Energy white paper to be released in December 2015

power101

So after many delays it finally looks like the energy white paper will finally be released next week by Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources Alex White. I can only hope that the paper being released at Christmas is not meant to reduce coverage of its contents. Whatever is included it needs to be big so we're not left paying possibly hundreds of millions in fines for missing our current targets.

1) I'm hoping to see more supports for Irish customers to invest in their their own renewable energy especially household and business solar. (FIT, Vat refund on system etc)

2) I would like to see a change where new wind farms give a certain % of equity or profit/sales % to the local community where it is based. I believe this would get rid of a lot of opposition towards them.

3) I'd like to see more supports for Electric Vehicles especially the creation of a countrywide fast charging network.

4) Continuing better homes grants by the SEAI for insulation etc

The last thing I would want to see is more huge grants given by the current government for biomass plants like Mayo renewable power. They're getting 4 times the normal price paid for electricity on the wholesale market. Owned by an American hedge fund which is planning on importing all of it's wood chips for fuel from the US which is beyond a joke. If they had any intention of buying the fuel from Ireland they would be well able to do it with 2 years to plan and prepare until the plant is running. Outrageous waste of tax payers money. I would much prefer Irish tax payers themselves given supports than Hedge funds milking us.

Moooooooooo

What do others want to see in this white paper?

quentingargan

power101 wrote: »

What do others want to see in this white paper?

Is this like a letter to Santa? I too would like to see supports that encourage residences, industries and the public at large to participate in renewable energy.

But I fear that the powerful lobbying of invested interests will see large central generation plants supported. According to this, solar parks will be developed for the benefit of Australian investment banks.

I hope I'm wrong. Time to write to Santa.

freddyuk

Well let's hope the Irish government is not following the lead of the UK government which is about to cancel the support for PV and fail to meet it's obligations to meet the EU energy targets by 2020. Maybe the Irish have more to lose by not meeting EU requirements.
Of course the EU is not helping by keeping the solar power cost artificially high having just extended the Minimum Import Pricing to protect the EU based solar companies. This is killing growth in the industry which is ripe to expand without the need for financial support if the free market economy is allowed to work thus making the components more affordable.
If the Solar Farms suck up all the grid capacity and take the profits overseas then local business or even domestic customers may not be allowed to install their own PV as the grid export capacity is not there. Again it has already happened in the UK so hopefully the same mistakes will not be repeated here.
There is a huge, well organised solar industry based lobby in the UK which has failed to convince the politicians that jobs are more important than votes and thousands of jobs will disappear in 2016. I fear politicians who are insulated from the real world will never learn the lesson.
I don't believe in Santa!!

jathclare

For viability sake I would like to see FIT incentives such as lowering or eliminating account standing charges for FIT Exporters, increasing Tariff, credits or grants to cover installation/set up costs or preferential unit consumption rates.

power101

And we have a date. Wednesday 16th December it will be released

http://www.farmersjournal.ie/white-paper-on-energy-to-be-launched-next-wednesday-195891/

Calahonda52

power101 wrote: »

3) I'd like to see more supports for Electric Vehicles especially the creation of a countrywide fast charging network.

a commitment have p****s who park their big polluting 5 by 4's in such bays:D

quentingargan

power101 wrote: »

And we have a date. Wednesday 16th December it will be released

http://www.farmersjournal.ie/white-paper-on-energy-to-be-launched-next-wednesday-195891/

You may notice that there is no time mentioned in that article. In case anyone with a contrary view was thinking of rocking up and asking some awkward questions, this is by invitation only. So a nice white-washing media event. :mad:

power101

Energy white paper has been released!

www.dcenr.gov.ie/energy/SiteCollectionDocuments/Energy-Initiatives/Energy%20White%20Paper%20-%20Dec%202015.pdf

quentingargan

power101 wrote: »

Energy white paper has been released!

[URL]=http://www.dcenr.gov.ie/energy/SiteCollectionDocuments/Energy-Initiatives/Energy White Paper - Dec 2015.pdf[/URL]

Reading it now. Quite vague and wafflesome. For example;

"exploring the scope to provide market support for micro generation" Huh??

gman2k

.....
137. Solar photovoltaic (PV) technology is rapidly becoming cost competitive for electricity
generation, not only compared with other renewables but also compared with
conventional forms of generation. The deployment of solar in Ireland has the potential
to increase energy security, contribute to our renewable energy targets, and support
economic growth and jobs. Solar also brings a number of benefits like relatively quick
construction and a range of deployment options, including solar thermal for heat and solar
PV for electricity. It can be deployed in roof-mounted or ground-mounted installations. In
this way, it can empower Irish citizens and communities to take control of the production
and consumption of energy. Solar technology is one of the technologies being considered
in the context of the new support scheme for renewable electricity generation which will be
available in 2016.
....

gman2k

....
 We will support the deployment of heat from renewable sources through the Renewable Energy
Feed-In Tariff (REFIT) 3 scheme and develop new supports to meet 2030 renewable heat targets.

131. The REFIT 2 and 3 schemes remain open to applicants until the end of 2015 and each
scheme requires projects to meet certain milestones regarding construction. The policy
context and requirements of the new wholesale market for electricity (I-SEM) continue
to emerge. Regulatory certainty is needed as early as possible in that process, to enable
promoters to continue to access funding and progress projects. In parallel with market
developments, the DCENR is developing a new support scheme for renewable electricity
to be available from 2016. A key component of this process is stakeholder engagement.
The scheme will be subject to the new rules on public support for projects in the field of
energy, adopted by the European Commission in 2014, which seek to promote a gradual
move to market-based support for renewable energy.

277. Government has intervened in energy markets through a variety of measures to achieve
policy objectives and targets, including: renewable energy feed in tariff (REFIT) for RES-E
281. Policy-related costs must be minimised as far as possible.....
282. Government interventions are subject to European Union State Aid rules.

Government will widen the opportunity for citizen participation in energy matters by:
 supporting community participation in renewable energy and energy efficiency projects
 facilitating access to the national grid for designated renewable electricity projects, and developing mechanisms to allow communities receive payment for electricity



So, no news on support for micro generators, and not looking likely based on their language.
Just kicking the ball down the road.....

Conor20

Agreed. After reading through the White Paper, there appears to be no explicit intention to provide a feed in tariff for Domestic Solar PV, which is a real disappointment. This would appear to have huge potential to remove fossil fuel consumption in our power plants, so it's puzzling as to why it isn't even mentioned, particularly given a Feed in Tariff exists in most developed countries.

It seems that heat is the focus rather than electricity generation for the FIT:
"We will support the deployment of heat from renewable sources through the Renewable Energy Feed-In Tariff (REFIT) 3 scheme and develop new supports to meet 2030 renewable heat targets"

Grants and supports to more quickly transition our transport fleet to electric appear to be on the way:
"We will support the adoption of electric and gas vehicles through grants and tax relief."

Does anyone have a link to the Smart Metering Program mentioned? Is there an intention to roll out smart meters across the country? If so, when?
"The National Smart Metering Programme aims to fundamentally transform the range of consumer services, technologies and options on offer, with:
• better information on electricity and gas consumption, delivered in-home and real-time, to help consumers reduce their overall energy use and bills
..
• consumers who invest in micro-generation, solar PV or storage systems are enabled and incentivised to participate actively in the electricity market."

quentingargan

I hope you are wrong Conor20. But the lack of anything specific on a situation which is an anomaly in Europe, is disheartening.

You can't help feeling that companies rolling out solar parks have been lobbying intensely. Companies like Amerenco, owned by a former CEO of Bord Gais (and one time election candidate for FG) would have the ear of the right people. ESB also would be shaping the agenda. They have always put huge and ridiculous obstacles in the way of microgeneration. Their model is running the grid to ship electricity from producer to consumer. Microgen is anathema to that model.

Few people are aware for example that on a system over 11kw, ESB requires witness testing of a specific relay to prevent islanding. So a 15kw system needs much the same equipment and testing as a 50Mw wind farm. This can push the cost of a 15kw installation up by about 33% and I don't know any other country demanding this on systems of that sort of size..:mad:

Calahonda52

Is the Smart metering project not on hold pending some data protection issues.

Cant remember but it was an issue

recent stuff here
http://www.cer.ie/document-detail/Smart-Metering-Project-Phase-3/1021

Also these guys
http://cigreireland.ie

quentingargan

It seems according to to Irish Times that there was more in the Ministers speech;

The measures include a substantial expansion of solar power, primarily through solar farms; the increased use of bio-energy (including bio fuel crops), as well as tapping the potential of ocean and tide energy.
There are hundreds of solar farms already in operation in Devon and Cornwall and similar farms could be located in the southern tip of the country, particularly counties Wexford, Waterford and Cork, he said.

See here

rolion

So...in my pocket language...the money saved for 3kw solar system can be spent on a nice Santa present to my wife,aka new kitchen units.Grand....

nice_guy80

Are these politicians clueless??

We could close Moneypoint if every new house being built HAD to have solar PV panels installed, and if we retrofitted houses with the technology

Bring back the Green party

rolion

nice_guy80 wrote: »

Are these politicians clueless??

We could close Moneypoint if every new house being built HAD to have solar PV panels installed, and if we retrofitted houses with the technology

Bring back the Green party

Hmmm...

On another planet,will have been called coruption and traffic of influence / interests.
On some side of the Solar system it's called lobby.

Who do you think is paying their unreal disconnected from reality expenses and safe guaranteed dirty filthy pensions:us (smaller panels) or them (big big panels) !??

Forget it...we are too small for a so big war.

Feel sorry for the some vendors and installers as they will be hit (see UK).

freddyuk

Here is the UK government response to the recent review of Solar support:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/486082/FITs_Review_Govt__response_Final.pdf

The concensus seems to be the solar hardware cost is dropping fast so there is no need for financial support - which would be closer to the truth if the EU (Germany) has not extended it's embargo into 2017 on solar module imports from outside the EU to prevent any competition from non EU producers. Added to that is the requirement to impose VAT on approved installations at 20% rather than the existing 5% so bumping up the cost even further.
At least in UK the permitted development rules allow a sensible amount of PV to be installed to make it viable for the average home whereas in Ireland the limit is less than 2kw. Even if you wanted to consider the home storage route, based on the prospect of cheaper storage solutions which are coming on stream, you still need a respectable amount of PV to make it work so this needs to change. (notwithstanding the issue of summertime over production).

The Irish plan outlined here from the Solar Power Portal:
http://www.solarpowerportal.co.uk/news/ireland_to_introduce_domestic_and_utility_scale_solar_support_next_year_347

Politicians will now dive off to the country for their hard earned christmas break until mid January. We will be picking through the pages of the reports looking for any more nasty surprises hidden in the small print.

strandsman

nice_guy80 wrote: »

Are these politicians clueless??

We could close Moneypoint if every new house being built HAD to have solar PV panels installed, and if we retrofitted houses with the technology

Bring back the Green party

you can't close Moneypoint, Unions wont allow that happen, If PV or wind generating popped up all over the country what will the ESB (or whatever they call themselves) do? ESB also wants to protect it base. so many things to take into consideration.

Conor20

Perhaps I was being overly pessimistic. I see a much more upbeat analysis of the whitepaper here:

"Ireland’s Department of Communications, Energy and Natural Resources (DCENR) has confirmed it will introduce new support frameworks for both utility-scale and microgenerators of renewable sources, including solar, early next year.

“The deployment of solar in Ireland has the potential to increase energy security, contribute to our renewable energy targets, and support economic growth and jobs. Solar also brings a number of benefits like relatively quick construction and a range of deployment options, including solar thermal for heat and solar PV for electricity,” the whitepaper states.
..
The whitepaper follows a report published by Big Four consultancy KPMG which found that Ireland could support almost 4GW of solar by 2030 at a cost of just €670 million to the government. That support cost would however add more than €2 billion to the value of Ireland’s economy as well as supporting more than 7,000 jobs.

While there has been no indication as to the support rates Ireland will set, KPMG recommended an opening domestic FiT rate of €0.13/kWh, gradually degressing to €0.02/kWh in 2030. "

Maybe there is still the possibility of a Feed in Tariff for Domestic Solar PV in 2016 after all.

quentingargan

Conor20 wrote: »

Perhaps I was being overly pessimistic. I see a much more upbeat analysis of the whitepaper here:

...While there has been no indication as to the support rates Ireland will set, KPMG recommended an opening domestic FiT rate of €0.13/kWh, gradually degressing to €0.02/kWh in 2030.[/I] "

Maybe there is still the possibility of a Feed in Tariff for Domestic Solar PV in 2016 after all.

I sort of wonder what KPMG's role in the industry would be, and I have to conclude that it would be on the side of the solar park developer rather than the microgeneration side. Somebody or something has to be paying for the production of these reports.

The FIT is a fundamentally flawed system. It pays you for producing the electricity, regardless of whether you use it or not. I have been working with renewables in the UK where you get paid for producing electricity, but don't get paid for exporting it. Almost all the systems I see have devices installed to minimise exports, using the surplus power to heat water, swimming pools or just about anything, including very inefficient oil filled radiators. I regularly see wind turbines being paid £50 a day for their FITs who never put any usable electricity onto the grid.

I would far prefer to see a system that pays you for EXPORTS to encourage conservation and get domestic systems that export usable electricity onto the grid.

Calahonda52

quentingargan wrote: »

I sort of wonder what KPMG's role in the industry would be, ...

be just like the boom:
advise on the way up and
advise on the way down,
just look at the amount of stuff K Wallace from KPMG has done post the bust.

We will have abandoned wind and PV farms, knee deep in water etc...
Sorry: this is season of goodwill so will stop now while ahead:D:D

Keep well in this festive season!

In case u missed this
http://www.talkmarkets.com/content/global-markets/giant-green-energy-boondoggle-flops-in-spain?post=79100

What will we call the rescue vehicle: SAMA; WAMA..:)

rolion

Any updates on the matter,please !?
Whats going to happen if I connect my PV inverter to the grid now,any advantages or not ?
Thanks