Should we drop foreign aid to Africa? [VIDEO]

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I only ask because Al Jazeera recently uploaded this clip of Medhi Hazan, the British-Indian broadcaster, discussing “popular misconceptions about the African continent”.

At one point he scoffs at the notion of foreign aid, particularly when compared to the money sent home by Africans around the world.

But all this growth comes from foreign aid, right? That's where most of the money comes from, surely? From Western handouts.

Nope. Not true. In fact, foreign aid represents only 2 percent of Africa's total GDP. In 2010, Africans living outside of Africa sent more cash back to their families at home ($52 billion) than the rest of the entire world provided to the continent in foreign aid ($43 billion).

It's about a minute into the video.

I'm just wondering, if foreign aid is of so little use to Africa, should we just drop it?

justchecked

racist.




ok, now you can go ahead.

Cookie_Monster

but without foreign aid how will they afford tanks, warplanes and helicopters?

DEFTLEFTHAND

It should be definitely suspended when we take in our share of genuine Syrian refugees and illegal immigrants. Anyone who doesn't declare asylum in the first safe country from the conflict becomes an illegal alien of course.

Massimo Cassagrande

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

It should be definitely suspended when we take in our share of genuine Syrian refugees and illegal immigrants. Anyone who doesn't declare asylum in the first safe country from the conflict becomes an illegal alien of course.

You're conflating two separate issues, Refugee Policy and Foreign Aid policy. A definition of madness is doing the same thing, over and over, and expecting a different outcome - Africa has been considered a "charity case" for decades, Bob Geldof, Bill Gates, Millions of individuals, dozens of Governments and hundreds of NGOs have poured in cash, resources and assistance..and still the problems there persist.

So it might be time to try a different tack - expect Africa as a continent to Mature beyond being "a charity case" in the Worlds eyes and start acting in its own best interests. On its own. Buy food and medicines instead of Kalashnikovs, and start selling its own products and resources for its own benefit - and use that money to assist people, as opposed to building palaces and buying Bentleys.

Africa isn't poor, it's just that the people who control the money there are corrupt. Maybe it's time the world demanded that they change, instead of just feeding the corruption.

Boring username

Should we stop borrowing €700 million annually to prop up third world regimes and champagne charlies? Absolutely, without a shadow of a doubt.

• All foreign aid should be redirected internally and used for the genuine (and I stress genuine) refugees that are here, as well as the hundreds of homeless people that are freezing on our streets.
  
• A portion of that money should also be spent restructuring the asylum process-everyone should have a final decision within 6 months. This idea of spending years waiting for a slow, mechanical bureaucracy to grind out a decision is obviously unsatisfactory.
  
• We should also use that money to ensure there are swift and efficient deportations for the roughly 85% of those claiming asylum who are simply welfare tourists, scam artists, and economic migrants.
  

It is interesting to note that Britain has recently decided to cancel its foreign aid to India, especially since India now has a nuclear programme, nuclear weapons programme, and a space programme. People are finally starting to see foreign aid for what is is-a massive con job aimed at gullible Westerners suffering from white guilt.

Guy:Incognito

£43b is more than $52b

The Corinthian

Karson Clever Fish wrote: »

I'm just wondering, if foreign aid is of so little use to Africa, should we just drop it?

And leave all the construction, engineering, arms, mining and telecoms contracts to the Chinese? No way. Cost of doing business.

Boring username

The Corinthian wrote: »

And leave all the construction, engineering, arms, mining and telecoms contracts to the Chinese? No way. Cost of doing business.

I doubt Irish companies are getting that much business in Africa. Anyway, bribing local warlords and tin pot dictators is only contributing to the numerous wars and feuds.

The Corinthian

Boring username wrote: »

Anyway, bribing local warlords and tin pot dictators is only contributing to the numerous wars and feuds.

Who said my response was bothered about any benefit to Africa?

diomed

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

£43b is more than $52b

Feck sake. This is a serious, fact free debate. :rolleyes:

Boring username

The Corinthian wrote: »

Who said my response was bothered about any benefit to Africa?

Sorry I'm not sure what you mean by this.

The Corinthian

Boring username wrote: »

Sorry I'm not sure what you mean by this.

You suggested that "bribing local warlords and tin pot dictators" only contributed to a negative effect for Africa. This, if true, would likely be irrelevant to my original argument.

As for your belief that Irish companies are not getting that much business in Africa - what do you base this on? Or that I was talking about Irish companies, rather than European or Western countries in general?

Little CuChulainn

We shouldn't be paying governments anything. We should fund charitable endeavours in the countries instead.

The Corinthian

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

We shouldn't be paying governments anything. We should fund charitable endeavours in the countries instead.

Yippy! More 'admin' fees paying charity CEO salaries!

Boring username

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

We shouldn't be paying governments anything. We should fund charitable endeavours in the countries instead.

We shouldn't fund anything from the public purse, if that is what you meant. If people want to throw money at Africa, they can do it via the thousands of charity/businesses that will take their money. (And spend 90% of the income paying themselves a lavish salary)....

Galwayguy35

Short answer is yes, the money should be spent on our own people.

Time for Africa and those other countries to stop relying on foreign aid which in many cases never gets to the the people it was intended for anyway.

gormdubhgorm

Does Bono live there now?

mikeym

We need money put aside for the Sryians coming here very soon.

Ive never been to Africa so I cant comment.

But I dont trust the Big Name Charities.

90K a year for a CEO of a charity your having a laugh.

steddyeddy

The Corinthian wrote: »

And leave all the construction, engineering, arms, mining and telecoms contracts to the Chinese? No way. Cost of doing business.

Unfortunately in East Africa they're already doing it. I foresee the next African Rwanda to be the extermination of Chinese government officials from places like Tanzania and the Congo. Not a moment too soon IMHO.

Clandestine

No, they should encourage freer markets. One of the main reasons countries like Zimbabwe are poor because there's little economic freedom.

steddyeddy

I spent a lot of time over in East Africa working with volunteer projects. Little Cuchulain is spot on. Find a project you like and donate to that. Find someone over there who runs a school, orphanage or prison and ask them what they need. They will be honest (more honest than some charity organisations anyway). So find someone local who you can trust and fund them.

323

Massimo Cassagrande wrote: »

So it might be time to try a different tack - expect Africa as a continent to Mature beyond being "a charity case" in the Worlds eyes and start acting in its own best interests.

But they do act in their own interests! In my experience they are very very good at acting in their own interest, at least individually.

No. think it is absolutely ridiculous they Ireland is borrowing 6/7 hundred million a year to throw at countries that for the most part are far from poor. Ireland's ridiculous craving to be liked, and bee seen to be "doing the right thing" no matter what the cost to its own citizens.

steddyeddy wrote: »

Unfortunately in East Africa they're already doing it. I foresee the next African Rwanda to be the extermination of Chinese government officials from places like Tanzania and the Congo. Not a moment too soon IMHO.

Not just East Africa, not seen much of there so can't comment. However, West Africa I'm very familiar with, Chinese are everywhere, from Angola to Côte d'Ivoire. More noticeable in the last 3 -5 years, arriving in plane loads, many one one way tickets I've been told by locals.

steddyeddy

Well Tanzania and what I could see of the Congo without getting killed is full of Chinese government officials and industry reps. They're cleaning out the resources of one of the most impoverished continents on earth. They refer to the locals as racist names and don't hire locals. They just take. I met people in Tanzania who said they were planning to strike back and I make no apology for saying I hope they hit them hard enough that they don't come back.

lazybones32

Karson Clever Fish wrote: »

I'm just wondering, if foreign aid is of so little use to Africa, should we just drop it?

The Govt. should be far more selective and discriminating about where the money goes - but it's easy to be generous when it's someone else's money. Also, I think the money is given just for the sake of adhering to some 'Foreign Aid' quota established by some suits over in Brussels.

I don't know if the money is given to Irish charities working in certain Countries or given to the Countries themselves but wasn't the National debt of many Nations cancelled a few years ago? Why give more money to those who misappropriate it?

Letree

mikeym wrote: »

90K a year for a CEO of a charity your having a laugh.

And that would be considered a poorly paid one..

The Corinthian

Letree wrote: »

And that would be considered a poorly paid one..

Indeed:

• Rehab Group - €234,000
• Enable Ireland - €145,679
• Cancer Society - €145,000
• Concern - €99,000
• Cope Foundation - €121,600
• Amnesty International - €110,099
• GOAL - €95,000

Source

Of course, I can understand this to a great degree - you want the best you need to pay for them, and I cannot express enough how important it is to have someone really good at the helm of your organization. At the end of the day, charities operate in a pretty cut-throat market, just like any business.

On the other hand, their propensity to profit from volunteer work of others, or often employing people on fairly low wages, constantly playing the poor mouth and then while paying C-level salaries like a business, want to be exempt from VAT and other inconvenient business costs, does turn the stomach a fair bit.

murpho999

The Corinthian wrote: »

Indeed:

• Rehab Group - €234,000
• Enable Ireland - €145,679
• Cancer Society - €145,000
• Concern - €99,000
• Cope Foundation - €121,600
• Amnesty International - €110,099
• GOAL - €95,000

Source

Of course, I can understand this to a great degree - you want the best you need to pay for them, and I cannot express enough how important it is to have someone really good at the helm of your organization. At the end of the day, charities operate in a pretty cut-throat market, just like any business.

On the other hand, their propensity to profit from volunteer work of others, or often employing people on fairly low wages, constantly playing the poor mouth and then while paying C-level salaries like a business, want to be exempt from VAT and other inconvenient business costs, does turn the stomach a fair bit.

I don't get this rational that people who work for charities should not be paid well .

Concern for example is an international organisation that employs over 3000 people, it has many depts, such as finance, HR etc just like a normal business. Do you expect that to be run by a CEO of low level or someone who is a volunteer.

Do you realise what impact that would have?

The Corinthian

murpho999 wrote: »

I don't get this rational that people who work for charities should not be paid well .

Concern for example is an international organisation that employs over 3000 people, it has many depts, such as finance, HR etc just like a normal business. Do you expect that to be run by a CEO of low level or someone who is a volunteer.

Do you realise what impact that would have?

Why are you asking me? Or did you not bother reading what I actually posted?

murpho999

The Corinthian wrote: »

Why are you asking me? Or did you not bother reading what I actually posted?

It's a general question aimed at others using your figures.

biko

As a result, Africa now has the fastest-growing middle class in the world. Some 313 million people, 34% of Africa’s population, spend USD 2.20 a day, a 100% rise in less than 20 years, according to the African Development Bank.

The bank’s definition of middle class in Africa is people who spend the equivalent of USD 2 to USD 20 a day — an assessment based on the cost of living for Africa’s near one billion people. It is acknowledged that many living on USD 2 to USD 4 a day could easily slip back into poverty. But even when you take these people out of the equation, the bank puts the stable middle class at 123 million, 13% of the population. By 2060, says the bank, the number of middle-class Africans will grow to 1.1 billion (42% of the predicted population).

It is, as Soros points out, the world's fastest-growing middle class.

http://www.uhy.com/the-worlds-fastest-growing-middle-class/

mzungu

steddyeddy wrote: »

I spent a lot of time over in East Africa working with volunteer projects. Little Cuchulain is spot on. Find a project you like and donate to that. Find someone over there who runs a school, orphanage or prison and ask them what they need. They will be honest (more honest than some charity organisations anyway). So find someone local who you can trust and fund them.

This is really the only true way to make sure your money goes to a worthwhile cause. I feel that the grass roots charity organisations in Africa are the unsung heroes. A lot of them live from hostel dorms (met a few in Kampala who had been camping for 2 years!) or other basic and cheerful style accomodation. Working hard for little monetary reward, accept the fruits of bettering the education of the locals. Compare that to the wastes of space who clog up the Addis Sheraton at about $300-500 per night and who do little else but talk about getting things done, without ever really putting it into any meaningful practice. A lot of big NGOs simply masquerade as charities, its a nice cash cow for them and anything else is just an after thought.

steddyeddy wrote: »

Well Tanzania and what I could see of the Congo without getting killed is full of Chinese government officials and industry reps. They're cleaning out the resources of one of the most impoverished continents on earth. They refer to the locals as racist names and don't hire locals. They just take. I met people in Tanzania who said they were planning to strike back and I make no apology for saying I hope they hit them hard enough that they don't come back.

The Chinese have done some great work in improving road infrastructure in Africa, particularly Sudan (15 years ago roads in Northern Sudan were woeful...even by African standards). However I think the decision to not hire locals should not have been allowed in the first place by the respective governments. It was an opportunity to increase employment and better the economic circumstances of locals that has been squandered. Sure Ethiopian Airlines are now hiring Chinese when these jobs could be going to Ethiopians. A shame really.