Time Sheet Jumpers

cgh

Grrrrrrr

so pee'd off,

Was ment to play yesterday in a stroke play in my new club.

was down for 10.12 on the time sheet going out in 3 balls.

there was 4 3 balls waiting to tee off.

I asked what the story was and was told its just slow today.

I checked on the time sheet and about 6 3 balls didnt have names on the time sheet. just came up and muscled in.

took 3 hours 10 minutes to play 12 holes. I walked in after that.

dan_ep82

Sounds like something that could have been solved by a starter checking times.

Have had this problem during casual and some comp's. Once in a comp we had a 4ball just jump out in the middle of a single's comp and held everyone up.

Something that is more common that annoys me is not waiting until the actual tee time. You tee off at 10am say, group behind has 10.10am. Your group gets down the fairway and a ball lands behind you at 10.05 which usually bunches up the groupings

Seve OB

If you arrive on the box at your appointed time and there are others there.... just ask them all what time they are on the sheet for...

First Up

Members or visitors?

If members, club needs to get its act together. If visitors, the pro shop needs to be told that maximising income shouldn't over-ride members' interests.

rrpc

Seve OB wrote: »

If you arrive on the box at your appointed time and there are others there.... just ask them all what time they are on the sheet for...

Exactly. Been asked myself in those situations and have no problem answering. You're on the tee box at the appointed time and shouldn't be waiting behind anyone else.

On hols in Portugal and six of us turned up on the first tee at the same time. A few simple questions and it turned out one of the two balls was supposed to be on the 10th. The other two ball was walking and we were in a buggy, so they told us to go ahead whilst the third two ball was being sorted. Nobody got their noses out of joint and it worked perfectly.

Russman

rrpc wrote: »

You're on the tee box at the appointed time and shouldn't be waiting behind anyone else.
.

Yeah, but unfortunately in real world situations in a club it doesn't work like that. It should, but it doesn't.
Leaving aside the slow play debate, timesheets can be backed up a little for various reasons, it might have been foggy for half an hour.
I know one of the things I see regularly (and I'm also happy to do it) is, say there are two lines of 4 and someone else arrives up looking for a game, we'll often make three 3 balls out of it to make sure nobody is left without a game. Granted I play in the first 3 or 4 groups out in the morning where its probably easier, we all know each other and regularly mix and match i.e. one line might have 4 the next might only have 2, so one of us might drop back to balance it out etc.

Totally agree the situation outlined by the Op sounds mad though, if there are no exceptional circumstances.

Seve OB

Russman wrote: »

Yeah, but unfortunately in real world situations in a club it doesn't work like that. It should, but it doesn't.
Leaving aside the slow play debate, timesheets can be backed up a little for various reasons, it might have been foggy for half an hour.
I know one of the things I see regularly (and I'm also happy to do it) is, say there are two lines of 4 and someone else arrives up looking for a game, we'll often make three 3 balls out of it to make sure nobody is left without a game. Granted I play in the first 3 or 4 groups out in the morning where its probably easier, we all know each other and regularly mix and match i.e. one line might have 4 the next might only have 2, so one of us might drop back to balance it out etc.

Totally agree the situation outlined by the Op sounds mad though, if there are no exceptional circumstances.

Yea but I have never had any kind of delay of more than a few minutes where the guys in the proshop wouldn't tell you about before you head out to the first tee.

In fairness though in pretty much every club they have a timesheet. There should be nobody just rolling up looking for a game. If they want to to that, they go to the pro shop and they will fix them up if possible.

Russman

Seve OB wrote: »

Yea but I have never had any kind of delay of more than a few minutes where the guys in the proshop wouldn't tell you about before you head out to the first tee.

In fairness though in pretty much every club they have a timesheet. There should be nobody just rolling up looking for a game. If they want to to that, they go to the pro shop and they will fix them up if possible.

Absolutely, and the Op's scenario sounds like someone somewhere is at fault.

Maybe my view is coloured by being one of the early players, and there not being too much timesheet pressure in my club anyway. Put it this way, if I wasn't on the sheet for whatever reason, and wanted a game, I'd still head up at the normal time knowing I'd be sorted 99 times out of 100.

First Up

Seve OB wrote: »

Yea but I have never had any kind of delay of more than a few minutes where the guys in the proshop wouldn't tell you about before you head out to the first tee.

In fairness though in pretty much every club they have a timesheet. There should be nobody just rolling up looking for a game. If they want to to that, they go to the pro shop and they will fix them up if possible.

It does depend on whether the "roller uppers" are members or not. Some pro shops are so eager to get any business going they will sell a green fee and "stick someone in" (sometimes ahead of members they think won't make a fuss.)

But if it is members just rolling up, or turning up late its a matter for the committee to sort.

Seve OB

Russman wrote: »

Absolutely, and the Op's scenario sounds like someone somewhere is at fault.

Maybe my view is coloured by being one of the early players, and there not being too much timesheet pressure in my club anyway. Put it this way, if I wasn't on the sheet for whatever reason, and wanted a game, I'd still head up at the normal time knowing I'd be sorted 99 times out of 100.

yea, but you would do the sorting out in the pro shop wouldn't you and not on the first tee with whoever was there?

Seve OB

First Up wrote: »

It does depend on whether the "roller uppers" are members or not. Some pro shops are so eager to get any business going they will sell a green fee and "stick someone in" (sometimes ahead of members they think won't make a fuss.)

But if it is members just rolling up, or turning up late its a matter for the committee to sort.

true, but obviously depending on the club. I've seen that kind of carry on at a club I am a (5 -day) member of on a few occasions (one of many reasons why I would never make it my home club). But you would hope that most clubs don't stoop so low. Most older clubs with solid member base's would be ok (you would think) and this kind of carry on might be more found in the Nama jobs

Russman

Seve OB wrote: »

yea, but you would do the sorting out in the pro shop wouldn't you and not on the first tee with whoever was there?

To be honest, it could be in the pro shop, in the car park, wherever. Its more a case of the guys in the first 4 lines on the sheet all asking each other "have you got your 4 ?" or "we've only 3 if anyone is stuck...", or "Joe is on his own if ye're short of one..." etc. etc. You'd obviously let the proshop know when you're paying, ie "I'm going with Paddy's group coz they only have two", its mostly the same 16 or 18 guys playing in the 7.30am to 8.00am slots for the last God knows how many years.

PARlance

cgh wrote: »

Grrrrrrr

so pee'd off,

Was ment to play yesterday in a stroke play in my new club.

was down for 10.12 on the time sheet going out in 3 balls.

there was 4 3 balls waiting to tee off.

I asked what the story was and was told its just slow today.

I checked on the time sheet and about 6 3 balls didnt have names on the time sheet. just came up and muscled in.

took 3 hours 10 minutes to play 12 holes. I walked in after that.

How exactly do you know that six 3 balls came up and muscled in? You being a new member?

It's a bit strange that the four 3 balls on the tee seemed to be okay with the delay, chalking it down to a slow play, as stroke play can be.

If 6 groups muscled in... then there would be at least 6 groups on the tee.

The club should have a starter to sort out the slow starts if it's an issue in medals.... They would also deter the 18 fictional guys....

Seve OB

Russman wrote: »

To be honest, it could be in the pro shop, in the car park, wherever. Its more a case of the guys in the first 4 lines on the sheet all asking each other "have you got your 4 ?" or "we've only 3 if anyone is stuck...", or "Joe is on his own if ye're short of one..." etc. etc. You'd obviously let the proshop know when you're paying, ie "I'm going with Paddy's group coz they only have two", its mostly the same 16 or 18 guys playing in the 7.30am to 8.00am slots for the last God knows how many years.

ah the aul club within a club

yea, see where you are coming from, but surely you have a timesheet in operation? you seem to come from a club where the timesheet might not be full all the time, which wouldn't be the case in my place, but on the odd occasion if I rolled up and someone was left on their own for any reason, the Proshop would ask a couple of groups to re-jig to make sure everyone gets a game. never a problem with that, but it's totally different to people not putting their names down and rolling up expecting to get out when the sheet is full

First Up

Seve OB wrote: »

true, but obviously depending on the club. I've seen that kind of carry on at a club I am a (5 -day) member of on a few occasions (one of many reasons why I would never make it my home club). But you would hope that most clubs don't stoop so low. Most older clubs with solid member base's would be ok (you would think) and this kind of carry on might be more found in the Nama jobs

And maybe some of the other more "commercial" clubs - or the public courses with a pay and play ethos. (Worst I ever experienced was a Sunday morning in Grange Castle when the timesheet was meaningless and everyone turned up late or without a booking but that was a few years ago.)

Sometimes its just an over-enthusiastic assistant pro and an ear bending sorts it.

Russman

Seve OB wrote: »

ah the aul club within a club

yea, see where you are coming from, but surely you have a timesheet in operation? you seem to come from a club where the timesheet might not be full all the time, which wouldn't be the case in my place, but on the odd occasion if I rolled up and someone was left on their own for any reason, the Proshop would ask a couple of groups to re-jig to make sure everyone gets a game. never a problem with that, but it's totally different to people not putting their names down and rolling up expecting to get out when the sheet is full

That's basically it exactly, its just probably a little informal at times. Our Saturday sheet would generally be close to full (weather and seasons permitting) and 99.9% adhered to, it'd never be the case where someone would rollup and demand or necessarily expect to get out, even though I've never seen anyone "not" get out, if you know what I mean. The later the day goes on the more likely you'd have to wait half an hour or so.

PARlance

First Up wrote: »

And maybe some of the other more "commercial" clubs - or the public courses with a pay and play ethos. (Worst I ever experienced was a Sunday morning in Grange Castle when the timesheet was meaningless and everyone turned up late or without a booking but that was a few years ago.)

Sometimes its just an over-enthusiastic assistant pro and an ear bending sorts it.

I was a member there in 2013&14 and never had an issue like that so it's not a recent one.
Slotting in societies was for me personally but you know what you're letting yourself in for if you slot in behind them.

First Up

PARlance wrote: »

I was a member there in 2013&14 and never had an issue like that so it's not a recent one.
Slotting in societies was for me personally but you know what you're letting yourself in for if you slot in behind them.

Fair enough; it was a few years before that. I got the feeling it was mostly people who couldn't be arsed getting out of bed in time for their slot.

PARlance

First Up wrote: »

Fair enough; it was a few years before that. I got the feeling it was mostly people who couldn't be arsed getting out of bed in time for their slot.

That may have been pre Target Golf Mgt coming in. Bar one fog delay, I never had a no-show in a group and tee times were always spot on in the 2 years (didn't play much there in Yr2 tbf).

First Up

PARlance wrote: »

That may have been pre Target Golf Mgt coming in. Bar one fog delay, I never had a no-show in a group and tee times were always spot on in the 2 years (didn't play much there in Yr2 tbf).

Could be. Overall I always found it a well maintained and well run facility. Probably unfair of me mention an isolated experience.

Deise Vu

Russman wrote: »

Yeah, but unfortunately in real world situations in a club it doesn't work like that. It should, but it doesn't.
Leaving aside the slow play debate, timesheets can be backed up a little for various reasons, it might have been foggy for half an hour.
I know one of the things I see regularly (and I'm also happy to do it) is, say there are two lines of 4 and someone else arrives up looking for a game, we'll often make three 3 balls out of it to make sure nobody is left without a game. Granted I play in the first 3 or 4 groups out in the morning where its probably easier, we all know each other and regularly mix and match i.e. one line might have 4 the next might only have 2, so one of us might drop back to balance it out etc.

Totally agree the situation outlined by the Op sounds mad though, if there are no exceptional circumstances.

Just on this point, if your time is 8.15, and the course is closed until say, 9.00 because of fog or frost for example, I was told by our club professional that it is the luck of the draw and you must give way to the later times.

Russman

Deise Vu wrote: »

Just on this point, if your time is 8.15, and the course is closed until say, 9.00 because of fog or frost for example, I was told by our club professional that it is the luck of the draw and you must give way to the later times.

I don't think there's any hard and fast rule for it as such, each club will do it their own way. From my own experience if the delay is only for a short period of time, say less than an hour, the sheet is basically just run as normal but behind schedule. In practice you tend to find that you'll get guys not wanting to or can't wait and they'll drift off home and groups get reconfigured, so you might lose 8 or 10 players which will help make up the lost time.

I suspect anyone walking up and demanding to tee off because they're on the timesheet at 10.15am would get short shrift in that scenario