Player burnout proposals

dr.kenneth noisewater

Some radical changes suggested by Duffy, axing U-21 football being the most high profile
http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=246389

The full list of proposals - which would be introduced in 2017 and 2018 - is as follows:

1. Re-grade the inter-county minor grade from U18 to U17.

2. Play the new minor championships alongside the senior championships as is currently the case.

3. Discontinue the U21 football inter-county championship.

4. Conclude the All-Ireland U21 hurling inter-county championship before the senior final.

5. Increase the number of national league weekends, doubling up football and hurling fixtures.

6. Discontinue the NFL Division 1 semi-finals.

7. Establish in rule that players, who are not in the match-day panel of 26 must be available to their clubs on the weekends of intercounty games.

8. Bring forward the senior All-Irelands by two weeks with the hurling final on the second Sunday of August and the football final played on the first Sunday in September.

9. Play extra time at the end of all drawn championship matches.

10. Discontinue the All-Ireland inter-county junior football and intermediate hurling championships.

11. Introduce a calendar-year fixtures schedule.

Kerrydude1981

Where will players get game time after they leave minors if the u21 championship and the Junior/Intermediate championships are packed in

I know they will have college games but I don't know if its a good idea to get rid of these competitions.

Some lads might not be ready to make the step to Senior Inter County,the Kerry Junior team this year was a u23 team with a good few of last years minors playing on it,its now hoped some of these lads will see some league action with the seniors in 2016

Fr Tod Umptious

Kerrydude1981 wrote: »

Where will players get game time after they leave minors if the u21 championship and the Junior/Intermediate championships are packed in

I know they will have college games but I don't know if its a good idea to get rid of these competitions.

Some lads might not be ready to make the step to Senior Inter County,the Kerry Junior team this year was a u23 team with a good few of last years minors playing on it,its now hoped some of these lads will see some league action with the seniors in 2016

That's what I thought too.
There is a huge gap between u-17 and senior.

On the other proposals the removal of the NFL SF and automatic extra time are good ideas.

I believe there was automatic extra time in games up to provincial SF (possibly final) a few years back that has since been ditched.

dr.kenneth noisewater

I think 4-9 and 11 are fairly acceptable proposals alright but there could be a big fall off in numbers if minor is reduced and U-21 scrapped

Hammer Archer

I think a better idea would be to scrap U21 and make an U19 championship in place of a minor championship. As mentioned, no intercounty between U17 and senior may see a large number of potentially great players not make it to senior intercounty level due to reliance on club training only.
I think extra time in every championship game is a good idea.
While I'm not fond of the Junior championship, I think it's a decent grade to have for younger players to get a bit of adult intercounty experience. Also, it's where Kilkenny footballers ply their trade so they'll be completely without a football team if the Junior grade was to be scrapped.

zetecescort

agree with what has been said about scrapping u-21 and the rest just to add I'd be against doubling up league weekends unless one code was Saturday and the other Sunday. the dual player is extinct and now if both codes are on the same day fans of both will be put out.

munchkin_utd

missing from above is that an u19 is proposed above the u17.
Above that, theres 3rd level games to beat the ban for lads 19 and 20 and 21 years old, and at that stage they are also tipping towards playing senior for the club, at least for the reserves

I know that with us in Cavan (when I was of the age), the U21 club championship was a complete afterthought and really could be abolished and nobody in my club would have noticed.

Gael85

To me player burnout is a myth. This only applies to about 2% of GAA players. This usually a player who plays intercounty at senior,u21 and then third level football.The real problem GAA need to tackle is on intercounty managers dictating club championship schedules.Portlaoise forced play Leinster championship day after winning county championship.i saw weekend in Clare a team had play 2 games in a day.Ordinary club footballers sometimes have wait 12 weeks to play.Then GAA introduced rule where u17 players cant play adult football.This effect rural clubs in big way.

Hesh's Umpire

Gael85 wrote: »

To me player burnout is a myth. This only applies to about 2% of GAA players. This usually a player who plays intercounty at senior,u21 and then third level football.The real problem GAA need to tackle is on intercounty managers dictating club championship schedules.Portlaoise forced play Leinster championship day after winning county championship.i saw weekend in Clare a team had play 2 games in a day.Ordinary club footballers sometimes have wait 12 weeks to play.Then GAA introduced rule where u17 players cant play adult football.This effect rural clubs in big way.

Spot on.
There's a very small percentage of players who are victims of this burnout thing. and, yes, something needs to be done about that.
But the other 98% (or whatever) are far more important and need to be getting a regular, structured programme of games (and plenty of them). As it stands, this doesn't happen enough.

dr.kenneth noisewater

I think limiting the amount of teams you can play for would help, you can play senior and U-21 or senior and 3rd level but not both. If your on a college scholarship then you should concentrate on that team and play senior after sigerson is done. It would give other players a chance and prevent the minority from playing too many games

Gael85

dr.kenneth noisewater wrote: »

I think limiting the amount of teams you can play for would help, you can play senior and U-21 or senior and 3rd level but not both. If your on a college scholarship then you should concentrate on that team and play senior after sigerson is done. It would give other players a chance and prevent the minority from playing too many games

Players playing u21,Sigerson/Fitzgibbon should be banned playing league until teams knocked out of 21,college competitions

dr.kenneth noisewater

Gael85 wrote: »

Players playing u21,Sigerson/Fitzgibbon should be banned playing league until teams knocked out of 21,college competitions

Think the colleges should be cracking down on this really. If you get a sports scholarship from a 3rd level college where they course fees and sometimes accommodation then that should be your main/sole focus until the competition is finished

Prop Joe

Hesh's Umpire wrote: »

Spot on.
There's a very small percentage of players who are victims of this burnout thing. and, yes, something needs to be done about that.
But the other 98% (or whatever) are far more important and need to be getting a regular, structured programme of games (and plenty of them). As it stands, this doesn't happen enough.

I agree we are talking about a tiny % of players and where dual players come into the fore it really gets messy.

A simple rule change for me would be no minor allowed play 1st team adult football

Also at inter county level,No player U-21 allowed play senior until side out of U21 championship.

I would also abolish U21 football at club level

Dirty Dingus McGee

Burnout is only an issue for a tiny percentage of the GAA playing population but as usual in the GAA we have changes being proposed which will only help a small number of players being inflicted upon a large amount of players.

There is already a big fall off in participation from minor onwards and this will only increase the fall off, instead of someone giving up football when they are 18 with this new proposal it will now happen when they are 17.

The best way to prevent burnout is for players to use a little thing called free will and choose which teams they are going to play for and matches they are going to play in.

The problem in the GAA isn't too many matches it's too few matches and there have been zero attempts to address the training to matches ratio which is far too great in the GAA.

According to the Irish Independent Duffy is only suggesting getting rid of the All Ireland U-21 football championship but the hurling equivalent will be kept?Why is the football championship deemed less important.

Dirty Dingus McGee

munchkin_utd wrote: »

missing from above is that an u19 is proposed above the u17.
Above that, theres 3rd level games to beat the ban for lads 19 and 20 and 21 years old, and at that stage they are also tipping towards playing senior for the club, at least for the reserves

I know that with us in Cavan (when I was of the age), the U21 club championship was a complete afterthought and really could be abolished and nobody in my club would have noticed.

Not everyone is good enough to play at third level and not everyone has an interest in playing football in college.

Mehapoy

dr.kenneth noisewater wrote: »

I think limiting the amount of teams you can play for would help, you can play senior and U-21 or senior and 3rd level but not both. If your on a college scholarship then you should concentrate on that team and play senior after sigerson is done. It would give other players a chance and prevent the minority from playing too many games

Spot on and would make a much bigger difference to players rather than using a mallet to split an egg which is what the gaa are proposing to do in abolishing u21....

theoneeyedman

The most obvious solution to fixtures clashes to me is to squeeze the intercounty Championship into a shorter time frame. For example, the Connacht Championship nominally has 7 teams, realistically it has 4 competitive teams at any time. This should be played off in maximum 6 weeks: quarter finals week 1, Semi-final week 3, final week 5. Instead, it starts on the first Sunday in May, and won't finish until mid/late July. There are simular delays in other championships. Play them off to fcuk.
Likewise, have a full programme of games every weekend. You'll often see a Sunday with maybe 2 football games on, say one in munster and 1 in Leinster. There is no reason not to have big games on at the same time.
In this way, the championship should be ran off in say 3 months, instead of 5 full months as at present. Of course, there may be nice TV revenue at risk, but if we're serious we have to tackle the status quo

Shurimgreat

I think one of the reasons for the fall off after minor is the gap to U21. It can be hard for an average minor to get a place on an U21 team the first year. Players used to playing regularly sometimes end up sitting on the bench their first year U21.

How about an U20 grade instead? This would lesson the risk of burnout for 21 year olds who are more likely to be playing senior.

I don't see why they should do away with minor/U18. Its a really nice grade. Its often the last chance lads/ladies have to play together before heading off to college etc. Doing away with it would lead to an even bigger gap to senior and fall off.

I think everyone agrees that talented players aged 17-21 are most at risk of burnout given the various teams they are eligible to play with.

No player of that age should be training more than 3 nights a week.

Prop Joe

I'm wondering what the solution is for the U21 competition,I can only think of

Abolish it

Run off Sigerson in October/November & U21 champ in Feb/March

Move to U-20 with no U-20's allowed play Inter county football

Run it alongside the league with no U21's allowed play senior until rd.5

Keep as normal

Play it down to semi final stage at Easter mid term -32 county straight knock out - Semi's and Final's on consecutive weeks after - Sigerson moved to November