Heat loss survey?

white_westie

Posted this in C&P but got nothing http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057554850 so will ask here (if it okay!)

Live in 3 bed semid in dublin, built mid 80's, single story extension added around 2002. Probably leaks like a sieve by current standards, but would like to know what's actually 'broken' in it!

Have been reading a bit, and on paper an independent heat loss survey would seem to be the way to go.

Anyone here ever get one done?
If so, did they find it useful in deciding how to prioritise a long term fix list?
Also, any rough idea of cost?

Thks in advance.

WW

Water John

Cant' you get a BER done on it?
It would give you a start. The upgrade report would point out what would be best value for money improvements.

white_westie

Water John wrote: »

Cant' you get a BER done on it?
It would give you a start. The upgrade report would point out what would be best value for money improvements.

My impression so far about the BER cert is that it is basically a paper exercise, and don't think it would help me. Probably works better in a new build or a total retrofit - could be totally wrong of course!

Water John

Half right there, but it will give you the running list of what you need to do.

But you know the most important issue is insulation. Pump the old wall cavity full or dry line the inside. Put plenty insulation in the attic. that's the best value for money.
Look up at the roof on a frosty morning. If it thaws quickly, then it needs insulation. Often you will see the roof of a house still frozen but the extension is not. Maybe the other way around too.

Next its windows and doors. The BER would tell you how good they are.
Obviously if there are not double glazed or are metal framed, replace them.
If you have a chimney that is not being used, block it. Beware of ventilation need and carbon monoxide.

MicktheMan

Water John wrote: »

Half right there, but it will give you the running list of what you need to do.

But you know the most important issue is insulation. Pump the old wall cavity full or dry line the inside. Put plenty insulation in the attic. that's the best value for money.
Look up at the roof on a frosty morning. If it thaws quickly, then it needs insulation. Often you will see the roof of a house still frozen but the extension is not. Maybe the other way around too.

Next its windows and doors. The BER would tell you how good they are.
Obviously if there are not double glazed or are metal framed, replace them.
If you have a chimney that is not being used, block it. Beware of ventilation need and carbon monoxide.

ya see, this is where most people go wrong. Insulation is not the most important issue. It would be if we lived in central europe where is gets down to -20 every winter, but in Ireland where is rarely goes blow freezing for any length of time, lack of insulation is not the main contributor to heatloss.
We live in a very mild but windy climate where a lack of air tightness is by far the most important factor when it comes to heat loss. And guess what, insulation, in general, does nothing to address this issue.
Forget the BER and get a proper independent heatloss survey done which tests specifically for all forms of heatloss.

cletus

I have watched one BER survey being carried out, so perhaps this doesn't apply to all of them.

The BER assessor walked around the house with a notepad and pen, and a measuring tape. Measured window and door reveals. Stuck his head into the attic space. Measured the floor space of the house. Took a quick glance at the gas burner. That was pretty much it.

Now I'm no scientist, but I will admit to being a little sceptical about his ability to assess the energy efficiency of the building based on what I witnessed

MicktheMan

cletus wrote: »

I have watched one BER survey being carried out, so perhaps this doesn't apply to all of them.

It does

Water John

Mick you're right. It is ridiculous the amount we waste in this country space heating and draft is the worst problem but it is difficult to solve, once the house is built.
Do you have good ideas on sealing an existing house?

Cerco

In my experience the BER is of little value in determining the energy performance of a dwelling. They are generic in style and not specific enough to determine a course of action.
Seems to me the major parts are cut and paste jobs. The overall disclaimer allows a BER assessor "off the hook" if items are overlooked etc.

The only value they gave imho is when applying for grants. You will require
before and after BER if you decide to avail of SEAI grants for your upgrades.

MicktheMan

Water John wrote: »

Do you have good ideas on sealing an existing house?

Depends very much on the house type, elemental makeup etc etc and cannot be easily explained on an internet forum. Besides, why would I give away to a stranger for free what people pay me for professionally.
Remember, though, that a house does need sufficient ventilation to get rid of internally generated moisture during the heating season. So while sealing for airtightness is very important in our climate, appropriate ventilation is crucial.
All this should be included in the survey and explained to the client during the survey process.

So to answer your question, the best idea I can give you is to have the house tested for airtightness as part of an overall heat loss survey and be present during the survey so you get a full understanding of whats at play.