Apartment Issue

LegacyUser

I moved into an apartment about half a year ago. The person mentioned that they have a partner, but said that they are generally “respectful” of space etc, so this wouldn’t be an issue. Fast forward a few months, and (obviously) there is an issue. The partner stays over four or five nights a week. The flatmate and partner regularly monopolise the kitchen. The partner literally ignores me when I walk into the kitchen to put groceries in the fridge etc. My flatmate and I are left to exchange a few pleasantries, and then I have to withdraw until they are finished using the kitchen. Obviously I am never expressly told to leave, but who would stay while essentially being ignored by the partner and remain in an atmosphere of general awkwardness?

The partner doesn’t pay rent or make any bill contributions. What annoys me is that if I raise the issue, I will be regarded as the one who is acting unreasonably. (I don’t even want the partner to pay rent/ make a bill contribution – I actually don’t want them there at all, or at least as often as they are.) I’m just wondering as to how to raise the issue, or if I should at all? I worry that this is the kind of thing you can never really backtrack on – if I say I don’t want the partner there as often, I will be the “bad guy”, unreasonable etc. If I say nothing however the situation will carry on as is, and that’s not going to work for me. Any advice would be appreciated!

Ursus Horribilis

Oh dear. Is moving an option for you? That's what I believe you're going to end up doing eventually.

What you're asking for is not unreasonable. You're as entitled to use the kitchen as the other person. This partner staying over is costing you money too I'm sure, especially if they're using the shower and other facilities. It'd be only fair that the partner contributes money to the running of the apartment but they don't sound like the sort who will. As things stand, they're pretty much living together without having to pay full rent for an apartment of their own. You've been cowed into submission - they've effectively got the kitchen to themselves and you're stuck hiding away in the bedroom.

This is exactly why most people refuse to share with couples. As you're finding straight away here, it's a 2 against 1 scenario. If you were in a house share and there were other housemates, you could have had backing if you wanted the partner not to be around so much. I don't think you have a hope to be honest. Your flatmate will no doubt tell you that you knew moving in that there was a partner. The partner will back them up. You'll be back hiding in your bedroom and things will be worse. In short, I think you should move.

LegacyUser

Thanks for the reply. Moving is not an option - I'm locked into a lease for another half a year. Even if I wasn't, I'm not sure that I would be willing to move - the apartment is located near where I work, and the rent is pretty decent for what would be considered a tough market.

The thing is, I really like the apartment, and I don't want to move out. I'm just worried that if I raise the issue, the other person will take a dislike to me, and things will get awkward. I tend not to be around a lot because of work, and I like to rest when I am, so I wouldn't say I'm the most entertaining flatmate to have. But even if I am a boring person (I accept that probably is the case), surely I am entitled to live in accommodation I am paying a fairly substantial amount of money to rent free of a third/ de facto flatmate?

Ursus Horribilis

It's a given that if you raise the issue, your flatmate won't be impressed. Why should he/she? You'd be upsetting their love nest. You've got two options really. Either say nothing and suck it up for the next 6 months. Or say something and most likely fall out with the flatmate. The choice is yours. As I said before, this is exactly why lots of people refuse to rent with couples. Next time you move, try to rent with someone who's single.

LegacyUser

Sorry, I think I wasn't clear - the lease is with only one other person, their partner wasn't part of the deal at all! That's why it was portrayed as not being an issue - the partner's flat is about 10 mins down the road, yet they never spend time there at all. The partner just seems to stay over when they mutually feel like it. (So in summary, I'm definitely not renting with a couple, the other half of the couple just stays over too often and thus makes it feel like renting with a couple!)

I am going to bring it up when we next discuss bills, I'm just worried that the other person will challenge me, and say if the partner being around four or five days a week isn't reasonable, how many is? And if I'm so quiet, why am I even bothered by the partner being there in the first place?

Augme

ApartmentIssue wrote: »

Obviously I am never expressly told to leave, but who would stay while essentially being ignored by the partner and remain in an atmosphere of general awkwardness?

I would. When I pay the rent I use the place as I want. If that means staying in the kitchen with someone who's partner is ignoring me then I don't mind. You need to realise that some people will take a mile if you give them an inch. The boyfriend probably realise he can bully you out of the kitchen by making it awkward. You need to be more assertive and learn to stand up for yourself. Use the kitchen as you want.

Ursus Horribilis

Augme wrote: »

I would. When I pay the rent I use the place as I want. If that means staying in the kitchen with someone who's partner is ignoring me then I don't mind. You need to realise that some people will take a mile if you give them an inch. The boyfriend probably realise he can bully you out of the kitchen by making it awkward. You need to be more assertive and learn to stand up for yourself. Use the kitchen as you want.

This is the other option but I'm getting the impression you're not the sort of person who is assertive. I could be wrong. You need to have a bit of a thick hide on you to stand up to this intimidation.

Ann84

Why can't they stay at the partners house? House sharing is just that, hose sharing... They are not living together, if they want to live together, they can do just that!
I recently had to have this same conversation with my housemate, not 4/5 nights a week but literally all weekend every weekend...
It was an awkward conversation but I said I didn't want to live with a couple and would appreciate a bit more 'balance' from them in how they split their time between houses. It was awkward but I approached it in a 'I'd appreciate' rather than 'please stop' way if that makes sense and now they are doing every second weekend which is better and the awkwardness has died down. They said themselves it was getting a bit unfair but I may have gotten lucky!

athtrasna

OP are you living with an owner occupier? You refer to them as the person rather than your housemate?

bloominballix

Turn the tables. When they're in a communal space together, you plant yourself there for the duration. Make small talk. Make them go to their bedroom, rather than you retreating to yours.

LegacyUser

For some reason my last reply never appeared, but no, I am not living with an owner occupier or a couple. I moved in with one other person, who, to be fair, is unfailingly polite and considerate in every other respect. The latter is what makes me think that the partner being around issue is due more to obliviousness than actual selfishness. I am worried though that if I bring the issue up the other person will take a disliking to me, which obviously doesn't contribute to general harmony in the apartment.

LegacyUser

OP is the other person renting or do they own the apartment? If they are renting are you subletting from them or renting directly from a landlord? Advice depends greatly on the answer to those questions.

If you are both renting from the landlord then your only options are to speak to the flatmate and at least bring up the OH ignoring you and making you feel uncomfortable and they aren't being respectively of space as claimed if you can't use the communal rooms and you should also address the issue of bills.

If your renting from the owner well you've feck all rights but also the lease is also worthless so you can move out with no notice. If your subletting that's a whole different issue.

purplekitty

Been in the couples situation before.... yup. ... awkward!!! We were asked to either moved on officially and divide the rent 3 ways or cut down the visits. It's fully acceptable and to be honest... they are taking the piss a bit.... you are basically giving them a place to play house without the grown up part of paying rent. They need to grown up!!!!

Exclamation Marc

If they are there 4/5 nights, make a stand and say you're not longer paying half the bills. You're not using half the electricity etc so they can't argue with you.

As others say, as uncomfortable as it, use the kitchen when they're using it. You're paying for it, it's your space too. If you let someone away with it, they're hardly going to care about you.

It sounds like it's going to be an awkward 6 months regardless so I would have it out with your housemate, you pay rent, it's your home as well.

Also, as athtrasna asked, are you living with a housemate who also has a lease or the owner?

LegacyUser

Unfortunately none of my replies seem to be going through - but no, it is not an owner/occupier situation, and I am not living with a couple - just with one quite inconsiderate (but otherwise tidy/ pleasant) flatmate.

I am sure my tone has changed over the course of the three replies (!) that I have attempted to post, but I think I am going to try to have a rational conversation with the flatmate about it. There's no point carrying on feeling silently resentful about the situation. In addition, I'm going home for Christmas in a couple of weeks, so there's a cool-off period if things get a bit heated.

LegacyUser

It takes a while for the replies to be approved op because you aren't registered but they should go through

About your problem, it wouldnt be the rent that would bother me but more so the fact you are made feel like a stranger in your own place. I would have a word with the person you are renting with because living the way you are for a minimum of another 6 months sounds miserable

Exclamation Marc

ApartmentIssue wrote: »

Unfortunately none of my replies seem to be going through - but no, it is not an owner/occupier situation, and I am not living with a couple - just with one quite inconsiderate (but otherwise tidy/ pleasant) flatmate.

I am sure my tone has changed over the course of the three replies (!) that I have attempted to post, but I think I am going to try to have a rational conversation with the flatmate about it. There's no point carrying on feeling silently resentful about the situation. In addition, I'm going home for Christmas in a couple of weeks, so there's a cool-off period if things get a bit heated.

If your housemate is not the owner then you're in a much stronger position. There's no way in hell you should be splitting bills down the middle, she's probably in the house as much as the two of you. Tell your housemate that if she's to spending as much time in the apartment as she is, you're splitting the bills three ways or you'll be contacting the landlord as you effectively have a lodger in the house contributing nothing.

Check your lease to see if it mentions anything about lodgers/visitors. Having someone over that much during the week is very obstructive to your enjoyment of the property.

She has zero rights in that apartment, you do, it's your kitchen more than hers and you are correct to have a conversation with him.

beks101

Yeah I'd definitely check the lease and see if it says anything about house guests, which is essentially what your flatmate's bf is.

Then "Susie can I have a quick word? I was under the impression before I moved in that I would be living with one other person, but your boyfriend seems to spend most of the week here. I've no problem with him, but I had no intention of living with a couple and I wondered if you might be able to balance the time you spend between here and his place a bit more evenly?"

That and start asserting dominance around the place. If it was me I'd be cooking my dinner in the kitchen every night and plonking myself in front of the TV and taking phone calls and having my own boyfriend around and all sorts. Basically, LIVING in it. Don't let them monopolize the place. If they're hogging the TV, "do you mind if I switch over? I really want to catch the news". Don't be afraid of them and especially don't be afraid of yer man. Sweet little deal he has now, living rent-free and coming and going as he pleases.

liz lemoncello

Manufactured Miracle wrote: »

....There's no way in hell you should be splitting bills down the middle, she's probably in the house as much as the two of you. Tell your housemate that if she's to spending as much time in the apartment as she is, you're splitting the bills three ways or you'll be contacting the landlord as you effectively have a lodger in the house contributing nothing. .....

Be careful, though as if he were to contribute, that would be basically giving him rights to the place.

Shrap

beks101 wrote: »

That and start asserting dominance around the place. If it was me I'd be cooking my dinner in the kitchen every night and plonking myself in front of the TV and taking phone calls and having my own boyfriend around and all sorts. Basically, LIVING in it. Don't let them monopolize the place. If they're hogging the TV, "do you mind if I switch over? I really want to catch the news". Don't be afraid of them and especially don't be afraid of yer man. Sweet little deal he has now, living rent-free and coming and going as he pleases.

This. Yeah, you really need to start throwing your weight around a little bit more, and I don't mean in a swaggery aggressive way - just BE there more. In the kitchen, when they're there too. Bring in your ipad/phone/laptop or something and if asked, claim it's warmer in there. Make a cuppa and stay there to drink it. Chat away with the flat-mate who you say is unfailingly polite to you, but you don't seem to know very well, and ignore his/her partner if he/she ignores. Part of this problem could well be just you feeling so awkward around a couple, which in fairness is not all their fault, even if the partner does stay silent in a "I'm waiting till you're gone to talk again" kind of way. Perhaps there's shyness on both sides?

You say you're quiet OP - no harm in that at all, or in being "boring", as you put it. But tbh, skulking away from company as soon as possible is more of a shyness issue for you I think. Maybe try and toughen up on yourself a little and stick out the company/force the issue a bit?

kjl

Have you ever tried making conversation with your flatmates partner?

Perhaps she is cold with you because you are cold with her.

I think have a conversation with your flatmate and just highlight that you think it's a little unfair that she is essentially living with you and it's making you feel awkward. Don't say anything negative about her but highlight that you want to feel welcome in your own house and currently that is not the case.

Best of luck

LegacyUser

Maybe it is a mutual misunderstanding, and I should make more of an effort. I still think paying rent every month entitles me to go into the kitchen without having to brave yet another awkward encounter, but that is the nature of housesharing in fairness.

It's just the presumptuousness emanating from the partner when they sit there chopping vegetables at the kitchen table (they *always* do this) and I struggle to find something in my cupboard/ the fridge and then subside to my bedroom for the evening!

Shrap

ApartmentIssue wrote: »

It's just the presumptuousness emanating from the partner when they sit there chopping vegetables at the kitchen table (they *always* do this) and I struggle to find something in my cupboard/ the fridge and then subside to my bedroom for the evening!

Ha, gotta say, your struggle to find something in your cupboard is really not their fault! Also, I chop veg at the table. It's easier to sit and do that. I'm sorry I'm not seeing the problem here - this presumptuousness.....is it that she presumes it's ok to sit at the table *always* chopping veg, or is it that neither of you know what to say to each other that's causing you to take fright?

liz lemoncello

Shrap wrote: »

Ha, gotta say, your struggle to find something in your cupboard is really not their fault! Also, I chop veg at the table. It's easier to sit and do that. I'm sorry I'm not seeing the problem here - this presumptuousness.....is it that she presumes it's ok to sit at the table *always* chopping veg, or is it that neither of you know what to say to each other that's causing you to take fright?

Maybe it the fact that *s/he feels at home enough to cook in someone else's kitchen that is unsettling the OP?

* Sorry, I'm not sure if the housemate's partner is male or female.

Shrap

liz lemoncello wrote: »

Maybe it the fact that *s/he feels at home enough to cook in someone else's kitchen that is unsettling the OP?

Yes, I think that probably IS the problem, plus the fact she (I think) ignores the OP in his own home. But trying to get to the bottom of this is, it seems perhaps the OP could loosen up a little bit about the situation too?

Having "couple-time" 4-5 nights a week in his house does seem excessive, so that could be tackled by talking alright. However, if you have a house-mate with a partner, you have to assume that they will be doing coupley things, like cooking together, even if one of them doesn't live there. It would be seriously impolite to require the partner to sit on her hands and wait for the legitimate housemate to make dinner, no? It would be different if they were constantly draped all over each other in the kitchen with much public display of affection, but by the sounds of it, they're only chopping veg and making dinners.....

I assume she does her fair share of washing up and tidying?

bloominballix

Shrap wrote: »

Y
I assume she does her fair share of washing up and tidying?

Who cares??? The problem is she's there practically the whole week!

Shrap

bloominballix wrote: »

Who cares??? The problem is she's there practically the whole week!

Yes, that needs to be approached right enough, like I said. I'm just not sure that the OP should include talking about how awful it is that the girlfriend is chopping veg at the kitchen table.

ted1

ApartmentIssue wrote: »

if the partner being around four or five days a week isn't reasonable, how many is? ?

he's there for over 50% of the week, he lives there.

beks101

Shrap wrote: »

Yes, that needs to be approached right enough, like I said. I'm just not sure that the OP should include talking about how awful it is that the girlfriend is chopping veg at the kitchen table.

To be honest if some guy that wasn't paying rent or contributing to bills or recognized by the landlord as a tenant in my home was hogging the kitchen every night when I was trying to cook dinner, and using it as his own without so much as a "hi, how are you?" I'd be fairly bloody pissed off too.

He doesn't contribute, he has his own place down the road but is perfectly happy to spend all of his time with his OH in the OP's gaff to the point where he/she is uncomfortable in his/her own home and feels more like a house guest.

When you house share, you're always at risk of feeling like this. You might live with someone you don't like, or a 'hogger' who comes and goes as he pleases without consideration for other housemates. But in this case, the OP moved in with someone he/she gets on with and was sold a little story about the flatmate's boyfriend's presence in the house I.E that he's almost never there. That's not the case, and what he's currently doing is in breach of whatever verbal contract was made.

Shrap

That's true enough. I was just wondering a bit about whether the OP's leaving the kitchen so hurriedly because of feeling so uncomfortable might have been more about their shyness than about the couple actually making him feel unwelcome.

I do get that they are totally hogging his space, just by being a couple who weren't supposed to be there so constantly.