What would Ireland be like if.............

SafeSurfer

we had been a 32 county republic since 1922?
Would Iteland be a better or worse place to live?
Would there have been a Protestant exodus like in the south? Would Ireland have been more or less theocratic if non Catholics made up one third of the population? Would loyalist separatists still be waging guerilla warfare east of the Bann?

Jesus Wept

be bigger

Birneybau

I'll tell you...

One eyed Jack

There'd be no clickbait title threads.

Birneybau

...some other time.

o1s1n

One eyed Jack wrote: »

There'd be no clickbait title threads.

You wouldnt BELIEVE what Michael Collins accomplished next...

realdanbreen

SafeSurfer wrote: »

we had been a 32 county republic since 1922?
?

We didn't become a Republic until 1949.

colossus-x

The weather forecast would take longer.

Greentopia

SafeSurfer wrote: »

we had been a 32 county republic since 1922?

Probably a bit more efficiently run and less of a religious gulag for most of the 20th century, but who knows.

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Would Iteland be a better or worse place to live

For whom? better for some probably, worse for others.

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Would there have been a Protestant exodus like in the south?

Perhaps to the UK, yes. Depends on what kind of all Ireland Govt we would have had.

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Ireland have been more or less theocratic if non Catholics made up one third of the population? Would loyalist separatists still be waging guerilla warfare east of the Bann?

Less presumably.

And probably.

SafeSurfer

realdanbreen wrote: »

We didn't become a Republic until 1949.

The hypothetical question was about a 32 county republic from1922. But thanks for the history lesson.

TheLastMohican

WWBBGS?












What would B B Gaskin say?

mansize

Michael Collins and Dev would have gotten married

uch

We'd all be hurdy gurdy ing

randy hickey

....the Germans had invaded?

blueser

Would the weather be better if we were still part of Blighty? If so, let's apply to rejoin.

Menas

George Best would have been the best Irishman ever, and the face of guinness.
And we would have made it to the 1982 world cup.

dan1895

Instead of a civil war and the troubles we could of pooled our resources to develop a space programme long before the Americans. The moon would now be ours and Mars within our sights.

Fleawuss

SafeSurfer wrote: »

The hypothetical question was about a 32 county republic from1922. But thanks for the history lesson.

Badly needed.

Fleawuss

We'd still be dancing at the crossroads to a tune played on a Lambeg drum.

The_Valeyard

Probably be about the same really. People still be botching about the same things

realdanbreen

Fleawuss wrote: »

We'd still be dancing at the crossroads to a tune played on a Lambeth drum.

Lesson #2, It's a Lambeg drum.

Fleawuss

realdanbreen wrote: »

Lesson #2, It's a Lambeg drum.

Correct. Autocorrect will be informed.

Nodin

Fleawuss wrote: »

We'd still be dancing at the crossroads to a tune played on a Lambeg drum.

An aul reel maybe...."Kick Bishop Brennan Up The Arse" was always a good one that either faith could enjoy.

ygolometsipe

o1s1n wrote: »

You wouldnt BELIEVE what Michael Collins accomplished next...

don't leave me hanging......

Fleawuss

realdanbreen wrote: »

Lesson #2, It's a Lambeg drum.

PS The real Dan Breen is dead.

Fleawuss

Nodin wrote: »

An aul reel maybe...."Kick Bishop Brennan Up The Arse" was always a good one that either faith could enjoy.

I dissent.

maryishere

Without bases in N.I. during ww2 ( sea and air), the closely contested battle of the Atlantic could have been lost to the allies, therefore changing the course of ww2. Instead of 12 million perishing in concentration camps run by Nazi Germany, perhaps 15 million or more could have perished. Hundreds of thousands of people from occupied countries were used by the Germans as slave labour in ww2. Hitler had a use planned for us, he knew we were good at building roads, and had plans to build an autoban to the far east if/when he won ww2. Go figure. Useful extermination, very efficient.

Badly Drunk Boy

TheLastMohican wrote: »

WWBBGS?









What would B B Gaskin say?

Do you mean Bibi Baskin? I think I know what she'd say...

Fleawuss wrote: »

PS The real Dan Breen is dead.

I think Real Danbreen is a football team in the outskirts of Málaga.

Nodin

Fleawuss wrote: »

I dissent.

Bit of a jig - "The Cow me father maimed for me"?

Nodin

maryishere wrote: »

Without bases in N.I. during ww2 ( sea and air), the closely contested battle of the Atlantic could have been lost to the allies, therefore changing the course of ww2. Instead of 12 million perishing in concentration camps run by Nazi Germany, perhaps 15 million or more could have perished. Hundreds of thousands of people from occupied countries were used by the Germans as slave labour in ww2. Hitler had a use planned for us, he knew we were good at building roads, and had plans to build an autoban to the far east if/when he won ww2. Go figure. Useful extermination, very efficient.

"Von Runstedts Fusiliers" doesn't quite roll off the tongue, tis true.

RobertKK

Ulster would say yes.

kleefarr

SafeSurfer wrote: »

What would Ireland be like if.............

The Government had €60m a year in tax money from legalising Marijuana?

This was the estimated amounted by Professor David Nutt as shown in the Thesis linked in my signature.

I would think that it would make a big difference to what the government could do and also make a change to society in general, just like it has done in Portugal.

ToddyDoody

The_Valeyard wrote: »

People still be botching about the same things

As in plastic surgery?

The republicans would have to find a new meaning in life. Possibly just become big racists.

Capt'n Midnight

maryishere wrote: »

Without bases in N.I. during ww2 ( sea and air), the closely contested battle of the Atlantic could have been lost to the allies, therefore changing the course of ww2. Instead of 12 million perishing in concentration camps run by Nazi Germany, perhaps 15 million or more could have perished. Hundreds of thousands of people from occupied countries were used by the Germans as slave labour in ww2. Hitler had a use planned for us, he knew we were good at building roads, and had plans to build an autoban to the far east if/when he won ww2. Go figure. Useful extermination, very efficient.

Dream on.
First, 90% of convoys weren't even attacked. And only 10% of the ships in the attacked convoys were sunk. And at great cost too. It didn't have the same sort of impact as the US campaign against Japanese shipping.

Trivia, the Japanese didn't attack the Russian convoys carrying arms from the US West coast. That would have had a bigger impact on the war.

Second, 90% of German army casualties were on the Eastern front and not in the areas the other Allies were fighting in from Norway to western Europe to Libya. D-Day meant that Austria wasn't on the other side of the Iron curtain. But had Churchill not been allowed to repeat the debacle of Gallipoli and gotten the Allies bogged down in Italy then that to could have changed the war.

Regarding convoys , they'd have been better protected if Churchill hadn't got rid of so many battleships in the French fleet or sent Repulse and Prince of Wales to Singapore without air cover.

TheLastMohican

Badly Drunk Boy wrote: »

Do you mean Bibi Baskin? I think I know what she'd say...


I think Real Danbreen is a football team in the outskirts of Málaga.

Didn't realise that Malaga had an urban sprawl up to Villareal or into Seville for Betis. Would love to hear her Donegal accent pronouncing the results

maryishere

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Dream on.
First, 90% of convoys weren't even attacked.

Despite that, in the words of someone who was there, at least "every convoy lost a straggler". Air and sea forces operating from N. Ireland helped win the battle, but despite that 3,500 merchant ships and 175 warships were sunk for the loss of 783 U-boats.
Who knows if the battle would have swung the other way if air and sea cover was not extended from N.I? Did you know allied planes legally and illegially overflew "Eire" as it was then called on the way to the Atlantic?


"The Battle of the Atlantic was the dominating factor all through the war. Never for one moment could we forget that everything happening elsewhere, on land, at sea or in the air depended ultimately on its outcome."
— Winston Churchill


From wiki:The name "Battle of the Atlantic" was coined by Winston Churchill in February 1941.[9] It has been called the "longest, largest, and most complex" naval battle in history.[10] The campaign started immediately after the European war began, and lasted six years. It involved thousands of ships in more than 100 convoy battles and perhaps 1,000 single-ship encounters, in a theatre covering thousands of square miles of ocean. The situation changed constantly, with one side or the other gaining advantage, as new weapons, tactics, counter-measures, and equipment were developed by both sides. The Allies gradually gained the upper hand, overcoming German surface raiders by the end of 1942 and defeating the U-boats by mid-1943, though losses to U-boats continued to war's end.

Capt'n Midnight

maryishere wrote: »

Despite that, in the words of someone who was there, at least "every convoy lost a straggler". Air and sea forces operating from N. Ireland helped win the battle, but despite that 3,500 merchant ships and 175 warships were sunk for the loss of 783 U-boats.
Who knows if the battle would have swung the other way if air and sea cover was not extended from N.I?

Some neutrals taken over by the British Empire during WWII
East Timor
Syria
Lebanon
Iran
Madagascar
Iceland
Look at how they treated the French https://humanities.exeter.ac.uk/history/research/centres/warstateandsociety/projects/bombing/france/

The Bombing of France 1939 - 1945

Bombing in World War 2 claimed between 50,000 and 60,000 French civilian lives. Almost all died at the hands of the Allies, not the Germans. The death toll, though no more than an eighth of that in Germany, was still numerically comparable to that of British civilian victims of German bombing and V-weapons, or to that of Jews deported from France and exterminated in the camps.

AFAIK no one starved in the UK. Very different story during the Siege of Leningrad. The UK didn't rely on imports as much as Japan. They were still exporting stuff to Russia and sending convoys to Malta. German industrial production peaked in 1944 BTW. All of these show that the UK could have survived even if they'd lost lots more shipping.

Did you know allied planes legally and illegially overflew "Eire" as it was then called on the way to the Atlantic?

Flying boats off Lough Erne didn't fly round Donegal

Anyway we couldn't have stopped them. The only time we had first rate aircraft was the spitfires we impounded during the war.