Cow scanning

L1985

Hey guys we have only started scanning our cows and to be honest our calving dates are ridiculously spread out (something I'm working on) but we got a guy in to scan 3weeks ago. One cow he said had 4months to go -I was going mad as though she was due in a few weeks he said no deff around jan.checked her 5days later and she calved-fine heifer calf.
Now we have another cow due in dec and I just put her in the yard as she looks like she's springing. We wouldn't have been the best at noting down when animals were bulling-something in trying to get better at.
Just wondering out of three animals so far it looks like 2 were wrong -another one calved the following week after scanning which we did know ourselves but said we'd get her scanned just in case. Is this normal or should we be getting someone else to scan In future?he was with frs like?
Thanks guys

whelan2

Very hard to accurately scan them when they are over 5 months

farmerjj

Ya its hard to tell when there so close to calving, wait till the seasons over and see what %he got right

Miname

That's a bit of a joke getting it 4 months out. Scan them about 6 weeks after the bull comes out to be safe. I went through a good few before I found the lad I use now. I had a lad even burst cows on me. Getting the calving tightened is a different story, either knock off a couple of the latest ones and hold the earliest ones or just get ruthless and buy in ones falling into your pattern.

L1985

Well I don't think we will be in a place where we hve all the cows 6 weeks from the bull at the same time for awhile but I get what you mean.
Tbh I didn't mind him being a bit out but I thought saying a cow was going to calf four months away when she calved the same week he was there wasn't great. Wouldn't mind a couple of weeks but a few months makes a big difference so I'll keep an eye with the others and see how accurate he was.
Just didn't help my case with the father me arguing to get it done as would help us culling cows etc and the first cow to calf was wrong!!he was saying it's an expense we don't need. Typical eh!!

Farrell

L1985 wrote: »

Well I don't think we will be in a place where we hve all the cows 6 weeks from the bull at the same time for awhile but I get what you mean.
Tbh I didn't mind him being a bit out but I thought saying a cow was going to calf four months away when she calved the same week he was there wasn't great. Wouldn't mind a couple of weeks but a few months makes a big difference so I'll keep an eye with the others and see how accurate he was.
Just didn't help my case with the father me arguing to get it done as would help us culling cows etc and the first cow to calf was wrong!!he was saying it's an expense we don't need. Typical eh!!

Yep, good uphill struggle.
Would it be worthwhile getting a marking chin ball for the bull, change the dye every 3 week & you can see what was served to give you rough dates.
I'm doing similar with a ram & easy to spot repeats / empties.

blue5000

L1985 wrote: »

Well I don't think we will be in a place where we hve all the cows 6 weeks from the bull at the same time for awhile but I get what you mean.
Tbh I didn't mind him being a bit out but I thought saying a cow was going to calf four months away when she calved the same week he was there wasn't great. Wouldn't mind a couple of weeks but a few months makes a big difference so I'll keep an eye with the others and see how accurate he was.
Just didn't help my case with the father me arguing to get it done as would help us culling cows etc and the first cow to calf was wrong!!he was saying it's an expense we don't need. Typical eh!!

In fairness he should have known by handling her that she was pretty close to calving.

If you want to tighten things up an easier way would be go to autumn and spring calving, see when most of your cows are calving and try work around that, take the bull out after 2 months eg May and June, then put him back in mid Oct to mid Dec.

It wouldn't be as drastic as culling and buying in. Scan then 1 month after the bull is taken away. Chin ball is ok for the first week, after that the bull usually has the feckin thing pulled off anyway. But it would give you an idea of which cows would be calving first, so you could watch them when they are due.

Or, if you were lucky and it (the feckin chin ball) stayed on for 4 weeks you could see if any cows repeated, this would show up a fertility problem 2 months before scanning and give you time to sort it.

L1985

Blue5000thats actually a really good idea and makes a lot of sense.i don't want to cull our cows none are over 4and are all good calvers so far. They have been bringing decent sized calves with no probs so I'd be reluctant to get rid of them. Our calving intervals decent enough considering we put second calves on around 70%of the cows as well!by pulling the bull out that bit itl make life easier but we won't have a ridiculously hectic time of it either!
That balls a great idea iv never even heard of it but could really help monitor things -it can be a bit of a pain and there has been one or two oops where a cows calved out of nowhere on us!!hopfully any new bull we get will co-operate!

50HX

most effective time to scan is 35 days after bulling

scanning when they are 5+mnths in calf is dangerous as the calf is down in the cow- vet will not get a really accurate view and can in some cases bring the cow on to calving early

i agree with blue though - vet should have known by handling her if she was that close

time to change vet for scanning maybe?

L1985

I was told by the man scanning that it doesn't cause problems like that any more and there's no issues acanning them at any stage?and again we are calving 10months of the year so was diff to get a time to scan that would be good for all cows.
But fingers crossed we will start getting that under control!
Thanks for everyone's help-I don't think we will get him back but I'll see how he goes with the other ones as well I suppose. But I got some great ideas from here so thanks everyone for replying

Lizard_Moon

As a vet that scans cows I find scanning the cows shouldn't effect the calf or make her come early. However sticking a cow down a crush and stressing her can bring a cow on to calf if she is close. Thats what I find when I'm TB testing, even with everything seeming calm and quiet!

Very hard to accurately age without getting the calf or its eye socket on the screen so it can be measured. In fact, if they make errors, inexperienced scanners tend to miss cows far on as they only scan in the pelvis.

Early, 35day, scanning is a great tool for picking up empty cows. Just remember it is early and the cow could lose the calf, more likely in dairy cattle than sucklers. The scan result would be accurate on the day but cow may not calve down.

Stick with your scanner unless empty cows that were over 35days from service turn up in calf!

Sam Kade

I have a vasectomised bull with the cows still, better than any scanner, they must be all in calf with a while because he's bored sh1tless these days.

keep going

This scanni g is a nice little earner isnt it , did the sums and he was getting 150 euros an hour in our place.the machine is 10 grand or so but even still.2.50 a cow or so

whelan2

keep going wrote: »

This scanni g is a nice little earner isnt it , did the sums and he was getting 150 euros an hour in our place.the machine is 10 grand or so but even still.2.50 a cow or so

dont mind paying it if they are good at their job, normally they have a call out fee incuded too

Dawggone

whelan2 wrote: »

dont mind paying it if they are good at their job, normally they have a call out fee incuded too

I pay €2/head +vat.
Did 55 yesterday that calved in July.
20 incalf with another 13 probables.

Lizard_Moon

keep going wrote: »

This scanni g is a nice little earner isnt it , did the sums and he was getting 150 euros an hour in our place.the machine is 10 grand or so but even still.2.50 a cow or so

Ah come on, are people not allowed to try to earn a living?
Even for a lay person there are machine costs, insurance costs, vehicle costs, repair/replacement, risk of machine being destroyed or operator injured on each visit.

White Clover

Lizard_Moon wrote: »

Ah come on, are people not allowed to try to earn a living?
Even for a lay person there are machine costs, insurance costs, vehicle costs, repair/replacement, risk of machine being destroyed or operator injured on each visit.

Precisely. It's like someone saying dairying is handy. Milk 100 cows in an hour @ 15l @ 30 c/l. A handy €450 in an hour.

keep going

Ah yeah and as he remarked you dont get through the cows as fast with fellas bating cows with alkadine pipe and cursing in some places.as always when you compare back to the fella that drives in the yard with something that sucks diesel, they are not doing too bad

whelan2

keep going wrote: »

Ah yeah and as he remarked you dont get through the cows as fast with fellas bating cows with alkadine pipe and cursing in some places.as always when you compare back to the fella that drives in the yard with something that sucks diesel, they are not doing too bad

When I was paying scanning man last week he was saying sure half of it goes to the tax man, in fairness he is one of the best guys I have ever seen handling and walking through cattle no cursing and shouting

Miname

whelan2 wrote: »

When I was paying scanning man last week he was saying sure half of it goes to the tax man, in fairness he is one of the best guys I have ever seen handling and walking through cattle no cursing and shouting

Your lad won't whelan he just gets in the van and goes, I know from experience. He's extremely accurate but. He hates sucklers but.