Mother can't afford to maintain her house

stefanovich

My mother bought her house back in the 90s with cash after divorcing my father and the family home was sold.

Since then she has been bringing up children, in unskilled employment or unemployed. She hasn't been able to maintain the house properly and it's gotten to the point where she is very unhappy there and probably needs 20 to 50 grand to renovate or modernize it.

New kitchen and bathroom needed. There was a bad kitchen extension done which probably needs to be completely redone. There is a cracked sewer drain which need to be fixed, lead pipes and the garden is a state. There is also damage to the chimney.

I'm thinking the easiest thing for her to do is sell up and downsize and let someone else do the work.

Property in the area is selling from 150,000 to 220,000 depending on the condition.

I'm thinking of getting a valuation done now to see where we stand.

I had thought of getting a partial mortgage in my name and doing the work needed before sale on condition that she sell up afterwards but I'm not sure I want that responsibility and I don't want to be stuck paying the loan when she decides she's changed her mind...

Is it very foolish to just sell up? It's in a very desirable location, walking distance from Limerick city.

Cuddlesworth

stefanovich wrote: »

Is it very foolish to just sell up? It's in a very desirable location, walking distance from Limerick city.

No and the older she gets the worse it will become. See if there are any "retirement" apartments in the area.

Arbiter of Good Taste

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

No and the older she gets the worse it will become. See if there are any "retirement" apartments in the area.

I second this.

Also, I would not get involved in mortgages, etc. No matter how close families are, when money and property is in question, it can become carnage. You don't want to find yourself in a situation in the future where your siblings are accusing you of forcing your mother out of her home.

riclad

Maybe buy a 2 bed bungalow ,
bungalows require less maintenance,
maybe she could rent a room under the rent a room scheme.
no tax on rental income upto 12k per year.

stefanovich

Thanks a lot for the advise. Rent a room is a great idea. For now I also need to think about my sister who would still be living with her in the short term.

Getting involved financially is not something I was comfortable with really anyway, your advise has just backed up what I was thinking.

As for valuation, what's the best way to get this done independently where we'd get a fair number? I assume a structural engineer would need to be involved. Any idea of the cost?

Mrs OBumble

OP, I have no useful recommendations for you.

But I'd like to congratulate you and your family for facing up to this. So many older people let sentimental attachment to the "home place" overrule basic common sense about property and the fact that it needs to be looked after.

Doing what needs to be done will be difficult. And there's probably no fall-back option of council housing, despite her low income, because she's owned a home before.

Good luck, I hope you can find a solution that meets your mother's needs.

Cuddlesworth

stefanovich wrote: »

Thanks a lot for the advise. Rent a room is a great idea. For now I also need to think about my sister who would still be living with her in the short term.

Getting involved financially is not something I was comfortable with really anyway, your advise has just backed up what I was thinking.

As for valuation, what's the best way to get this done independently where we'd get a fair number? I assume a structural engineer would need to be involved. Any idea of the cost?

Valuation can be done by Estate agent, structural engineer is the problem of the purchaser.

RainyDay

This is way more than just a financial decision. How old is she? How's her health? Is her happiness dependant on her current community and neighbours, or is she the kind of person who can take on a new environment and build a new network?

On the financial side, I'm not sure if the kind of equity release deals that the banks were doing during boom time are still available. It might be worth checking these out if these are still around.

pablo128

The work you mention isn't the end of the world, nor should it cost 20 - 50k either. Do you have any builder or plumber friends? Can you call in a favour?

I'm not trying to be funny, but what if she buys another place, and she runs into similar issues?

Duckjob

riclad wrote: »

Maybe buy a 2 bed bungalow ,
bungalows require less maintenance,
maybe she could rent a room under the rent a room scheme.
no tax on rental income upto 12k per year.

^ This. Plus :

- you don't have to worry about falls on the stairs
- if she becomes infirm and can't manage the stairs anymore, you dont have the hassle of trying to make one of the downstairs rooms into a livable bedroom.

4ensic15

pablo128 wrote: »

The work you mention isn't the end of the world, nor should it cost 20 - 50k either. Do you have any builder or plumber friends? Can you call in a favour?

I'm not trying to be funny, but what if she buys another place, and she runs into similar issues?

Work described by the o/p is expensive. Building materials have to be bought and even friends have to be paid. A friend might do a same repair but can't be expected to do weeks of work unpaid. Purchasers generally underestimate the cost of doing work on a house so it doesn't pay to do any work before selling. Apart from a clean up/tidy up declutter you should not spend any money on the house. Ask some local estate agents to come in a nd give you an idea of the likely selling price. they won't charge if you say you are thinking of selling.

pablo128

4ensic15 wrote: »

Work described by the o/p is expensive. Building materials have to be bought and even friends have to be paid. A friend might do a same repair but can't be expected to do weeks of work unpaid. Purchasers generally underestimate the cost of doing work on a house so it doesn't pay to do any work before selling. Apart from a clean up/tidy up declutter you should not spend any money on the house. Ask some local estate agents to come in a nd give you an idea of the likely selling price. they won't charge if you say you are thinking of selling.

Would you have an opinion on my second point then? If like you say, she buys another place and doesn't give due diligence, and it has issues, does she sell up again for another place?

Cuddlesworth

pablo128 wrote: »

The work you mention isn't the end of the world, nor should it cost 20 - 50k either. Do you have any builder or plumber friends? Can you call in a favour?

I'm not trying to be funny, but what if she buys another place, and she runs into similar issues?

And in 10 years time, when there is another 10k of repairs that have piled up? People don't really comprehend how expensive house ownership is in the long term.

ted1

Factor oh the cost of a solicitor, Estate agent , stamp duty, moving, etc and you probably have enough to do the upgrades.

4ensic15

pablo128 wrote: »

Would you have an opinion on my second point then? If like you say, she buys another place and doesn't give due diligence, and it has issues, does she sell up again for another place?

She will buy another place in good repair. If she doesn't maintain the problem will arise again. However the family is now grown up and there might be some money available. If the new place is smaller or she avails of rent a room it might not be as difficult to maintain. Her only other option is to rent which is even more expensive than maintenance and with much less security.

stefanovich

RainyDay wrote: »

This is way more than just a financial decision. How old is she? How's her health? Is her happiness dependant on her current community and neighbours, or is she the kind of person who can take on a new environment and build a new network?

On the financial side, I'm not sure if the kind of equity release deals that the banks were doing during boom time are still available. It might be worth checking these out if these are still around.

She's nearly 60 so really not that old and she's in good health, physically at least. None of her friends live in the immediate area so moving somewhere in Limerick is not an issue.

The house is really depressing her though.

Yes I'll have to look at equity release deals, first I've heard of them.

I do know of one house nearby which was sold for 20,000 over the asking in cash. I'm assuming a property developer.

pablo128 wrote: »

The work you mention isn't the end of the world, nor should it cost 20 - 50k either. Do you have any builder or plumber friends? Can you call in a favour?

I'm not trying to be funny, but what if she buys another place, and she runs into similar issues?

She's really not in a position to get that sort of money together and won't get approved for a loan without putting her house at risk if at all.

She's well able to work and should be looking really but the state of the house is really getting to her.

Duckjob wrote: »

^ This. Plus :

- you don't have to worry about falls on the stairs
- if she becomes infirm and can't manage the stairs anymore, you dont have the hassle of trying to make one of the downstairs rooms into a livable bedroom.

A good point for the future. Thankfully she's not old enough to be worrying about that right now but in 10 years yes.

4ensic15 wrote: »

Work described by the o/p is expensive. Building materials have to be bought and even friends have to be paid. A friend might do a same repair but can't be expected to do weeks of work unpaid. Purchasers generally underestimate the cost of doing work on a house so it doesn't pay to do any work before selling. Apart from a clean up/tidy up declutter you should not spend any money on the house. Ask some local estate agents to come in a nd give you an idea of the likely selling price. they won't charge if you say you are thinking of selling.

Okay, estate agent seem to be the next step. At least putting a price on the property will help the decision.

pablo128 wrote: »

Would you have an opinion on my second point then? If like you say, she buys another place and doesn't give due diligence, and it has issues, does she sell up again for another place?

I think the problem is more than 20 years of not doing maintenance and it's built up to the point where she doesn't know what to do. I do wish she'd get back to work and be able to maintain a new property

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

And in 10 years time, when there is another 10k of repairs that have piled up? People don't really comprehend how expensive house ownership is in the long term.

She needs to get back to work.

ted1 wrote: »

Factor oh the cost of a solicitor, Estate agent , stamp duty, moving, etc and you probably have enough to do the upgrades.

I am assuming this is a point against moving? Hopefully she'd have money left to cover those expenses.

4ensic15 wrote: »

She will buy another place in good repair. If she doesn't maintain the problem will arise again. However the family is now grown up and there might be some money available. If the new place is smaller or she avails of rent a room it might not be as difficult to maintain. Her only other option is to rent which is even more expensive than maintenance and with much less security.

Yeah. I have thought of this myself. Perhaps the problem was she felt unable to deal with the problems as they arose and then they built up.

I think a fresh start would be positive though. There is a lot of history both good and very bad in that house.
Renting really isn't an option. She was lucky enough to have the security of owning the home outright and would never give that up.

Just reading through my answers before hitting reply it seems I am more keen on her moving than staying put. I just don't see things getting any better for her in that house.

Graces7

OP;bless you for your caring. Although at the end, it really is up to her, isn't it? A decision she has to make without too much pressure. Attachment is not sentimental by any means.

stefanovich

Graces7 wrote: »

OP;bless you for your caring. Although at the end, it really is up to her, isn't it? A decision she has to make without too much pressure. Attachment is not sentimental by any means.

Yes of course it is up to her. Absolutely. I just want to help because right now she is very unhappy.

liquoriceall

I wonder would it be worthwhile contacting some of the local sheltered housing places? I'm unsure of the rules but as most as community run they vary, you have them in lots of places eg Newcastle West, Athlacca, Dromcollogher etc

looksee

OP, I suspect there is a lot more going on here than the house, though that may be a big part of it.

If she really wants to move, then help her to find something more suitable. But first maybe get her to see her GP for a check up. 60 is not a great age these days, and if she is physically able to work, as you suggest, then she does not really need sheltered accommodation. It has to be her choice though; if she does decide to move it would be sensible move to a single level, smaller place, but she could easily have another 20 years before she needs special accommodation.

Charles Babbage

60 is an early age group for equity release, as the person could live for 30 more years easily enough.

As someone in your Mums age bracket, I would consider an apartment rather than a house. Your first point of call is an Estate Agent and they would be able to advise on both sale and new purchase.
As she doesn't work, her next step is to get upskilled, which isn't as daunting as it sounds. If she doesn't already do so, volunteering for one of the many charities in her area would be a good first step. Getting any job at her age won't be easy, so don't build her hopes up.
Make sure that there isn't something else bothering her. To me she sounds like one suffering from depression.
Congratulations on your care and consideration shown her, but it's her decision to make.

Kristopherus

Op, have you looked into the House Repair Scheme available through the City Council? There are substantial grants available. Usually covers windows, doors, roofs, insulation, heating. May be well worth a try.

RainyDay

Kristopherus wrote: »

Op, have you looked into the House Repair Scheme available through the City Council? There are substantial grants available. Usually covers windows, doors, roofs, insulation, heating. May be well worth a try.

Great point.

stefanovich wrote: »

She's nearly 60 so really not that old and she's in good health, physically at least. None of her friends live in the immediate area so moving somewhere in Limerick is not an issue.

The house is really depressing her though.

Yes I'll have to look at equity release deals, first I've heard of them.

Her young-ish age is a mixed blessing. It might put her in a good position to take on a big change in lifestyle, depending on her attitude. Some 60-year-olds are more like 80-year-olds in attitude to change, and vice versa, so you can work out how she might approach this.

The downside is that equity release probably is not an option at that age. You will need to plan for the future in any move. This has to be her last move, so find a property where she will be able to live when a bit less able and mobile.

An apartment might be a good option, but you'll need to plan ahead for management fees etc. Maintenance costs should be fairly minimal.

Water John

An apartment is a good idea.
Don't go near equity release. Better do nothing than do that. That tells you how poor I think that option is.

stefanovich

Kristopherus wrote: »

Op, have you looked into the House Repair Scheme available through the City Council? There are substantial grants available. Usually covers windows, doors, roofs, insulation, heating. May be well worth a try.

I had a look at what is available an nothing seems to apply. There is a grant you can get if you are over 66 and another which you can get if you are on a housing list due to your house being unfit for habitation.

stefanovich

liquoriceall wrote: »

I wonder would it be worthwhile contacting some of the local sheltered housing places? I'm unsure of the rules but as most as community run they vary, you have them in lots of places eg Newcastle West, Athlacca, Dromcollogher etc

She's not even 60 yet so I doubt she'd qualify or want anything like that!

looksee wrote: »

OP, I suspect there is a lot more going on here than the house, though that may be a big part of it. .

Yeah there is and the house is a big factor. She sees her GP regularly enough but I don't think she'd be comfortable talking to him about depression. Anyway, the doctor is just likely to prescribe something nasty.

Deleted User wrote: »

As someone in your Mums age bracket, I would consider an apartment rather than a house. Your first point of call is an Estate Agent and they would be able to advise on both sale and new purchase.
As she doesn't work, her next step is to get upskilled, which isn't as daunting as it sounds. If she doesn't already do so, volunteering for one of the many charities in her area would be a good first step. Getting any job at her age won't be easy, so don't build her hopes up.
Make sure that there isn't something else bothering her. To me she sounds like one suffering from depression.
Congratulations on your care and consideration shown her, but it's her decision to make.

Yeah, she has been applying for courses and jobs alright and would like to do something. She's been out of work for a while now and not in fulltime employment since her 20s. Her youngest child is 18 and oldest nearly 40. She's basically been a full time single mother her whole life.

RainyDay wrote: »

Her young-ish age is a mixed blessing. It might put her in a good position to take on a big change in lifestyle, depending on her attitude. Some 60-year-olds are more like 80-year-olds in attitude to change, and vice versa, so you can work out how she might approach this.

Yeah, the big problem she suffers from is indecision. She has told me straight to my face though that she does not like the house anymore.

RainyDay wrote: »

An apartment might be a good option, but you'll need to plan ahead for management fees etc. Maintenance costs should be fairly minimal.

An apartment would be good except for the fact she has a dog and a cat so a garden is essential. Also in Limerick the quality of apartments is quite poor.

haveringchick

Duckjob wrote: »

^ This. Plus :

- you don't have to worry about falls on the stairs
- if she becomes infirm and can't manage the stairs anymore, you dont have the hassle of trying to make one of the downstairs rooms into a livable bedroom.

My mother sold her house (our childhood home, not a tear was shed, it's only bricks and mortar) in 1999 just as the damp started creeping up the gable wall, and the garage roof started to leak
She was lucky enough to buy a 2 bedroom bungalow where she got rid of the bath immediately
She's never looked back, she's 81 now still cleaning out her own gutters!

4ensic15

haveringchick wrote: »

My mother sold her house (our childhood home, not a tear was shed, it's only bricks and mortar) in 1999 just as the damp started creeping up the gable wall, and the garage roof started to leak
She was lucky enough to buy a 2 bedroom bungalow where she got rid of the bath immediately
She's never looked back, she's 81 now still cleaning out her own gutters!

17 years is a long time to be cleaning gutters. Should only take a few hours.

Mrs OBumble

liquoriceall wrote: »

I wonder would it be worthwhile contacting some of the local sheltered housing places? I'm unsure of the rules but as most as community run they vary, you have them in lots of places eg Newcastle West, Athlacca, Dromcollogher etc

She's unlikely to qualify for assistance, because she's owned a house.

Some of the voluntary housing bodies will look at purchasing homes off people who become unsubsidised tenants, but the property has to be attractive to them long term. One needing a lot of work might not be, and it wouldn't get her out of the house.


Off topic, but regarding work, would she consider caregiving? She'd have to do some courses but as a full time mother for years she has a lot of relevant experience.

pablo128

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

She's unlikely to qualify for assistance, because she's owned a house.

Some of the voluntary housing bodies will look at purchasing homes off people who become unsubsidised tenants, but the property has to be attractive to them long term. One needing a lot of work might not be, and it wouldn't get her out of the house.


Off topic, but regarding work, would she consider caregiving? She'd have to do some courses but as a full time mother for years she has a lot of relevant experience.

I have to say, that is good advice. There is a fair bit of work available in that field.

pablo128

pablo128 wrote: »

I have to say, that is good advice. There is a fair bit of work available in that field.

There is if you have the qualifications. It's bloody hard work and many a hard working woman has ended up crocked after a few years. You need to have a car and the upkeep on that alone costs a fair whack. I don't mean to diss your suggestion, just pointing out the pitfalls.

athtrasna

This is Accommodation and Property

Mrs OBumble

Kristopherus wrote: »

Op, have you looked into the House Repair Scheme available through the City Council? There are substantial grants available. Usually covers windows, doors, roofs, insulation, heating. May be well worth a try.

I've been reading.

Max grant is €8000, and you have to use C2`d contractors, not mates rates. And the grants are managed by the council based on need / health: I'd guess a diagnosis of something incompatible with work will be needed in most areas.

No help in this situation.