Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Local Needs - letter from Parish Priest

Options
  • 30-09-2015 9:35pm
    #1
    AloBuild
    Registered Users Posts: 4 ✭


    Hello, trying to gather all my local needs info for planning permission in county Meath, which is not the easiest to get. Been told a letter from local priest helps towards local needs. Only thing is my Priest not very tech savvy (either am I) and he's asked me to draft the letter up and he'll sign it. Does any one have a sample letter I could use. I'm clueless for that sort of thing and don't know what to say.


«1

Comments

  • Options
    #2
    stickybookmark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,186 ✭✭✭stickybookmark


    I didn't have to do this so no sample letter sorry, but it should state that you have lived in the parish all your life, that you went to school there (state name of schools) that your family lives there (name them) and any other connections you have to the area - did you play GAA or other sports, did you or do you work locally, were you baptised in the church, have your communion etc (I'm only saying that coz you are getting a priest involved) did you get married there or christen your children there, what other ties do you have to the area? Are you involved in any local organisations etc..


  • Options
    #3
    bertie 56
    Registered Users Posts: 602 ✭✭✭bertie 56


    Are we in 2015, all of us ???

    Is it not a bit odd that we need a letter from a priest to have the right to live in a house ???

    Wakey wakey, Ireland ! Wakey wakey, Irish people !!!


  • Options
    #4
    stickybookmark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,186 ✭✭✭stickybookmark


    bertie 56 wrote: »
    Are we in 2015, all of us ???

    Is it not a bit odd that we need a letter from a priest to have the right to live in a house ???

    Wakey wakey, Ireland ! Wakey wakey, Irish people !!!

    They would prefer if people lived in housing estates where they can manage the services collectively.

    Once off rural houses are discouraged because they interfere with the landscape and make services more difficult to administer (obviously it's easier to manage services if everyone is living in estates) so they actively discourage them SO - you have to jump through hoops to get planning permission.


  • Options
    #5
    looksee
    Registered Users Posts: 28,293 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    stickybookmark wrote: »
    They would prefer if people lived in housing estates where they can manage the services collectively.

    Once off rural houses are discouraged because they interfere with the landscape and make services more difficult to administer (obviously it's easier to manage services if everyone is living in estates) so they actively discourage them SO - you have to jump through hoops to get planning permission.

    That is understandable, it does not explain what a parish priest has to do with anything? Its a bit like trying to get a child into a school, what does your religious affiliation have to do with your secular requirements? What do you do if you do not attend the local RC church?


  • Options
    #6
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,379 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    bertie 56 wrote: »
    Are we in 2015, all of us ???

    Is it not a bit odd that we need a letter from a priest to have the right to live in a house ???

    Wakey wakey, Ireland ! Wakey wakey, Irish people !!!

    sure why dont we give everyone an acre site in the country to live on... sure that couldnt do any damage :rolleyes::rolleyes:


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #7
    Drift
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭Drift


    looksee wrote: »
    What do you do if you do not attend the local RC church?

    You show how active you are in the local community by some other means. Letter from the local GAA club, soccer club, rugby club, V de P, Community Alert, meals on wheels, SPCA, ...... The list is endless.

    There's no grand conspiracy to allow only Catholics live in the countryside. There is however a grand conspiracy to only allow people who actively contribute to the social fabric of the countryside to live there.


  • Options
    #8
    stickybookmark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,186 ✭✭✭stickybookmark


    looksee wrote: »
    That is understandable, it does not explain what a parish priest has to do with anything? Its a bit like trying to get a child into a school, what does your religious affiliation have to do with your secular requirements? What do you do if you do not attend the local RC church?


    Well he'd hardly be getting a letter off a priest to prove his rural need if he wasn't brought up in the RC church!!

    If you weren't brought up in the church you get someone else - local headmaster or chairperson of the community council or a commissioner of the peace to write your letter. Anyone really apart from the local publican to say they know you well, your family is from there, you attended local schools etc.


  • Options
    #9
    Drift
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭Drift


    I should add ... For the uninitiated .... It's not the council who asked for a letter from the PP.

    The OPs agent advised them that they should show their links with the community as part of the application so it was decided that the PP was in a position to confirm that the OP is living in and contributing to the community.


  • Options
    #10
    AloBuild
    Registered Users Posts: 4 ✭AloBuild


    Actually it was the county council who suggested the letter from the priest in our pre-planning meeting. Well he didnt say we had to have a letter, it was just an example of how to get proof of local needs - ie if I was baptised there, married there been going there me whole life well then I'm obviously from the area. It's got nothing to do about proof your Catholic. If I was Muslim and had been going to the local mosque for the last 30 years, same proof would do. (But just for the record, there's no local mosque) Thing is I don't have much else except from school and bank, as not really into sports and a bit of an introvert so not into the whole local clubs thing. I was just wondering about a sample letter is all. If I was like my brother I could get a letter from the local barman to say I've been going there for the last 30 years instead Hahaha (he didn't get one by the way)


  • Options
    #11
    Angry bird
    Closed Accounts Posts: 808 ✭✭✭Angry bird


    It's a tricky one, and I'm not even sure what you should or should not send in tbh beyond proof of address showing you've lived in the area for a long time/from the area. I think there should be national guidance on this for a person to produce a set list of 'proofs' re rural linkage that's reasonable to obtain and produce.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #12
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,766 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    So what are non - Catholics supposed to do ?... it's bloody outrageous that this is even suggested.
    The whole local needs thing is ridiculous.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • Options
    #13
    fepper
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,434 ✭✭✭fepper


    galwaytt wrote: »
    So what are non - Catholics supposed to do ?... it's bloody outrageous that this is even suggested.
    The whole local needs thing is ridiculous.
    being a catholic has its perks as regards local needs,well that's the nanny state for you


  • Options
    #14
    Calibos
    Registered Users Posts: 7,806 ✭✭✭Calibos


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    sure why dont we give everyone an acre site in the country to live on... sure that couldnt do any damage :rolleyes::rolleyes:

    He's not arguing about planning around one off housing etc he's asking what century we're living in when a council official recommends he get the parish priest to write a covering letter as part of the planning application. It was patently obvious to everyone else what he meant.


  • Options
    #15
    Drift
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭Drift


    galwaytt wrote: »
    So what are non - Catholics supposed to do ?... it's bloody outrageous that this is even suggested.
    The whole local needs thing is ridiculous.

    I rarely disagree with you galwaytt but I have to this time. Read my post above for a small subset of items that might prove local linkage.

    I think sometimes people have a habit kg latching onto things once the word Catholic comes up. If the OP started a thread asking for the proposed wording of a letter from his local rugby club there would be no "outrage"


  • Options
    #16
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    sure why dont we give everyone an acre site in the country to live on... sure that couldnt do any damage :rolleyes::rolleyes:
    Which is exactly what most councils were doing (while there was money in it for them!).
    A looming nightmare in a future of diminishing fossil fuels and other resources(& a host of other future problems).
    I do know one person who got his local needs by obtaining a farmers "certificate" to allow him to replace his Grandparents house that had ceased to be a dwelling decades ago.


  • Options
    #17
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,379 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Calibos wrote: »
    He's not arguing about planning around one off housing etc he's asking what century we're living in when a council official recommends he get the parish priest to write a covering letter as part of the planning application. It was patently obvious to everyone else what he meant.

    and i still havent seen one cogent argument here AGAINST having a PP letter as support for an application.

    do you think rural PPs dont know people of ANY religion who have lived in a rural location for more than 12 years??

    this is simple band wagon jumping at its basest form.


  • Options
    #18
    BryanF
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 10,140 Mod ✭✭✭✭BryanF


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    and i still havent seen one cogent argument here AGAINST having a PP letter as support for an application.

    do you think rural PPs dont know people of ANY religion who have lived in a rural location for more than 12 years??

    this is simple band wagon jumping at its basest form.

    Perhaps those that don't wish to use their parish priest as a reference could use their local publician?


  • Options
    #19
    mfceiling
    Registered Users Posts: 12,796 ✭✭✭✭mfceiling


    BryanF wrote: »
    Perhaps those that don't wish to use their parish priest as a reference could use their local publician?

    Mick is a great lad. He has been drinking here for years. One night he drank 16 pints of Guinness and drove home. Please give him planning permission for his new house or else my pub will close!!
    Regards,
    Paddy joe jr


  • Options
    #20
    heldel00
    Registered Users Posts: 1,832 ✭✭✭heldel00


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Which is exactly what most councils were doing (while there was money in it for them!).
    A looming nightmare in a future of diminishing fossil fuels and other resources(& a host of other future problems).
    I do know one person who got his local needs by obtaining a farmers "certificate"to allow him to replace his Grandparents house that had ceased to be a dwelling decades ago.

    If by farmers "certificate" you are actually referring to the green cert, then this course is one year full-time or three years part-time.
    If I spent that time attending ag college to get my farmers "certificate", as you put it, then you could be sure I'd use it to plead my case too!


  • Options
    #21
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,766 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    Drift wrote: »
    I rarely disagree with you galwaytt but I have to this time. Read my post above for a small subset of items that might prove local linkage.

    I think sometimes people have a habit kg latching onto things once the word Catholic comes up. If the OP started a thread asking for the proposed wording of a letter from his local rugby club there would be no "outrage"

    The Catholic angle is particularly galling, but the local needs thing is discriminatory and plain wrong. Look at all the good people who have come to this country in the last 10+ years. My own sister-in-law (Latvian) would be denied permission for example. Ditto a good Polish couple I know.

    Why should they not be afforded the opportunity to settle and contribute to ANY community ? Or, to put it another way, why should they be only "allowed" to settle in particular places, areas? Isn't there another emotive word for that behaviour ?

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #22
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    heldel00 wrote: »
    If by farmers "certificate" you are actually referring to the green cert, then this course is one year full-time or three years part-time.
    If I spent that time attending ag college to get my farmers "certificate", as you put it, then you could be sure I'd use it to plead my case too!
    Yes, that's the one, he did a year of study ( I wasn't sure of the exact title of the cert) and that was used to assist the planning permission that was successful.


  • Options
    #23
    Drift
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭Drift


    galwaytt wrote: »
    The Catholic angle is particularly galling, but the local needs thing is discriminatory and plain wrong. Look at all the good people who have come to this country in the last 10+ years. My own sister-in-law (Latvian) would be denied permission for example. Ditto a good Polish couple I know.

    Why should they not be afforded the opportunity to settle and contribute to ANY community ? Or, to put it another way, why should they be only "allowed" to settle in particular places, areas? Isn't there another emotive word for that behaviour ?

    The local needs system when "correctly" used should only be applied to rural areas that are under large development pressure due to people wishing to commute to nearby urban centres. (ie within 45 minutes of a city) The idea is that the "local needs" system protects the rural fabric of these communities whilst preventing urban sprawl.

    The thinking is that any new people moving to these rural towns/villages should live within the village unless they have a specific reason to live "on the land" - I.e. farmer, farm labourer, etc. Of course the farmer's entire offspring commuting to the factory in town is a challenge but no politician would ever overtly support a system where farmers can't give sites to their children!

    There are rural areas that are being killed by outward migration. These are not within commuting distance of any large town/city. I know some sensible development plans where there are no "local needs" requirements for these areas. So if you are a city dweller who wants to move to a half acre site in the country you are effectively welcomed to boost these suffering communities.

    I think the idea of local needs is well intentioned and has some strong merits. As always the problems lie with the interpretation of these ideals by various planners and councils. I've seen some horrific abuses of this system and I've seen some ideal local needs applicants get shafted but all the times it works correctly (to prevent the outskirts of Dublin reaching Kinnegad) don't make the headlines.

    Also the county development plan is written by the civil servants but voted upon and agreed by the local councillors that you and I elect. If you don't like it make your thoughts known to your councillor.


  • Options
    #24
    ht9zni1gs28crp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,011 ✭✭✭ht9zni1gs28crp


    Its nothing to do with Catholicism FFS. Get off your high horses people.

    I had to satisfy local needs to the hundredth degree and NOT once was it implied I HAD to have a letter from the local PP. It was mentioned as an example along with the myriad of other examples you could give such as GAA, School, Clubs, Civil Defence, Scouts or anything you may have been or are involved in. Some people are SO thick the planners nearly have to spell it out for them what they need to provide.


  • Options
    #25
    hexosan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,736 ✭✭✭hexosan


    I also needed to Satisfy the local needs for my area. I used evidence of living in the area, nearby family and a letter from the local school. Didn't need to use the parish priest in my case. (I would of if it was needed)
    Can't see the issue with getting a letter off the parish priest. Has anyone read a passport form for the last umpteen years on the parents identity for a child's passport. Priest is listed among about 10 other people who can certify the parents identity I don't see people marching in the street over this.

    Priest is used generally to mean your religious adviser be you Christian, Muslim or Jedi.
    Is just so happens in this a predominately Catholic country that (and I'm assuming here) the Catholic council worked suggested the priest (the one their most familiar with) as a means of proving local needs.

    As has been said before people need to get off their high horse.


  • Options
    #26
    DOCARCH
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 17,857 Mod ✭✭✭✭DOCARCH


    hexosan wrote: »
    Priest is used generally to mean your religious adviser be you Christian, Muslim or Jedi.

    As has been said before people need to get off their high horse.

    Agreed.


  • Options
    #27
    hexosan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,736 ✭✭✭hexosan


    galwaytt wrote: »
    The Catholic angle is particularly galling, but the local needs thing is discriminatory and plain wrong. Look at all the good people who have come to this country in the last 10+ years. My own sister-in-law (Latvian) would be denied permission for example. Ditto a good Polish couple I know.

    Why should they not be afforded the opportunity to settle and contribute to ANY community ? Or, to put it another way, why should they be only "allowed" to settle in particular places, areas? Isn't there another emotive word for that behaviour ?

    Would it have been equal galling if the council worker suggested the local politician or school principal instead.

    On the note of the good people coming into the country (I'm close friends with a pole) if they, like my Irish friend from Galway want to build in the rural village outside the town well to satisfy local needs I'd expect both to rent in the area for a number of years, get involved in local activities and integrate into the fabric of the community. Then when it would come to the local needs they could use this for the council.
    I don't see any of this as been "discriminatory" or only "allowing" "them" in a particular area.

    I can assure you if a group of our travelling friends were granted permission to build anywhere they wanted in country beside these people complaining the council discriminating argument would go flying out the window pretty quickly.


  • Options
    #28
    stickybookmark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,186 ✭✭✭stickybookmark


    I have a sample letter for you OP, it was my friend's one (I've removed the names etc) I'll PM you


  • Options
    #29
    mtdevane
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭mtdevane


    Hi Stickybookmark,
    I saw you'd a sample letter. I'm wondering would you mind sending it to me. I'm gonna be applying for planning soon.

    Regards
    Marie


  • Options
    #30
    B-D-P--
    Registered Users Posts: 1,167 ✭✭✭B-D-P--


    bertie 56 wrote: »
    Are we in 2015, all of us ???

    Is it not a bit odd that we need a letter from a priest to have the right to live in a house ???

    Wakey wakey, Ireland ! Wakey wakey, Irish people !!!

    If getting a letter from a priest helps, whats the issue?
    They are seen as people of knowledge of the area.

    Personally if I was in the op's shoes I'd get a letter off the parish priest, a guard or even a Local Drunk, if thats what it needed.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #31
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    B-D-P-- wrote: »
    If getting a letter from a priest helps, whats the issue?
    They are seen as people of knowledge of the area.

    Personally if I was in the op's shoes I'd get a letter off the parish priest, a guard or even a Local Drunk, if thats what it needed.
    Our local priest was helicoptored in last year from Poland, so I'm not sure how that would work. It appears to me that they get moved around a bit, in a similar way that Garda are posted to different areas for a while.


This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement