Aircoach

Jamie2k9

If traveling with them mind yours bags, lots of bags been stolen and they are doing nothing about it.

Bags stolen off 5.30 and 6.30 to Cork on Friday which is just two incidents out of many.

Word of advise don't bother contracting them about it as it's completely pointless.

suicide_circus

At what point are the bags getting lifted?

mickmmc

I was on the Aircoach 18.00 service from Cork to Dublin last Wednesday.

I was going to the airport and stayed on the bus.

At Bachelors Walk, the bus stopped and the bus driver got off to open the baggage door, which they have to do on the Plaxton Panther bus. The bus driver waited outside while the passengers took their bags. Then a woman said she couldn't find her bag. She searched inside the bus and the bag area underneath with the bus driver but unfortunately no bag was found.

The bus driver said he was sorry her bag was stolen and said he would report it.

I saw nobody run up from the street and grab a bag. In my opinion it had to be a passenger who took the bag. The driver said the same thing.

Then another passenger came back and said to the driver he forgot his coat in the bus. He searched inside the bus twice and he did not find it. A fellow passenger that got off after him must have seen the coat on the seat and stole it.

There are posts on Aircoach's facebook page reporting stolen bags in recent weeks.

I would advise anyone travelling with bags in the luggage compartment to get off the bus first in Bachelor's walk (and Cork) and collect your bag.

discus

Something that I've learned from having bags stolen on train in the UK. Bring a padlock! find a hardpoint on your bag (something that cannot be untied or unclipped, and attach it to a support, or rail. If that isn't possible, identify someone with an equally large bag who is going to the same destination and see if they are interested in padlocking them together to make it harder for someone to lift them. You'd be surprised at the amount of people who are keen for this idea!

Note: may not work if you look like a dodgy geezer :P

bk

An unfortunate reality of public transport and travel and not something that is specific to Aircoach unfortunately.

It is one of the reasons I normally try and travel with carry on luggage only, so I can keep the bag with me on the bus.

When that isn't possible, I normally carry two bags, a backpack with valuables (laptop, etc.) which I keep with me and only leave clothes in the luggage underneath *.

discus advice of using a lock is a great idea too.

* Good idea to keep a change of underwear, socks and a T-Shirt in your carry on too in case your luggage goes missing. Enough to keep you going until you buy new clothes.

Nomis21

I was a bus driver on long distance routes for many years on the Eurolines routes between London, Paris and Amsterdam. There were many instances of theft in that time. You can't believe how many times I, the driver, was accused of stealing someone's bag. But fortunately I never had to worry about such accusations because in my first week of working for Eurolines I found a wallet stuffed with about 2,000 Euros in cash, left in the bus, after everyone had got off, and I handed it in.

One of my colleagues commented that I must be a rich guy for making such a move, but I see that 2,000 Euros as being a gift that gave me something worth much more than the money.

Jamie2k9

bk wrote: »

An unfortunate reality of public transport and travel and not something that is specific to Aircoach unfortunately.

It is one of the reasons I normally try and travel with carry on luggage only, so I can keep the bag with me on the bus.

When that isn't possible, I normally carry two bags, a backpack with valuables (laptop, etc.) which I keep with me and only leave clothes in the luggage underneath *.

discus advice of using a lock is a great idea too.

* Good idea to keep a change of underwear, socks and a T-Shirt in your carry on too in case your luggage goes missing. Enough to keep you going until you buy new clothes.

Now now, you don't hear of much been stolen on Irish Rail and BE have staff watching specifically in Dublin.

devnull

Happens on all operators just as much, thing is that when one person posts about it, it leads to others also posting and it's a domino effect, much the same that when there is some kind of accident on the roads or on a plane every little incident gets reported where normally it would have let go.

It is a shame that some people in society have decided they are going to steal other peoples possessions but it is not something that I am surprised about, since you will always have such chancres in society.

BE might have staff in Dublin but they have a bus station paid for by the state, much easier to staff a big transport hub than a one off location in the middle of nowhere, economies of scale come into this when it includes monitoring luggage, more services from the one location, easier it is to justify a single staff member.

Incidentally the only time I had anything stolen on a bus was on a Bus Eireann short hop to Cork Airport where someone and his assistant sat at the front, loaded now bags, ran off at Cork Airport with 2 bags each into a car which was waiting close by.

devnull

Happens on all operators just as much, thing is that when one person posts about it, it leads to others also posting and it's a domino effect, much the same that when there is some kind of accident on the roads or on a plane every little incident gets reported where normally it would have let go.

It is a shame that some people in society have decided they are going to steal other peoples possessions but it is not something that I am surprised about, since you will always have such chancres in society.

BE might have staff in Dublin but they have a bus station paid for by the state, much easier to staff a big transport hub than a one off location in the middle of nowhere, economies of scale come into this when it includes monitoring luggage, more services from the one location, easier it is to justify a single staff member.

Incidentally the only time I had anything stolen on a bus was on a Bus Eireann short hop to Cork Airport where someone and his assistant sat at the front, loaded now bags, ran off at Cork Airport with 2 bags each into a car which was waiting close by.

Nomis21

As a bus/coach driver I can tell you that there is very little security regarding baggage stored in the luggage hold underneath the passenger compartment as in the interests of efficiency, the driver does not get involved any more these days with the loading and unloading of luggage. It's just a matter if pressing a button in the cockpit and passengers help themselves to what (one hopes) is their own luggage and there may be many stops along the way.

This lack of security caused a serious incident for me on a Eurolines route I was driving from Amsterdam to London. I noticed a female passenger who got waved off in Amsterdam by a man was also met by the same man along the route at a restaurant break about 2 hours down the road. A guy sitting behind me also noticed that and commented to me that he thought that was strange behavior.

We drive on to the Channel Tunnel where security and customs checks are made by the French authorities prior to driving the bus on a train to England. The Customs open the luggage compartment and when all the luggage has been removed, there remained a bag containing about 20 brick sized pieces of what turned out to be Heroin. About 10 kilos of it. I was taken into a room and shouted at very loudly in both French and English. Then the phone rang. Seemed that arrangements had already been made for the girl to be followed once she got off the bus in London because the guy on the bus who noticed the girl was an undercover English Customs Officer. If he hadn't been on the bus, I don't think I would have made it to London.

If security is an issue for you, take the train, not the bus.

ProudDUB

Hard to believe that in this day and age, someone hasn't yet come up with a simple ticket or tag systems for bags, that prevents them being stolen. Like a roll of double sided, numbered stickers in a dispenser, by the luggage hold door. (A bit like the tickets that pay parking machines dispense.)

Prior to putting your bag in the hold, you take a sticker. One goes on the bag, the passenger hangs onto the 2nd one. The driver supervises all bags being taken out of the hold. You don't get to remove a bag, unless you can produce the matching numbered ticket.

I know people are going to tear holes in that idea.....it would slow down the loading and unloading of bags, it would slow the driver down if he has to get off the bus at every stop, thieves can make their own stickers etc etc. But jeez, the whole idea of it....it's hardly rocket science, is it? :rolleyes:

AlekSmart

ProudDUB wrote: »

Hard to believe that in this day and age, someone hasn't yet come up with a simple ticket or tag systems for bags, that prevents them being stolen. Like a roll of double sided numbered stickers in a dispenser, by the luggage hold door. (A bit like the tickets that pay parking machines dispense.)

Prior to putting your bag in the hold, you take a sticker. One goes on the bag, the passenger hangs onto the 2nd one. The driver Conductor supervises all bags being taken out of the hold. You don't get to remove a bag, unless you can produce the matching numbered ticket.

I know people are going to tear holes in that idea.....it would slow down the loading and unloading of bags, it would slow the driver down if he has to get off the bus at every stop, thieves can make their own stickers etc etc. But jeez, the whole idea of it....it's hardly rocket science, is it? :rolleyes:

Horses for courses......

Cookie_Monster

ProudDUB wrote: »

Hard to believe that in this day and age, someone hasn't yet come up with a simple ticket or tag systems for bags, that prevents them being stolen. Like a roll of double sided, numbered stickers in a dispenser, by the luggage hold door. (A bit like the tickets that pay parking machines dispense.)

Prior to putting your bag in the hold, you take a sticker. One goes on the bag, the passenger hangs onto the 2nd one. The driver supervises all bags being taken out of the hold. You don't get to remove a bag, unless you can produce the matching numbered ticket.

I know people are going to tear holes in that idea.....it would slow down the loading and unloading of bags, it would slow the driver down if he has to get off the bus at every stop, thieves can make their own stickers etc etc. But jeez, the whole idea of it....it's hardly rocket science, is it? :rolleyes:

simple stuff but ultimately it costs money so why would a company proactivly do it?

J.pilkington

devnull wrote: »

Happens on all operators just as much, thing is that when one person posts about it, it leads to others also posting and it's a domino effect, much the same that when there is some kind of accident on the roads or on a plane every little incident gets reported where normally it would have let go.

It is a shame that some people in society have decided they are going to steal other peoples possessions but it is not something that I am surprised about, since you will always have such chancres in society.

BE might have staff in Dublin but they have a bus station paid for by the state, much easier to staff a big transport hub than a one off location in the middle of nowhere, economies of scale come into this when it includes monitoring luggage, more services from the one location, easier it is to justify a single staff member.

Incidentally the only time I had anything stolen on a bus was on a Bus Eireann short hop to Cork Airport where someone and his assistant sat at the front, loaded now bags, ran off at Cork Airport with 2 bags each into a car which was waiting close by.

This thread is specifically about an aircoach issue so not sure why you are on the offensive and deflecting to other companies, see below why aircoach are much more of an easy target for opportunist thiefs (see below)?

Aircoach clearly have a problem and need to do something about it. They are unique in that they operate a high frequency multi stop service in Dublin city where the passengers are separated from their luggage. The nature of their service means a large percentage of their passengers will have luggage which they can not bring on the coach. I almost expect to see an extra large sign on the luggage doors stating aircoach are not responsible for luggage rather than tackling the issue.

http://www.thejournal.ie/aircoach-bags-stolen-2568483-Jan2016/

https://www.tripadvisor.ie/ShowTopic-g186605-i90-k9204491-Aircoach_Bags_Stolen-Dublin_County_Dublin.html

devnull

J.pilkington wrote: »

This thread is specifically about an aircoach issue so not sure why you are on the offensive and deflecting to other companies?

Aircoach clearly have a problem and need to do something about it. They are unique in that they operate a high frequency multi stop service in Dublin city where the passengers are separated from their luggage. The nature of their service means a large percentage of their passengers will have luggage which they can not bring on the coach.

You'll find the stealing is not happening on the Dublin to Dublin Airport routes, rather the Belfast and the Cork route so it has nothing to do with the fact they operate high frequency 24 hour services from Dublin to Dublin Airport.

Almost all coach operators, both public and private operate the very same way as far as luggage is concerned and have exactly the same kind of problems that Aircoach are having, it is a problem for coach transport in general rather than one restricted to one company, unfortunately private companies do not have access to bus stations in cities which would assist with this.

Clearly the company haven't communicated with their passengers or the general public in the best fashion and appear only to have made a statement about it after the matter was brought to attention of the press, but the real issue is that there are a number of people out there who are determined to steal from others and that is a problem for society as a whole and all operators, not just Aircoach.

J.pilkington

devnull wrote: »

You'll find the stealing is not happening on the Dublin to Dublin Airport routes, rather the Belfast and the Cork route so it has nothing to do with the fact they operate high frequency 24 hour services from Dublin to Dublin Airport.

Almost all coach operators, both public and private operate the very same way as far as luggage is concerned and have exactly the same kind of problems that Aircoach are having, it is a problem for coach transport in general rather than one restricted to one company, unfortunately private companies do not have access to bus stations in cities which would assist with this.

Clearly the company haven't communicated with their passengers or the general public in the best fashion and appear only to have made a statement about it after the matter was brought to attention of the press, but the real issue is that there are a number of people out there who are determined to steal from others and that is a problem for society as a whole and all operators, not just Aircoach.

Read the journal article customers clearly quote cases of thefts happening on the Dublin city network

devnull

I saw one mention of the Dublin City services, the rest were related to Intercity services.

I had a case stolen on Bus Eireann in the past in a very similar fashion and know others who have on other operators including Bus Eireann does that mean that Bus Eireann and other operators are a bad company and nobody should travel with them? No, it means that the problem isn't isolated to one company and happens on coach travel in general.

As said before, the procedures used for carrying luggage by Aircoach are the very same procedures that are used by pretty much every coach service in Ireland and passengers are at no more risk of Aircoach than they would be on another operator, you luggage is just as likely to be stolen on JJ Kavanagh, GoBus, Wexford Bus and Citylink.

J.pilkington

devnull wrote: »

I saw one mention of the Dublin City services, the rest were related to Intercity services.

Appreciate the acknowledgement that you misread the journal article

devnull wrote: »

As said before, the procedures used for carrying luggage by Aircoach are the very same procedures that are used by pretty much every coach service in Ireland and passengers are at no more risk of Aircoach than they would be on another operator, you luggage is just as likely to be stolen on JJ Kavanagh, GoBus, Wexford Bus and Citylink.

I would like to challenge you on that. From the disgruntled customers who have had bags stolen from aircoach they seem to report poor customer service from the bus drivers in question. I am a frequent traveller on the Dublin to Galway service (won’t name the private operator) and these operators seem to have at least taken some steps to limit baggage theft (I have observed the following on many occasions as I regularly have to leave airport luggage in the hold):
- For the Dublin to Galway service they load bags into a separate compartment and do not open this separate compartment in Dublin city thereby segregating these bags
- For the Galway – Dublin service they load airport bags in a separate compartment at the bus station in Galway and when they arrive in Dublin city the driver gets out of the bus and manually opens only the Dublin city compartment door and remains beside the door until he closes the door
- Plus the fact that their drivers are very engaging with customers I could not imagine that they would shrug their shoulders to a reported theft.

Im sure if Aircoach implemented something similar (from mickmmc post sounds like it happens on at least some of the time but I wonder is it consistent or does it depend on the drivers attitude) maybe reports of thefts would fall. Bearing in mind that most of the thefts reported on the journal / tripadvisor concern O’Connell street (plenty of suspect characters about) Aircoach should really invest in some customer service agents at that area, they have enough coaches passing through frequently to warrant this.

Nomis21

Yes the problem could be reduced by ticketing baggage and the driver supervising and checking baggage at each stop of the bus. This would reduce running times by up to half an hour on long routes and where there is competition on the route the operator who followed these procedures would lose business.

devnull

J.pilkington wrote: »

- For the Dublin to Galway service they load bags into a separate compartment and do not open this separate compartment in Dublin city thereby segregating these bags

- For the Galway – Dublin service they load airport bags in a separate compartment at the bus station in Galway and when they arrive in Dublin city the driver gets out of the bus and manually opens only the Dublin city compartment door and remains beside the door until he closes the door

With regards to separate compartments, this is only offered on a small number of coach models, this is not an industry standard feature, generally coaches will have one luggage door, others that have two still are just one compartment underneath and just an additional door to the same compartment. Some Aircoach vehicles close their luggage hold by manual closure and others by powered door, depends on the model, very few coach models have completely separate compartments.

Segregation will not resolve the overwhelming majority of issues in any case, since all it does is stop people taking the bag before you get off at your stop, it does not stop a passenger from removing the bag at the same stop and running off with it, which happened to me on Bus Eireann, and it also does not work on routes such as the 700/702/703 where then can be up to 20 stops.

Im sure if Aircoach implemented something similar (from mickmmc post sounds like it happens on at least some of the time but I wonder is it consistent or does it depend on the drivers attitude) maybe reports of thefts would fall. Bearing in mind that most of the thefts reported on the journal / tripadvisor concern O’Connell street (plenty of suspect characters about) Aircoach should really invest in some customer service agents at that area, they have enough coaches passing through frequently to warrant this.

See above.

Services between Dublin City Centre and Cork have monitoring both at Dublin Airport and at the City centre stop, it is not practical to have people watching luggage at every stop along the route when this may involve 20 stops in the case of the 700/702/703 and no company including Bus Eireann does this.

It is unfortunate that the state will not provide adequate infrastructure in the way of bus stations for all operators in the city which would certainly help with this issue since it would mean that security could keep an eye on all vehicles which would be much more effective for the protection of luggage.

Incidentally this incident would never had occured had the Cork and Belfast route served the same stops since it would allow one staff member to monitor both routes, although unfortunately they were not permitted to do this by the powers that be because of the congestion it would cause. Again bus stations are the answer here.

h57xiucj2z946q

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

simple stuff but ultimately it costs money so why would a company proactivly do it?

To ensure their customers feel safe, and will continue to use their service.

bk

Nomis21 wrote: »

If security is an issue for you, take the train, not the bus.

I wouldn't get too comfortable on a train either. Whole bags and things from bags get stolen on trains all the time. Afte rall the trains are full of free travel pass holding scum bags.

Leave a bag at the luggage rack while you sit further down the carriage and you mightn't even notice your bag been taken at an intermediary stop.

Even if you keep your bags with you at your seat, someone could steal something valuable out of it (laptop/ipad) while you are in the toilet.

This is why it is a good idea to keep valuables with you at all times (small laptop bag which you keep with you when you go to the toilet/restaurant car), locks (or keyrings) on zippers of bags and a small bicycle cord lock your luggage to frames.

The above won't protect you from all crime, but will make it harder for a thief to quickly grab unnoticed.

This advice is true for pretty much all travel, including, coaches, trains and planes.

Also I find it laughable that people think they would be safe at Bus Aras! You literally couldn't get a worse cesspool of drunks and druggies anywhere in the country! And the staff do little or nothing about them.

bk

Kayla Old Architect wrote: »

To ensure their customers feel safe, and will continue to use their service.

In all honesty, if you are using public transport (coach, train, plane) you pretty much have to take responsibility for yourself.

end of the road

Nomis21 wrote: »

Yes the problem could be reduced by ticketing baggage and the driver supervising and checking baggage at each stop of the bus. This would reduce running times by up to half an hour on long routes and where there is competition on the route the operator who followed these procedures would lose business.

unless you made such procedures law

bk wrote: »

free travel pass holding scum bags.

lovely.

bk wrote: »

Also I find it laughable that people think they would be safe at Bus Aras! You literally couldn't get a worse cesspool of drunks and druggies anywhere in the country! And the staff do little or nothing about them.

what do you expect the staff to do? they aren't the gards.

bk wrote: »

In all honesty, if you are using public transport (coach, train, plane) you pretty much have to take responsibility for yourself.

to a certain extent, yes. however if a company knows there is an issue and does little or nothing about it then they should be forced to, by law if needed.

monument

bk wrote: »

Afte rall the trains are full of free travel pass holding scum bags.

I'm guessing you're not trying to say that all free pass holders are using trains are scum bags but please be careful how you phrase it and please just avoid generalisations about users of any transport mode or means of payment.

Note to all: Do not respond to this post or the section of post I'm giving a warning to.

And please also remember that moderators are normal posters in forums which they do not mod and their status as mods on other sections of the site is nearly almost irrelevant, as it is in this case.

-- moderator

ProudDUB

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

simple stuff but ultimately it costs money so why would a company proactivly do it?

Because it is a service offered by the company. If publicized and marketed properly, it could set it apart from its competitors and attract more customers.

Nomis21 wrote: »

Yes the problem could be reduced by ticketing baggage and the driver supervising and checking baggage at each stop of the bus. This would reduce running times by up to half an hour on long routes and where there is competition on the route the operator who followed these procedures would lose business.

Again, it is a service that sets Operator A apart from Operator B. If I was using a bus service and had valuable luggage (such as people tend to have when they are using an airport service) I would look favourably on the company that offered security for my luggage. That is something I would value, even if the over all trip time was slightly longer.

You could install the sticker dispensing machines at Aircoach bus stops. People pay 50 cents to get one. They have the sticker'd bag ready to go into the cargo hold, as soon as the bus arrives. That saves time overall, plus the money goes to fund the system.

foggy_lad

One thing that could easily be done and should be done is that a camera feed from the cameras on the luggage bay should be shown on the monitors in the bus anytime the luggage doors are opened. This would allow those on board to see what is going on outside as it is just about impossible to see from inside the bus.

Most of the bus Eireann buses had this facility but sadly one by one the buses appeared unable to show the luggage bay or indeed even the road ahead on the monitors and now they are usually off.

schemingbohemia

devnull wrote: »

Services between Dublin City Centre and Cork have monitoring both at Dublin Airport and at the City centre stop, it is not practical to have people watching luggage at every stop along the route when this may involve 20 stops in the case of the 700/702/703 and no company including Bus Eireann does this.

It is unfortunate that the state will not provide adequate infrastructure in the way of bus stations for all operators in the city which would certainly help with this issue since it would mean that security could keep an eye on all vehicles which would be much more effective for the protection of luggage.

These 2 paragraphs are contradictory, having a private coach station (or sharing Busáras) would do nothing for the people who had their bags stolen at intermediary stops which as you state is not feasible to have monitoring at.

munchkin_utd

schemingbohemia wrote: »

These 2 paragraphs are contradictory, having a private coach station (or sharing Busáras) would do nothing for the people who had their bags stolen at intermediary stops which as you state is not feasible to have monitoring at.

indeed, but a service like Cork Dublin-City Dublin-Airport only has 1 intermediate stop so even the laziest of drivers could easily get out and police the bag compartment from what is the most scumbag and druggie infested street in Ireland!

Even if you couldnt separate the luggage into 2 compartments (which I have seen on limited service long distance coaches like the Galway service mentioned above, but cant remember for the life of me where) you could very simply tag city centre bags with one colour of a tag and airport a different colour.

The problems seem to be folks taking bags out at intermediate stops for people farther down the route, so having color coded tags would be a self regulating system as other passengers can clearly see that someone is mistakenly removing a bag at the wrong destination.

schemingbohemia

I'm not saying they shouldn't have someone at the O'Connell Street stop and/or Westmoreland Street, but I really think this is being blown way out of proportion. It will also likely add to ticket price.

Cookie_Monster

ProudDUB wrote: »

Because it is a service offered by the company. If publicized and marketed properly, it could set it apart from its competitors and attract more customers.

and while that's great in theory the single biggest factor in most people getting a bus in the first place is price, the only real consideration is who can get me to the airport the cheapest so the majority of people will not be willing to pay a premium as they don't see it as a major risk (until it happens to them). That's why we are in the very situation we see now in the first place.

ProudDUB

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

and while that's great in theory the single biggest factor in most people getting a bus in the first place is price, the only real consideration is who can get me to the airport the cheapest so the majority of people will not be willing to pay a premium as they don't see it as a major risk (until it happens to them). That's why we are in the very situation we see now in the first place.

If you want to get to the airport, it's cheaper to use Dublin Bus, than the Aircoach. But people still use the Aircoach a lot, so price can't be the only factor in determining peoples choices. As there is no train service from the airport, only buses, there will be plenty of people who are taking the bus, as its the only option, not because they are broke.

Besides, I never advocated anyone having to pay massively higher ticket prices, or a premium rate for a ticket, just because the bus has some sort of baggage ticketing/tagging system. If people want to use a ticket/sticker system, they can choose to pay for it or not. Pay your euro or your 50 cents to get your sticker, or don't. No one is forcing you to part with massive amounts of money.

Charles Babbage

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

simple stuff but ultimately it costs money so why would a company proactivly do it?

Perhaps to stop there being threads on Boards.ie, Journal.ie, Tripadvisor etc about them?

Sam Russell

Surely a CCTV camera watching the luggage compartment displaying on an on board TV screen would allow those on the bus to watch their luggage while the bus is stopped. If my bag was touched then I would react, as would anyone. The fact that the CCTV camera was there would act as a deterrent for the would-be thief.

I was at a Spanish airport looking for my hire car when I realised that the large heavy blue suitcase I was dragging round behind me was not mine, but an identical one purchased from the same better-value store. I returned to the carousel to find my bag going round and round and a couple waiting for their bag to appear. Oooops- but not always thieves.

ProudDUB

Cameras area a good idea, but a few problems I could see are:

- People falling asleep on the bus and not watching the screen when the bus stops. It may not be an issue on the Aircoach, as the journey times are not that long. It could be on longer inter city journeys, where a lot of the passengers tend to doze off.

- People at the back of the bus not being able to see a small screen at the front of the bus.

- Would the camera in the luggage hold & the the screen/tv inside the bus, have high enough picture quality for people to really be able to see what is going in inside the luggage hold? Or would it just be a static-y, black and white blur, like a lot of CCTV footage.

- What if the bus stops somewhere that is not well lit, or it's lashing rain? Would the camera be able to pick up what is going on with the luggage, or someone taking a bag out and walking off with it?


Not knocking the idea in general, but I'm not sure it would be a one stop shop fix.

Charles Babbage

Sam Russell wrote: »

Surely a CCTV camera watching the luggage compartment displaying on an on board TV screen would allow those on the bus to watch their luggage while the bus is stopped. If my bag was touched then I would react, as would anyone. The fact that the CCTV camera was there would act as a deterrent for the would-be thief.

I was at a Spanish airport looking for my hire car when I realised that the large heavy blue suitcase I was dragging round behind me was not mine, but an identical one purchased from the same better-value store. I returned to the carousel to find my bag going round and round and a couple waiting for their bag to appear. Oooops- but not always thieves.

Indeed someone walked off with my bag from the Aircoach, it being the same type from a better value store, a different colour but at night in sodium street lights that may have been less than obvious.

A camera would be better than nothing, together with a degree of segregation of the luggage so only part of the luggage was opened at one time. And of course the reason there is so much luggage under the bus is that they have miniscule roof racks in the actual bus.

mickmmc

There is a CCTV camera watching the luggage area which appears on the board screen at the front of the bus when the baggage door is open on part of the Aircoach fleet.

The 10 141 Plaxton Panthers on the Cork route have a CCTV camera for the luggage area; the image is black and white and the quality of the images from the camera are poor. If you are at the back of the bus you will not be able to see the screen.

The 6 152 automatic Plaxton Panthers, which have a toilet on-board and appear on the Cork route, do not have an on-board screen watching the luggage area when the door is open.

STEINBERG

There is a very simple solution to this which i came across recently on a trip to Brazil.

The way it works there is that the Driver and another colleague take the bags from the passengers before they get on the bus, they have twin tickets with matching numbers. One ticket gets handed to the passenger and the other gets wrapped around the handle of the luggage.

Whenever the bus stops the driver gets off with his colleague, removes the bags from the bus and basically the passenger does not get the bag unless they can produce the ticket.

Simple.

devnull

Which instantly doubles the staffing costs of all services meaning that a significant price rise is required.

ProudDUB

Yep. A ticketing system for bags is the way to go, but not to the extent that it doubles the manpower cost on the route.

STEINBERG

devnull wrote: »

Which instantly doubles the staffing costs of all services meaning that a significant price rise is required.

Understandable but this is very possible for the driver to do on his own, they literally stand there and do nothing anyway.

beer enigma

STEINBERG wrote: »

Understandable but this is very possible for the driver to do on his own, they literally stand there and do nothing anyway.

I beg to disagree, I travel Cork - Dublin every Friday & Monday and the drivers are busy checking the online bookings and issuing fare tickets whilst passengers are loading luggage. Its enough of a struggle when the coach is full to maintain passenger discipline as it is - can be a real dogfight for places for non-booked passengers.

Generally where there are no support staff (such as Cork) the driver arrives, opens the luggage door and then gets back to start the ticket checks. If he had to get off every time someone rolled up with luggage, it would take an age to get away. The antiquated online booking system and manual check of online bookings from a sheet of paper take long enough as it is.

Add to the fact that given current weather, the driver would end up soaked before he even started the 4hr drive - not exactly the safest way to start.

I agree that ticketing is the only option, but I don't see it working unless the driver has some support at the baggage loading stage & he can then validate tickets against bags at collection. I personally only carry a small bag deliberately so I don't have to worry about stowing luggage.

As has been mentioned, its a catch 22 - I use it for price as commuting twice weekly gets expensive, but to keep the price down, they run it as cheaply as possible, I get that, but do believe they need to up their act - I'd gladly pay another €5 if I thought it would make an improvement, but not much more than that.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Sam Russell

ProudDUB wrote: »

Cameras area a good idea, but a few problems I could see are:

- People falling asleep on the bus and not watching the screen when the bus stops. It may not be an issue on the Aircoach, as the journey times are not that long. It could be on longer inter city journeys, where a lot of the passengers tend to doze off.

- People at the back of the bus not being able to see a small screen at the front of the bus.

- Would the camera in the luggage hold & the the screen/tv inside the bus, have high enough picture quality for people to really be able to see what is going in inside the luggage hold? Or would it just be a static-y, black and white blur, like a lot of CCTV footage.

- What if the bus stops somewhere that is not well lit, or it's lashing rain? Would the camera be able to pick up what is going on with the luggage, or someone taking a bag out and walking off with it?


Not knocking the idea in general, but I'm not sure it would be a one stop shop fix.

There is little point in having CCTV that is low grade, under illuminated and not recorded. The capital cost would be small and would provide the company with some defence.

The fact that the image is shown on screen in HD and well illuminated would act as a deterrent for the would-be thief and that would be welcome. More than one screen could be available within the coach, and a sign saying it was recorded - all adds to an air of concern by the company.

I was on a CIE bus once and it had a camera that showed the road ahead, but when the bus stopped, the screen showed the passengers getting off/on in case they fell or such. Clearly aimed at insurance claims.

Tickets would be an added bonus in the case of disputes/claims.

munchkin_utd

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munchkin_utd

what you need is someone to take the bus companies to court, which I am surprised hasnt happened yet seeing as this isnt a new problem

In Munich the first such case in Germany was decided just before christmas** and was successful against the largest intercity bus company Flixbus, and they had to pay €500 to a lady for the loss of her bag and contents.
The specific case was won as it was gross negligence that the driver opened the luggage doors and made no attempt to supervise the luggage bay (i.e. he left the bus completely) . Like every bus company, they state clearly that they take no responsibility for your luggage .

The judge rightly said that no blame can be put on the passenger, as it cannot be expected that every passenger get off at every stop to supervise what is happening at the luggage hold.
So the precidence here was not that you are automatically entitled to money if you loose your bag, but if the driver doesnt even make an effort (like aircoach) to protect your bags then they are liable for their negligence (and again in the context of the fact that the customer is somewhat powerless to check the bag is ok, so that HAS to be the duty of the company to make reasonable efforts)

Now, if dozens upon dozens of people started taking cases to the small claims court in Ireland on a similar basis, you'd soon have aircoach bucking up their act to reduce the risk of a scumbag robbing your bag.

In case anyone wants to look it up, its case number Az. 283 C 5956/15, Munich Amtsgericht from 08.12.2015 .
Heres some links to info (that google will translate for you if necessary)
http://www.rechtsindex.de/reiserecht/5344-urteil-fernbusreiseunternehmen-muessen-fuer-gepaeckverlust-haften
https://www.test.de/Fernbusreisen-Unternehmen-muss-fuer-Gepaeck-haften-4965197-0/
http://www.versicherungsjournal.de/markt-und-politik/streit-um-obhutspflicht-124751.php

** NOTE: long distance coach services only exist for 2 or 3 years, so people dont think that its normal or ok to have your bag robbed from a luggage hold that you no control over yourself