Speeding fine - can I ask for evidence without going to court?

El_Dangeroso

I was pulled over by a guard a few weeks ago doing 10kph over the speed limit.

I didn't actually know I was going over the speed limit for sure, the guard said I was but did not clock me from a stationary position, he was just driving behind me (unmarked vehicle).

I have no issue in paying the fine if indeed I was going over, but am I entitled to ask for evidence of this without challenging the speeding fine and risking 5 points instead of 3? Do they have to provide evidence in this case or is the Guard's word gospel?

visual

El_Dangeroso wrote: »

I was pulled over by a guard a few weeks ago doing 10kph over the speed limit.

I didn't actually know I was going over the speed limit for sure, the guard said I was but did not clock me from a stationary position, he was just driving behind me (unmarked vehicle).

I have no issue in paying the fine if indeed I was going over, but am I entitled to ask for evidence of this without challenging the speeding fine and risking 5 points instead of 3? Do they have to provide evidence in this case or is the Guard's word gospel?

Gardaí word is all that is needed by court. To rebut a garda witness account you would need compelling evidence and word of a passenger supporting your claim wouldn't be sufficient.

sogood

That seems odd. If a Guards' word is sufficient, why don't they just stand at the side of the road and watch cars going past and decide who's speeding? Why do their speed cameras have to be very specifically calibrated, to ensure accuracy?

I thought a Guard driving behind/alongside you wasn't sufficient, as it has to be proven that their speedo is absolutely accurate and in law, it's not an accurate speed calibration device, which is why allowance is made in the case of "speeding". Different sized wheels will alter the actual speed versus road wheel speed.

Why one persons' word should be taken over another's just because one of them is wearing a uniform is crazy. Surely the Guard has to prove your guilt as opposed to you having to prove your innocence. Proving an offence requires proof, not just somebody's say so?

Victor

sogood wrote: »

That seems odd. If a Guards' word is sufficient, why don't they just stand at the side of the road and watch cars going past and decide who's speeding? Why do their speed cameras have to be very specifically calibrated, to ensure accuracy?

Because that is legally insufficient.

sogood wrote: »

Why one persons' word should be taken over another's just because one of them is wearing a uniform is crazy.

Gardaí are generally considered more reliable witnesses, not least that they 'stand' back and watch people and take notes.

Surely the Guard has to prove your guilt as opposed to you having to prove your innocence. Proving an offence requires proof, not just somebody's say so?

The popular understanding of 'proof' is mistaken. Proof is providing solid evidence that the court is willing to accept, not incontrovertible evidence.

kirving

At 130kph, the Garda car speedo could easily be out by 7-8 kph, and possibly more. If they had GPS, they would have actual evidence. The thing is, it's not as though speeding is even a matter of opinion as dangerous driving might be, it is an actual measurable value on a scale.

Caliden

El_Dangeroso wrote: »

I was pulled over by a guard a few weeks ago doing 10kph over the speed limit.

I didn't actually know I was going over the speed limit for sure, the guard said I was but did not clock me from a stationary position, he was just driving behind me (unmarked vehicle).

I have no issue in paying the fine if indeed I was going over, but am I entitled to ask for evidence of this without challenging the speeding fine and risking 5 points instead of 3? Do they have to provide evidence in this case or is the Guard's word gospel?

Some Garda cars have VASCAR (Visual Average Speed Computer And Recorder) onboard and can get you speeding that way.

Got caught before myself and he brought me in the squad car and replayed back the clip and the calculated speed.

eezipc

I always wondered about that. I never got a speeding ticket here but I did in Australia once. They sent me a picture of the car and a reading of the speed I was doing. I knew I was over the limit so no arguments there.
Is that the same thing here? If you were caught speeding by the speed vans for example. Do they send you a print out and a photo?

biko

El_Dangeroso wrote: »

did not clock me from a stationary position, he was just driving behind me (unmarked vehicle).

Then there is probably no other evidence than the garda checking his own speedo or a GPS.

El_Dangeroso

I think I'll chance my arm and enquire as to evidence at the station. I suspect I'll get a 'we don't need evidence - pay the fine' but it costs nothing to ask!