tyres do be). That way there should be less dirt being thrown up onto the sides of cars. Seeing dirt on the road is a pet hate of my own, especially after cleaning the car - I'd always go back with a shovel and brush and try to take most of it away.

Nekarsulm

Jawgap wrote: »

No one is suggesting they be pristine, just that the time is taken to knock the worst of the muck off, close valves on tanks properly etc.

And while yes, farmers put food on all our tables, are they also not supposed to be custodians of the environment.......and I didn't even mention the taxpayer funded subsidies and support they receive from all of us

Good job you didn't mention the taxpayer funded subsidies and supports, because you (plural) don't provide any.
Funds for subsidies come from EU funds.

Jawgap

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Good job you didn't mention the taxpayer funded subsidies and supports, because you (plural) don't provide any.
Funds for subsidies come from EU funds.

Oh dear......

.......where does the EU get its money from?

The EU Budget is funded by the member states of European Union and over 90% of the money is transferred back to them. The rest is used to cover the running costs of the EU institutions.

There are basically three sources of funding for the EU. The largest source of income is a contribution by each member state, which is based on each country’s GNI. For Ireland this contribution was about €978 Million in 2012. Secondly, the EU receives shares from each states value added tax (The Irish contribution being €191 Million in 2012). The third major component of income are traditional own resources, for example import duties on goods from outside the EU (Ireland: €204 Million in 2012). The member states are allowed to keep a part (25%) of the traditional own resources received to cover for administration costs. Additional money is received from fines on companies breaching European Competition Law, etc.

Ireland is a net recipient of European funds and this will remain the case throughout the current financial plan until 2020. In 2012 Ireland contributed €1.24 Billion to the EU Budget and €2.01 Billion of EU funds were spent on projects in Ireland.......

dutopia

I agree with the OP. I would be better if tractor tires were roughly washed down before entering a public road.

Popoutman

Living in a country area, I can appreciate both sides of the story.
I do think that farmers should just do their civic duty and try to get the worst of the crap off the vehicles before moving onto the road. So what if it takes an extra 2 min each time coming out of a field. If there's regular traffic during a job then it would be acceptable to have correct signage up, and then clearing up the road at lunch and day's end. We have the right to bring the machinery onto the public road, and part of that is the responsibility to other road users to not create a danger.

It's not really about the unnecessary damage to a freshly cleaned car (though I do appreciate that this is a pain in the ass) but it's certainly about having roads that are safe to drive.

A few years back when the lighting rules were fully enforced on farming machinery, there was a similar outcry about how hard it would be on the farmers to comply. Nowadays, every farm machine that I see on the public road is properly lit up, and there have been far fewer crashes into the back of unlit farm machinery. It requires an attitude change on the part of the farmers, and that's no harm really.

biko

I think a penalty fee would quickly make sure farmers carried a broom/brush with them and would at least get the worst off before moving onto a public road.

That said, I'm not a farmer so can't judge how much work this would entail.


http://www.nfu-cymru.org.uk/news/latest-news/mud-on-roads-left-by-tractors-or-heavy-machinery/

blackbox

blondchick wrote: »

Would you like the tractors to stop and go through the wash on the way out of the fields? Oh I forgot there isn't one. One of those things. What do you expect them go do?

In other countries they have a hose at the gate and wash the wheels before going onto the public road.

.