Employee losing company property/cash

nobodiez

Hi all,

My friend works in a company that recycles certain materials. As a part of their job they carry a significant amount of cash to pay for purchases.
She has lost an amount of company cash (in excess of 2000 euro).
She is currently looking for it. My question is this: legally can a company force her to pay it back or would this just be grounds for firing from the job? Nothing of this nature is specified in the job contract.
Thanks in advance

Uno my Uno.

Could loosing E2000 of company cash be considered gross misconduct? If so they could be dismissed summarily. If it was not gross misconduct the employee could still be subject to the grievance procedure and ultimately be dismissed as a result.

Stheno

Uno my Uno. wrote: »

Could loosing E2000 of company cash be considered gross misconduct? If so they could be dismissed summarily. If it was not gross misconduct the employee could still be subject to the grievance procedure and ultimately be dismissed as a result.

I'd consider it gross misconduct

Uno my Uno.

Stheno wrote: »

I'd consider it gross misconduct

I suspect many would agree with you.

dreamers75

Really depends on circumstance and an investigation would find or lean towards one of the following.

Did she notify the company immediatly upon realising it was missing?
Did she steal it?
Did someone else steal it?
Did she misplace it?

Senna

Having staff carry large amounts of cash outside of their premises isn't an ideal situation and money being lost is a hazard of the situation the employer has put the employee in.
It will depend on her explanation of how it was lost, but I don't think they could claim gross misconduct unless her explanation isn't creditable.

nobodiez

Uno my Uno. wrote: »

Could loosing E2000 of company cash be considered gross misconduct? If so they could be dismissed summarily. If it was not gross misconduct the employee could still be subject to the grievance procedure and ultimately be dismissed as a result.

I agree but would she legally have to cover the damages aka pay it back?

Atlantic Dawn

€2k could easily be the price of a decent laptop these days, if your car was broken in to while the laptop was out of view and it was robbed what could you do? One the other hand if the cash/laptop was left unsecured in open view that would be careless.

nobodiez

dreamers75 wrote: »

Really depends on circumstance and an investigation would find or lean towards one of the following.

Did she notify the company immediatly upon realising it was missing?
Did she steal it?
Did someone else steal it?
Did she misplace it?

Yes.
She definitely did not steal it.
It is difficult to tell whether it was stolen but the chances are she lost it while travelling home from work. She has turned her house inside out looking for it but it cannot be seen.
It is a small company and they do not have official rulebook or protocol so i assume its between her and the employer.

nobodiez

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

€2k could easily be the price of a decent laptop these days, if your car was broken in to while the laptop was out of view and it was robbed what could you do? One the other hand if the cash/laptop was left unsecured in open view that would be careless.

Yes I would describe losing it as being careless.
Her employer basically said if she cant find it she will have to pay it back. Are there any laws defending her in a situation like this do you think?

Hachiko

why should she not pay it back. cant see how she can avoid this.

nobodiez

Well it was not as she borrowed this money. she was using it for work. if you damage a laptop while working the company accepts this so it is the same principal I would imagine

Mr.Carter

Hachiko wrote: »

why should she not pay it back. cant see how she can avoid this.

She shouldn't because the company should have insurance to cover their employees to carry that amount of cash...if they didn't and there is nothing in her contract about it...tough.
Get some proper legal advice from a solicitor.

Mr.Carter

nobodiez wrote: »

Yes I would describe losing it as being careless.
Her employer basically said if she cant find it she will have to pay it back. Are there any laws defending her in a situation like this do you think?

Get her to a solicitor...it will be cheaper than 2k by a long shot

nobodiez

Mr.Carter wrote: »

Get her to a solicitor...it will be cheaper than 2k by a long shot

Thank you, will try.

L1011

I've had far more than 2k worth stolen from a company van - how negligent in care or not they were will come in to it.

Hiding / lying while trying to find it (not saying that this is happening) will not help.

B.A._Baracus

Best off telling her to go to a solicitor, op. This is a serious matter because it can quite easily BECOME a serious matter in the eyes of the guards should they be involved. It's just up to the company at this point. But best to get advice from a solicitor.

Personally, if it happened to me I would be sooner happy getting the sack and ran down the road. To be thought of the 'ejjit' who lost two grand than the person who 'maybe stole it' and having the guards involved. That's just hassle.

Johnboy1951

I think it will hinge on one main point ....... was she carrying the money home as a usual practice known to, and approved by, the company, and in a manner (from a security aspect) approved by the company?

If yes then I would say it should be a claim on the company insurance and she should not be personally liable.

Uno my Uno.

If she is an employee (as opposed to a contractor) and she was carrying the money at the direction of her employer then she should not have to pay the money any more than a worker would have to pay for a tool or machine that was damaged n the workshop during the course of business.

However it may still be possible for the loss to be considered gross misconduct depending on the circumstances .