Replacing HKC 6/10 keypad

bren4q

I've recently moved into a house with a HKC SecureWatch 6/10 alarm system that's about 13 years old. There's a few issues and I had an engineer call out briefly but he didn't get to address any of them. I have looked around on Boards but I am hoping someone can give me a few more pointers on my options.

These are the issues at the moment:

1. Keypad button contacts are failing. One of the numbers in the user code has quickly deteriorated and could stop working any day.

2. The system is engineer locked and the default engineer code has been changed (according to the engineer that called out). I don't have the engineer code and the original installer is AWOL. The engineer said it can be reset but that the whole system would need to be reprogrammed, which he didn't have time to do that day.

3. Intermittent false alarm from one zone (2 windows). Hopefully just a matter of replacing the sensors.


The engineer said that it may not be possible, or cost effective, to replace the 610 keypad, and that I should consider upgrading to the 1070 system. The 1070 with GSM-Q card looks like a sweet little system, but after getting a quote for €700 to get it installed I am now back to wondering if I can just fix the issues I have.

1. If 610 keypads are no longer supplied, if I bought one myself on Adverts.ie in new or almost new condition, would this be something that I could ask an engineer to install? Obviously I wouldn't be looking for any warranty or certifications, but I don't want to do down this route if its something that professional installers won't take on.

2. Do HKC 812 keypads work on HKC 610 systems?

3. Regarding the GSM-Q card on the 1070 system, has anyone any experience with Tesco SIMs working or not?

4. Why is it that some SIMs from certain networks do not work? (probably a very technical reason that's way over my head, but I'm just curious!)

Cheers!

KoolKid

Hi
Did the engineer try to clean or repair your existing keypad?
If you can get a keypad you can swap it over easy enough. 8-12 keypad is exactly the same as 6-10 one.
It's a very quick and straightforward job to default and reprogramme that system.
It's also very straightforward to find and replace faulty sensors on a zone.
If you are looking at upgrading I would take a look at some of the other systems available with free apps etc. Have a look through the sticky.
Generally sim cards need to be 2g capable to work AFAIK.

bren4q

Thanks Koolkid.

No, the engineer didn't try anything with the keypad. He concluded that it was on its last legs based on how hard it was to get a reaction from pressing some of the buttons. Which seemed fair enough given its age and the fact that the same buttons have been used all that time. The painted numbers are worn on the unresponsive buttons, if that's any indication.

KoolKid wrote: »

If you can get a keypad you can swap it over easy enough.
It's a very quick and straightforward job to default and reprogramme that system.

Do you mean I could attempt the keypad replacement and reprogramming myself? I was wondering about that. I am not averse to basic electronic repair jobs but am a total beginner with alarms. I'd usually remove stuff to have a look around but the thought of setting off the alarm and not being able to stop it is holding me back. Unfortunately there doesn't appear to be many articles online for HKC systems. The Boards forums have been the best source so far.

If you know of any topics with info about the reprogramming, or you can give a summary of the steps involved (here or by PM) that would be great.

KoolKid

If you just swap out the keypad no programming would be necessary. All the memory is stored in the control panel itself.
I will PM you the manual to take a look at what would be involved if you were to change the panel itself.

bren4q

Sorry, I said "panel replacement" but I meant "keypad replacement". The keypad is all I'd consider changing by myself for now. I had assumed that the keypad would be locked in some way to the panel and that the engineer code would be needed to pair them up. But if a straight swap on the keypad is possible then that's good news.

KoolKid wrote: »

It's a very quick and straightforward job to default and reprogramme that system.

I'd still be interested in doing this, even if it is not required to replace the keypad. It would be nice to be able to finally change the user code. I'll look through the manual and might get back to you if stuck on something.

KoolKid

Is your user code not set up to allow youyou change codes and access the manager menu??

bren4q

No, I've not been able to get into the manager menu. The engineer couldn't do anything about changing the user code either. Total reset and reprogramming was the only option is what I was told.

KoolKid

Its amazing how many of these panels are out there without the basic user functions enabled.It would have been a 10 minute job to reset & programme the panel giving you proper access.

bren4q

Does that make reprogramming and changing the user code too tricky a task for a complete novice like myself?

I can probably leave that for another day. Priority at the moment is getting the keypad replaced. Is that still a straight swap or is changing that now complicated by how locked down the system is?

KoolKid

No it will still be a straight swap

bren4q

I put the new keypad on but when it is powered up it displays strange symbols and the Fault indicator led is on. I was able to enter the user code and it stopped the alarm from sounding, so it is doing that much. The display periodically changes to other symbols but never shows anything legible.



I'm pretty sure the wiring is the same as it was:
1-Red, 2-Black, 3-Yellow, 4-Blue
This is also the order the RKP wires are in the panel.
However I see the 8/12 manual shows them as:
1-Red, 2-Black, 3-Blue, 4-Yellow
I tried this as well, but when powered on it was the same - symbols on display and fault LED.

Kepyad wiring as it stands:


Is there anything that can be done to resolve it? Or is it looking like the new keypad is faulty or not the right one?


Update:
Decided to put the old kaypad back in. Cleaned up the button contacts and took the rubber buttons from the new pad to use. Old keypad displays fine and the buttons react fine when pressed. So the original issue of unreactive buttons is fixed with a clean and some new rubber buttons.

But with everything connected back up again there's 2 faults showing - Battery fault and Comms fault.
In the log is an entry saying "Dev. ComFlt RKP"
When I try to arm the system it says "Panel cannot set. Contact engineer"

Any ideas what the issue(s) with it now is?

KoolKid

Its possible the old keypad was IDed on the panel. When you powered the system back up did it offer or say default keypads?
If you power up the new keypad with just red/black to + & - is the display clear?

bren4q

KoolKid wrote: »

When you powered the system back up did it offer or say default keypads?

I'm not sure if you are asking this in relation to the old or new keypad, so:

New: No, it only ever shows symbols.

Old: No, it shows some version status info.

SWRKP FEB99 V1.4
SW610 OCT01 V2.2
Chksum

Unless the default message is the very first thing shown and changes before I can see it, there's nothing about a default keypad.

KoolKid wrote: »

If you power up the new keypad with just red/black to + & - is the display clear?

No, it still shows gibberish. I assume this unit is DOA then.


Would the other "loose" cables in the keypad have anything to do with the Comms fault? There's two 6-core cables coming into the keypad and only 4 of the 12 wires are connected to the keypad. The others just had tape around them.
See pic.



The tape was old and fell off quite easily, so I taped them back up.
The green and white wires are joined. Whereas the unused set of red/black/yellow/blue wires weren't joined. So I assumed there was nothing on the other end and that they are taped for insulation only. Do they need to be joined properly or are they unused?

There is a 4 zone expander fitted, if that helps explain the extra cables.

KoolKid

If you just power up the keypad & its still all gibberish then I'd be fairly sure its the keypad itself that's faulty.

bren4q

Grand. Any ideas on the Comms fault on the old keypad? As far as I can see everything is back the way it was, apart from having to re-insulate the loose keypad wires. Or is it looking like time to get an engineer out?

KoolKid

Try power the panel down & connect the old keypad. Check when its powering up if it askes or states defaulting keypads?

bren4q

Have done. That's when I see:

SWRKP FEB99 V1.4
SW610 OCT01 V2.2
Chksum

I don't see anything about defaults, unless its the very first thing that appears for less than a second when powered up and I don't get to see it in time.