Stephanie McMahon

Chain Smoker

Does she bring anything positive to the table? In what ways do you think she seems to have progressed over her time having an major role in the company? How much control do you expect her to have following Vince's death?



I think she's absolutely awful.

As a performer she can be great at drawing heel heat but she never seems to give a payoff to anyone. She routinely seems to flip flop all over the place between being face and heel, and is absolutely fixated on emasculating everyone around her for whatever reason.
She's all the worst parts of Vince with precious few of the best and has done absolutely nothing to earn it.

As a corporate figure she does really stupid stuff like put herself at the forefront of every charitable action they do. It's as though it's about promoting her as much as it is about the brand, for me it always comes across as remarkably blatant "yes, look how great we are" type stuff that's quite a huge faux-pas when it comes to that kind of thing. This one Wade Keller always brings up really gets to me too.

I find it very hard to imagine that shareholders will tolerate her being clueless for any kind of length at all after Vince passes. Vince's success and longevity are enough to make the idea of replacing him incredibly intimidating regardless of anything he does, she's got far less to stand on.

Insect Overlord

Chain Smoker wrote: »

How much control do you expect her to have following Vince's death?

Following Vince's death I find it very hard to imagine that shareholders will tolerate her being clueless for any kind of length at all.

You might want to work on your phrasing, Chain Smoker! You make it sound like Vince is already dead! :eek:

LeeJM

Also Stephanie is a lot of things but clueless isnt one of them.

Chain Smoker

LeeJM wrote: »

Also Stephanie is a lot of things but clueless isnt one of them.

What has she done to prove that other than the most transparent of security measures such as placing people in positions to take the fall when stuff goes wrong (e.g. the television contract negotiations)?

If you're saying that she knows what she's doing when she puts down wrestlers and whatnot, unless it's leading to increased revenue then it's utterly meaningless. When Kevin Nash done stuff like that, it made sense; when the owner of the company does, it's just bonkers.
Endlessly shoehorning yourself into positions where you get to claim credit for stuff doesn't do anything either, especially when it's, as far as I can see, quite ineffective.

jaykhunter

From everything I've read and seen, Stephanie is a talentless corporate prat. Everything that comes out of her mouth is embarrassing, soulless branding execu-speak. But it seems prudent to note she left creative about 2 years ago, the show in general hasnt gotten better and ratings are still sliding downwards. She's a major component of why I can't sit through raw anymore.

On a side note, I'm glad she's taken unjust credit for the Divas Revolution on RAW, as it's fallen on it's face.

Rjd2

Chain Smoker wrote: »

As a performer she can be great at drawing heel heat but she never seems to give a payoff to anyone. She routinely seems to flip flop all over the place between being face and heel, and is absolutely fixated on emasculating everyone around her for whatever reason.

Do you remember this? Basically a raw after a PPV where Aj beat Kaitlyn and was gloating and Steph came out and made both of them look crap.

The Kaitlyn burial was just stupid, she was just after coming from another loss, so that was the last thing she needed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBaQg4EzCpk

Reebrock

She compared 9/11 to her Dads steroid trial.

DM_7

I fast forward when I see her. As pointless as Big Show.

ERG89

DM_7 wrote: »

I fast forward when I see her. As pointless as Big Show.

One of few talents in wrestling who drags someone down around her near the level of a Big Show.
Totally emasculates people no better than Rollins who she treats like her disobedient son

ricero

It's a pity Shane o mac left and not Stephanie

Lord TSC

I feel that basically she's Vince, in terms of she's a boss character who runs down employees and ****s all over them....but the thing with Vince is, cause he was a man, it was possible for the employees to get one over on him.

She can run down Bryan but we're never going to see him apply his finisher and make her tap. She can run down Show but he'll never knock her out. And because we know there's no chance of a male superstar every "winning" a "feud" in that manner, it makes the guys who she abuses seem powerless and impotent.

EDIT: Quick note, thats not an arguement for why men should be allowed hit women btw. Its an arguement for why she shouldn't be involved with those characters at all, let alone verbally beating them down.

Bounty Hunter

Is there no way back for Shane?

and I mean outside of the rumored appearances to promote a DVD next year? Maybe it's just me but he came across as the smarter / better of he and Steph by a long way but also the one that I guess wasn't willing to wait his turn to take over Daddy's business and instead went out and made a success of himself elsewhere. It didn't have to be WWE for him, meanwhile I'm not sure if Steph could have been as big a success anywhere else in the corporate world.

briany

Y'know, on the subject of Steph emasculating male wrestlers - I agree, but it shouldn't be a total negative. She shouldn't really involve herself too much with the males, but what a perfect storyline it would be for the 'divas' division to take their anger out on her. If used right, the Authority would make a great two-headed monster, with HHH dealing with the men, and Stephanie with the women. The problem is that WWE is trying to walk the PC line too much. Stephanie should really be pushing the whole "'Divas' are secondary" angle. That it's best for business. That they should really appreciate any spot on the card they have. I think this would really inject some life into the women's scene in WWE. I can picture Paige coming out to interrupt a Steph segment to get in Steph's face about the treatment of her and the other girls on the card, and she presses Stephanie about so much, that she just loses it and goes off on a whole rant about the truth about the girls and why they'll never be as high on the card as the boys.

Caovyn Lineah

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

Is there no way back for Shane?

and I mean outside of the rumored appearances to promote a DVD next year? Maybe it's just me but he came across as the smarter / better of he and Steph by a long way but also the one that I guess wasn't willing to wait his turn to take over Daddy's business and instead went out and made a success of himself elsewhere. It didn't have to be WWE for him, meanwhile I'm not sure if Steph could have been as big a success anywhere else in the corporate world.

He has no interest in the business and has no need to come back.

Chain Smoker

briany wrote: »

Stephanie should really be pushing the whole "'Divas' are secondary" angle.

Except she's decided that to position herself as the empowering feminist responsible for all the progressive steps the divas division is making. This is in spite of her primarily playing a heel.

I think Stephanie's long term goal is to try and get that Senate seat that her mam failed at getting. It's the only reason I can think of for why her primary focus is ALWAYS on the Stephanie McMahon brand rather than the WWE brand.
Unfortunately for her, she's an idiot so she just does it all in a horrifically heavy handed manner, unable to keep it off the core content of their shows in a way that directly contradicts her on screen persona.

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

Is there no way back for Shane?

and I mean outside of the rumored appearances to promote a DVD next year? Maybe it's just me but he came across as the smarter / better of he and Steph by a long way but also the one that I guess wasn't willing to wait his turn to take over Daddy's business and instead went out and made a success of himself elsewhere. It didn't have to be WWE for him, meanwhile I'm not sure if Steph could have been as big a success anywhere else in the corporate world.

Shane's interesting. Supposedly he was really likeable the scenes in WWE way back when but all of his ideas were pretty terrible, like, the general opinion I've heard of him from writers and such was that he was way worse than Stephanie. He wasn't ever willing to dedicate his whole life to it in the same manner as Stephanie was either.
From what I can see, he's mostly carving out a position for himself these days as a guy who knows people. Can imagine him being the kind of person who's able to court investors really effectively and the like... he actually could potentially be a much more effective political candidate than Stephanie.




The point of this thread was that I think the HHH and Stephanie combo at the top of the company has no chance in hell of lasting once Vince is gone. She's in an extremely protected position right now and it's hard to see how she'll be able to convince investors she's at all competent once she's forced out of it. When people talk about them as being the long term future of company, what's their basis that shareholders will be any more tolerant than they would be with any other company?

Pentecost

Is Vince the majority shareholder? He'll probably leave his shares to Stephanie. Though he could he around for years yet so who knows?

Bounty Hunter

Would not be surprised if Vince lives on till a fairly old age though. I mean if he was to leave now it could all fall apart for them but if he lasts into his mid 80s, thats another 15ish years and maybe HHH could actually be developed into Vince's successor by then. Very hard to know exactly how good Hunter is with everything business wise, I mean he obviously knows wrestling and is doing well with NXT but Vinces job is a whole other beast and one I don't personally think Vince's daughter is up to.

Interesting bit about Shane and politics, I could imagine that as he is naturally likable and a good businessman it would seem based off his work in China etc. That said as far as I recall a lot of the thing about him being liked backstage was that despite being the bosses son he was willing to put his body on the line and really mix it up when he got involved in matches. In saying that I get the impression he was prob likable anyway an impression you don't get from Steph.

briany

Chain Smoker wrote: »

Except she's decided that to position herself as the empowering feminist responsible for all the progressive steps the divas division is making. This is in spite of her primarily playing a heel.

That's what I was talking about in the PC line that WWE follows, but does it have to be this way? Stone Cold probably wouldn't have reached the heights he did without having McMahon to play off of, and great wrestling stories tend to require both a great face and great heel. Right now, the real narrative of the WWE's Diva division is that they're an aside, rather than the WWE's narrative which is 3 teams of slightly b*tchy women engaged in a never-ending war while empowerment is proclaimed. Just because Stephanie is pushing that she's a feminist in real-life, doesn't mean that she can't play the role of an oppressor of the girls on TV. Everyone with a brain could differentiate between Vince and the Mr. McMahon character, so it shouldn't be a problem with Stephanie. It would be better to face the issues of the Divas division head-on rather than skirting around them with some half-arsed revolution spiel, and would elevate everyone involved.

Chain Smoker

From the statistics in this article and on yahoo finance, between Vince, Shane and Stephanie, they own just over two thirds of the company. I imagine Linda might have some in her name to bring it up to near three quarters.

briany wrote: »

That's what I was talking about in the PC line that WWE follows
...
Everyone with a brain could differentiate between Vince and the Mr. McMahon character

What has what she's doing with the #DivaRevolution to do with being PC though? It's just her having an inherent need to take credit for it by using the most public space she can to stake her claim, deciding that that warrants pretty much breaking kayfabe live on air.
EDIT: Actually, yeah, I get what you're saying. I think it's a lot more about her wanting to receive credit for everything though.

I do wonder whether Stephanie thinks people need to be reminded repeatedly that she's playing a character...

drugstore cowboy

Cracking legs in fairness

JohnMc1

briany wrote: »

Y'know, on the subject of Steph emasculating male wrestlers - I agree, but it shouldn't be a total negative. She shouldn't really involve herself too much with the males, but what a perfect storyline it would be for the 'divas' division to take their anger out on her. If used right, the Authority would make a great two-headed monster, with HHH dealing with the men, and Stephanie with the women. The problem is that WWE is trying to walk the PC line too much. Stephanie should really be pushing the whole "'Divas' are secondary" angle. That it's best for business. That they should really appreciate any spot on the card they have. I think this would really inject some life into the women's scene in WWE. I can picture Paige coming out to interrupt a Steph segment to get in Steph's face about the treatment of her and the other girls on the card, and she presses Stephanie about so much, that she just loses it and goes off on a whole rant about the truth about the girls and why they'll never be as high on the card as the boys.

For that to work Stephanie would have to be willing to lay down for people. Hunter regardless of what the IWC thinks of him puts people over. Stephanie won't. Vince and Shane may have overstayed their welcome on TV [though in fairness Shane knew when it was time to go]but they made it worthwhile because 1)They bumped their asses off [and God Bless Vince for being able to do that in his 60s] and 2) laid down for whoever they feuded with so both the wrestlers and the fans got the payoff.

There's no payoff to feuding with Stephanie. Feuding with her is like feuding with Cena. You're buried after its over.

JohnMc1

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

Would not be surprised if Vince lives on till a fairly old age though. I mean if he was to leave now it could all fall apart for them but if he lasts into his mid 80s, thats another 15ish years and maybe HHH could actually be developed into Vince's successor by then. Very hard to know exactly how good Hunter is with everything business wise, I mean he obviously knows wrestling and is doing well with NXT but Vinces job is a whole other beast and one I don't personally think Vince's daughter is up to.

Interesting bit about Shane and politics, I could imagine that as he is naturally likable and a good businessman it would seem based off his work in China etc. That said as far as I recall a lot of the thing about him being liked backstage was that despite being the bosses son he was willing to put his body on the line and really mix it up when he got involved in matches. In saying that I get the impression he was prob likable anyway an impression you don't get from Steph.

If you want a glimpse of Hunter running a company look at NXT. That's his baby. Though that doesn't stop Stephanie from trying to take credit for it as well.

Bounty Hunter

JohnMc1 wrote: »

For that to work Stephanie would have to be willing to lay down for people. Hunter regardless of what the IWC thinks of him puts people over. Stephanie won't. Vince and Shane may have overstayed their welcome on TV [though in fairness Shane knew when it was time to go]but they made it worthwhile because 1)They bumped their asses off [and God Bless Vince for being able to do that in his 60s] and 2) laid down for whoever they feuded with so both the wrestlers and the fans got the payoff.

There's no payoff to feuding with Stephanie. Feuding with her is like feuding with Cena. You're buried after its over.

in terms of going over fully agree and before I say the next thing she should put people over and give them that payoff but an angle with her is probably the most screen time and most pushed angle a Diva is likely to get. Brie for example won't be in another angle that big again (thank fup!).

Really annoyed me at the time that they never had an AJ vs Steph feud / match.

JohnMc1 wrote: »

If you want a glimpse of Hunter running a company look at NXT. That's his baby. Though that doesn't stop Stephanie from trying to take credit for it as well.

I did actually highlight that in the post you quoted but yeah hopefully Vince doesent go anywhere soon and NXT Hunter can have time to develop into a fully capable WWE Hunter backstage as I dunno if his wife could do daddys job

briany

JohnMc1 wrote: »

For that to work Stephanie would have to be willing to lay down for people. Hunter regardless of what the IWC thinks of him puts people over. Stephanie won't. Vince and Shane may have overstayed their welcome on TV [though in fairness Shane knew when it was time to go]but they made it worthwhile because 1)They bumped their asses off [and God Bless Vince for being able to do that in his 60s] and 2) laid down for whoever they feuded with so both the wrestlers and the fans got the payoff.

There's no payoff to feuding with Stephanie. Feuding with her is like feuding with Cena. You're buried after its over.

Stephanie did do a spot for Vicki Guerrero's farewell by letting Vicki push her into a big pool of mud/gunge. It wasn't exactly a feud or anything, but it did show she wasn't totally closed to the idea of putting someone over herself, and it made the fans happy. Maybe she just needs to be reminded that it's a good way to do business. I have the feeling that, in WWE, there aren't too many people telling Steph what she doesn't want to hear.

Didnt she get legit pissed off when Dusty cut her off during a promo even though she was the heel so stuff like that should happen?

Takes herself and her "character" way too seriously in my eyes.

Blue_Dabadee

Was it her idea to have guest hosts on RAW each week? When people speak about how bad Raw has gotten recently, that was a far worse time.

briany

mxph3 wrote: »

Was it her idea to have guest hosts on RAW each week? When people speak about how bad Raw has gotten recently, that was a far worse time.

Disagree. I'd take a different guest host each week over the samey monotony that RAW so often is these days.

Itssoeasy

Pentecost wrote: »

Is Vince the majority shareholder? He'll probably leave his shares to Stephanie. Though he could he around for years yet so who knows?

As far as I know the McMahon family are the majority shareholder of the company.

JohnMc1

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

in terms of going over fully agree and before I say the next thing she should put people over and give them that payoff but an angle with her is probably the most screen time and most pushed angle a Diva is likely to get. Brie for example won't be in another angle that big again (thank fup!).

Like I said previously it like feuding with Super Cena. You get TV time but end up buried beyond belief that it ends up not worth being in a feud with them.

I did actually highlight that in the post you quoted but yeah hopefully Vince doesent go anywhere soon and NXT Hunter can have time to develop into a fully capable WWE Hunter backstage as I dunno if his wife could do daddys job

Best case scenario for fans is that Vince convinces Shane to come back and he and Hunter run it and Steph fecks off to be an at home Mom. Shane clearly loved the business while Stephanie clearly hates it.

ricero

briany wrote: »

Disagree. I'd take a different guest host each week over the samey monotony that RAW so often is these days.

No the guest host nonsense had me nearly giving up on the wwe for good. A horrible time to be a wwe fan although at the moment its fairly ****e but not as bad as nobody actors like Jon heder hosting :eek:

A Primal Nut

Itssoeasy wrote: »

As far as I know the McMahon family are the majority shareholder of the company.

Vince alone has about 52%, so he is the majority shareholder even not including the others.

Stephanie and Triple H's shareholding is actually very small compared with the likes of Kevin Dunn and George Barrios:

https://finance.yahoo.com/q/mh?s=WWE+Major+Holders

But given that she will probably inherit Vince's shareholding it doesn't really matter in the long run. Unless Shane comes back.

A Primal Nut

Stephanie as a character reminds me of Vince except without the payoffs. She can be entertaining at times but it's detrimental to people feuding with her.

briany

ricero wrote: »

No the guest host nonsense had me nearly giving up on the wwe for good. A horrible time to be a wwe fan although at the moment its fairly ****e but not as bad as nobody actors like Jon heder hosting :eek:

It's not as good as the time William Shatner hosted, either. The hosts could be up and down, but at least it guaranteed something different each week. Now, that is not a guarantee.

JohnMc1

A Primal Nut wrote: »

Stephanie as a character reminds me of Vince except without the payoffs. She can be entertaining at times but it's detrimental to people feuding with her.

That's why I compared her to Cena. Feuding with them kills your career.

ricero

briany wrote: »

It's not as good as the time William Shatner hosted, either. The hosts could be up and down, but at least it guaranteed something different each week. Now, that is not a guarantee.

The muppets was very good but the amount of nobody sport stars us over this side of the Atlantic didn't know that hosted was ridicolous

Lord TSC

RE: NXT and HHH.

My worry is that NXT is marketed as a niche show at a very specific and very small audience. While there might be some elements that can be translated over to WWE's main shows, its not a perfect indication of how HHH will run things up the food chain, since his audience will be different, and Raw needs the biggest audience possible. It can't just focus on a niche audience like NXT can.

ShagNastii

Can't remember what was reported at the time but I'd be fairly sure the guest star were Vince's idea. We all know of his immense love for celeb crossovers.

I think the whole "authority" thing is well well well passed it's sell by date. Think that's the reason why people have become seriously tired with Stephanie.


As for company real life-wise I wouldn't be too sure Stephanie will be going away anytime soon. Ya can't underestimate just how far Hunter's feet are under the table. He is now WWE and it's future IMHO (not totally a bad thing). I think if Hunter is the man Stephanie will never be too far behind him.

Bounty Hunter

Lord TSC wrote: »

RE: NXT and HHH.

My worry is that NXT is marketed as a niche show at a very specific and very small audience. While there might be some elements that can be translated over to WWE's main shows, its not a perfect indication of how HHH will run things up the food chain, since his audience will be different, and Raw needs the biggest audience possible. It can't just focus on a niche audience like NXT can.

HHH actually makes this point a lot iirc it's part of why I said that Vinces job is a whole other beast imo and one that hopefully HHH will still have a lot of time to learn from the master at how to do it. That said HHH is a hard one to judge in terms of his business expertise and at least NXT can be seen as a positive even if it isn't the same thing and it's also a positive that he can identify that NXT is in fact a niche show and that certain things will work or not work there.

A Primal Nut

Lord TSC wrote: »

RE: NXT and HHH.

My worry is that NXT is marketed as a niche show at a very specific and very small audience. While there might be some elements that can be translated over to WWE's main shows, its not a perfect indication of how HHH will run things up the food chain, since his audience will be different, and Raw needs the biggest audience possible. It can't just focus on a niche audience like NXT can.

That's a point Triple H made in the Stone Cold podcast and he always says it in the NXT conference calls when he gets asked about the direction of the women on the main roster compared with how they are portrayed on NXT. Although I have a feeling it might be his way around saying he doesn't agree with Vince's direction but of course he can't say that publicly.

Given that he is the man responsible for NXT I can't imagine he agrees with many decisions made on the main roster for the women.

Either way I'm sure the NXT direction which would be more popular with the mainstream (as regards women, but even with the men many of them felt more like stars in NXT than on RAW, e.g. Neville.

briany

ricero wrote: »

The muppets was very good but the amount of nobody sport stars us over this side of the Atlantic didn't know that hosted was ridicolous

I suppose, but then RAW's main demographic would be the North American audience, given that it's in a prime-time slot over there. Admittedly it would be a kick to see someone we all know like Joe Duffy guest hosting raw. The wrestlers could solve their disputes by calling 1850.

jaykhunter

Briany, is your username pronounced "Brian with a y"?

Blue_Dabadee

The problem I had with guest host concept is that they were the main focal point of RAW each week rather than just have them do one appearance on the show and leave with their paycheck.

briany

jaykhunter wrote: »

Briany, is your username pronounced "Brian with a y"?

Yes. I sort of regret choosing it now, but I'm coming up on 7 years in.

gnfnrhead

Without Vince being willing to humiliate himself and get beat up on a regular basis, Austin would never have been as big as he was. Rock would have suffered too but not as badly. In the entire length of the Authority storyline, Stephanie has only twice even come close to what Vince did almost weekly, as far as I know. Vickie Guerrero on her last day, and Ronda Rowsey on a special guest appearance. Neither of them benefited the actual roster at all so Stephanie came away looking good as new a few days later.

Vince took finishers on a regular basis and it helped whoever was delivering them get over. Why can't Stephanie do the same from Divas? She's had matches before so no reason she shouldn't be able to take some of them. If she isn't willing to do that, at least let the guys win verbally every now and then instead of standing their like a bold child getting given out to every time she opens her mouth.

CastorTroy

Remember the abuse Jericho used to give Steph. And I think the Rock did it as well. Think was Jericho did the before and after pic and ripping her top off. But apart from Rousey I can't think of a recent example.