Cheltenham Review/debrief

sdoc13

Another great festival and a long wait until the next one. Some exceptional performances and some disappointments.

Day 1
Dovan looked spectacular really looking forward to him next year and will be intersting to see where they go with him and what he targets.

Annie Power winning in such style was spectacular. Finally fulfilled all of the promise. Would love to see her and Faugheen go head to head but it will never happen. I would have also loved to see her go chasing to see what she could do but its probably too late for that. Any thoughts on what they will do with her and Faugheen next year. Seems madness if they dont target her at the champion again next year.

Altior was also very good on day 1. Him and Yorkhill going head to head over a fence next year would be one to really look forward to.

Day 2.

Sprinter Sacre, my good. I genuinely didnt think we would see that level of performance from him again. Superb training performance and a fantastic result for racing.

Yorkhill looks a machine and I think he will be an even better chaser. Apartently Ruby got off him and said he would win the Arkle next year. Future Gold Cup horse i would imagine.

The RSA was a real disappointment for me as NMH(RIP) and MOT just didnt show what I hoped they could do due to injury. I though Shaneshill ran a cracker and was unlucky due to drifting across the track. Could pick up some nice races over 2.5 to 3m next year.

Day 3.

I am still disappointed that vatour didnt run in the gold cup. Would love to have seen him give it a go. Impressive on the day and thought he jumped superbly.

Thistlecrack was unreal. Didnt think he was as good. Phenomenal. Could be a serious chaser if they go that route,

Black Hercules was a suprise to me. Though it had no chance over 2.5m. Fair play to Mullins for figuring him out, Limni was impressive but I guess she will stick to the mares route and could possibly be targeted at a flat campaign later in the year.

Day 4. Young up and coming trainer day.
Don Cossack was really good. Pity Cue Card didnt stay up to make it as true a race as possible but DC was top drawer today. Delighted for Copper who seems a genuinely nice fella and has had a tough couple of seasons. Delighed for Elliot too another top young trainer.

Joseph O Brien could be a huge player in the NH arena over the coming years. Be intersting to see how him and his operation develop.

Great to see H Fry and D Skelton get a winner two really top class young trainers.

Nina Carberry does not get credit she deserves, another superb ride on on the fringe. See really is a top class pilot.

From a punting perspective I had a profitable festival mostly from mug doubles and trebles that most of the punters had on., Had a decent win with yorkhill. Handicaps were a disaster for me didnt get near a place never mind a winner. Johns Spirit was a disappointment but he hit 2 fences hard and was done. Johnjoes didnt seem to be firing well this week anyway.

Gamebred

Personally think Vautour should've run in the GC worst case scenario he'd of placed,I dont think theres any concrete evidence he doesnt stay,one run over 3m in inconclusive.

sdoc13

Gamebred wrote: »

Personally think Vautour should've run in the GC worst case scenario he'd of placed,I dont think theres any concrete evidence he doesnt stay,one run over 3m in inconclusive.

I fully agree especially on todays ground. Possible he will never get these ideal conditions again. Really think it was a shocking decision from both Ricci and Mullins who have both stated the Gold Cup is the Number 1 aim. Take your chance when you have it. If he failed always the Ryanair next year,

Gamebred

sdoc13 wrote: »

I fully agree especially on todays ground. Possible he will never get these ideal conditions again. Really think it was a shocking decision from both Ricci and Mullins who have both stated the Gold Cup is the Number 1 aim. Take your chance when you have it. If he failed always the Ryanair next year,

Yeah nobody remembers a ryanair winner,hes in his prime now at the moment they should've ran him and found out if he stayed or not,his king george form was franked again today a complete machine of a horse,


Im not sure its a great idea sending Thistlecrack chasing next year hes no spring chicken if hes a natural work away but personally would mind if he mopped up a few world hurdles,


Dont say anything in the novice staying division for long distance chasing next year Alpha des obeaux would be a nice prospect for the rsa.

Gamebred

Will Cue Card come over to face Don Cossack in Punchestown? cracking race hopefully.

abarkie

Gamebred wrote: »

Will Cue Card come over to face Don Cossack in Punchestown? cracking race hopefully.

I hope so to.

Flights and tickets already booked

I wonder if Sprinter Sacre will come over also, but I think after Henderson's comments about previous trip - I would assume not

Ben Gadot

All things considered the week belonged to 4 horses: Sprinter Sacre, Don Cossack, Annie Power and Thistlecrack in that order.

What can you say about the Champion Chase? When De Boinville pulled the trigger on SS it felt like everything stopped for a moment. A genuinely stunning moment where Ruby didn't instantly react. Once he did, UDS wasn't up to the fight. I was dubious towards SS and had put my weight behind another former champion in Sire De Grugy, but I was firmly put in my place. Can't say enough about what Sprinter Sacre achieved on Wednesday. One of the true greats.

As for Don Cossack, this was a horse that people loved to knock and he duly told them to shove it when it mattered most. The scary thing about his performance on Friday is that it wasn't a completely perfect round of jumping yet still won readily. He's a class animal pure and simple.

As for Annie she finally got her moment to bask in glory. Some people have said it's sad that they had her competing in the mares last year, but what I find even sadder is that it's the mares that she'll probably be in next year.

Then there's Thistlecrack, a horse that went off at a price he should never gone off at, and it was mainly down to pundits bizarrely trying to lay doubts about the ground, horses being primed to pounce or trying to question the form. Unlike Yanworth, Thistlecrack did not flatter to deceive and accelerated to victory in a manner that would other provoke excitement for what's next.

It may be controversial but I was unmoved by the performances of Douvan and Vautour. Douvan did exactly what was expected in a really poor division and Vautour was rerouted to a considerably inferior race from where he was initially pencilled in for. Both horses are serious animals but all they did this year was maintain their reputations, not enhance them. They'll have no choice but to put Douvan next year on a collision course with one of his highly rated stablemates. As for Vautour, there shouldn't be any dicking around next year, gold cup or nothing.

Flop of the week of course goes to Un de Sceaux. I knew it would obviously be his sternest test of his career but the way he tamely contested the finish was shocking. When De Boinville went past Ruby the latter's demeanour was either one of shock or one of knowing defeat. It was a really bizarre moment to watch unfold.

sting60

The one horse that is going to get hammered by Phil Smith is Cause of Causes because the English handicapper does not like horse tearing up a handicap as he did especially if it's Irish trained.I believe he could get 20 lb hike or more so Has to run in the National (did he have a hard race compared to what Don Poli got) time will tell but he will get hammered.

posturingpat

sting60 wrote: »

The one horse that is going to get hammered by Phil Smith is Cause of Causes because the English handicapper does not like horse tearing up a handicap as he did especially if it's Irish trained.I believe he could get 20 lb hike or more so Has to run in the National (did he have a hard race compared to what Don Poli got) time will tell but he will get hammered.

Can't see him getting more than 14lb personally,i'd be inclined to think about 10lb but Smith is a joke at times and seems to hate Elliott so you'd never know. If he does get 10lb he'd still be competitive in staying handicap chases mind you. If he gets into the national off his current mark he has to be backed,the race'd be perfect for him and we know he's well treated.

He's some horse, won the Ladbroke hurdle over 2 mile at Ascot and goes on to win over 4mile at Cheltenham Festival as well as winning last week too and placing in the same race 2 years previous,phenomenal horse and training by Elliott, clear as day he was aiming COC for that race all year and he had him fine tuned to perfection.

posturingpat

We know now that Don Cossack can handle the track that's for sure

ste2010

The don poli ride was shocking..as much of a genious davy is I d be pretty certain he did exactly what he was told not to (this wouldn't be for th first time). His love for riding horses miles out the back off the pace seems to be more frequent as the days go on..you can't do that on a horse like don poli. Terrible decision
Vautour will win the gold cup next year. The ryanair is fine prep for it (imperial commander, cue card, don cossak etc). I think the idea that a horse doesn't stay 3m 2 when he's a 6 or 7 year can change with age and training when they're 8+. I think he'll be a stronger horse for it next year and also believe trainers give up on young horses when they ask them to do too much too soon. I also think people are too black and white with their judgement on stayers. A horse who's leading a bunch of 3milers from the start getting pipped on the line as he's empty might well be the jockey just have got the fractions wrong and not necessarily not a stayer. I've heard people say a horse who came second by a neck to top class horses over 3m branded as non stayers too often..it's nonsense
All credit to don Cossack I could never see it. Delighted for Elliott

ste2010

As for cause of causes - that'll probably be the last race he'll win in his career. Straight to dr richard new land to see if he can find a few more lbs somewhere

ste2010

Lastly - the UDS loss to sprinter sacre. Mullins or Ruby weren't expecting a big performance from him based on their pre race interviews. Id be prepared to draw line through that race

IanOBo

ste2010 wrote: »

As for cause of causes - that'll probably be the last race he'll win in his career. Straight to dr richard new land to see if he can find a few more lbs somewhere

Besides the Grand National....

sting60

ste2010 wrote: »

As for cause of causes - that'll probably be the last race he'll win in his career. Straight to dr richard new land to see if he can find a few more lbs somewhere

I agree .Noel O Brien will be targeted by members of the board of Irish racing to keep him competitive but my assumptions are that he will be murdered by Smith.Looking at the race in real terms 20 Lbs cannot be that harch. As he cannot get more than 5lbs for the National is well treated but Don Poli is miles ahead on his mark.I love Davy but imagine young Kennedy on the horse,yes please even at his weight Don Poli should laugh at these.

Shemale

posturingpat wrote: »

We know now that Don Cossack can handle the track that's for sure

I would oppose him again in a strong field, he was able to finish to his own liking, the major danger to him exited at the third last and Vautour didnt line up.

He fell after a number of mistakes in the RSA and Uxizandre jumped him ragged last year, decent horses in KG at business end he puts down.

Shemale

ste2010 wrote: »

Lastly - the UDS loss to sprinter sacre. Mullins or Ruby weren't expecting a big performance from him based on their pre race interviews. Id be prepared to draw line through that race

Completely agree, I was really worried about the ground and signs of Sprinter getting back to himself.

Still pissed off at SS last year, had a big bet him and big fourfold on Don Poli, Vautour and Windsor Park let down by him and he repays me by beating UDS!!

Gamebred

How Sprinter can go from being lapped and pulled up to that good again is far fetched,they dont call him chemical nicky for nothing.

BumperD

"They never come back" - how many times have we heard that?

Sprinter Sacre.

Gamebred

BumperD wrote: »

"They never come back" - how many times have we heard that?

Sprinter Sacre.

Thats the thing,they come back alright under the right substances,im very skeptical about that performance,was butchered to beat SDG only weeks ago in kempton then produces that,incredible really.

BumperD

It was only his second run back at Kempton. He was entitled to come on a bit fitness wise given how long he was off but I know what your getting at. Think he won fairly, maybe UDS had an off day, it was run at a frenetic pace.

BumperD

If anyone wants to watch re-runs, they are on RUK right now.

Gamebred

BumperD wrote: »

It was only his second run back at Kempton. He was entitled to come on a bit fitness wise given how long he was off but I know what your getting at. Think he won fairly, maybe UDS had an off day, it was run at a frenetic pace.

Yeah race fell apart all right UDS probably a bit overated (was by me anyways) and underperformed a tad too on the ground,shocked SS was able to find so much when he came off the bridle,was on UDS but didnt mind as much losing to a legend like SS who I wanted retired tbh.

Ben Gadot

Gamebred wrote: »

How Sprinter can go from being lapped and pulled up to that good again is far fetched,they dont call him chemical nicky for nothing.

Chemical Nicky? Never heard that one, what's the story behind it?

Gamebred

Ben Gadot wrote: »

Chemical Nicky? Never heard that one, what's the story behind it?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/horseracing/5731743/Nicky-Henderson-banned-for-three-months-over-doping-of-Queens-horse-Moonlit-Path.html

ziggy

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Gamebred

ziggy wrote: »

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Willie Druggins :pac: I have my suspicions over his stable tbh too,some shady stuff being swept under the carpet there that ive heard of.

BumperD

ziggy wrote: »

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Link.

ziggy

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mdwexford

UDS is probably the most over rated horse in training.

He's never really beaten a horse of note, first time push came to shove and he didn't want to know it looked like.

2 mile chase division is in the doldrums, that wasn't within 20 pounds of Sprinter Sacre at his peak.

He would have beat that lot a distance in 2013.