ATH - First Round Match 8 - WinnieThePoo v TheBostonCrab

beakerjoe

In match 8, old school boardsie thebostoncrab battles WinneThePoo, a newcomer to the game, in a match that will hopefully continue the trend of great matches ...HERE WE GO!



Simplified version of the rules:

I will post a topic and you have to post your response including why you made that choice within a given time limit (before the next match is scheduled to begin), take care while making your responses however as the other contestant can counter your arguement i.e pointing out possible flaws in what youve said.

*you can only counter an arguement two times so make sure your point is worth making. If someone's defense of their arguement isnt good it will count against them.

*You can use the same answer as your opponent if you wish i.e you agree with their choice however its hard to win a debate when your making the same points someone has already made

see the OP of the main thread for further details or if any examples are needed check out previous years competitions.

Q8: With Wrestlemania 32 on the horizon, it appears that Undertaker is set for his retirement match. The booking suggests that Taker v Brock 3 could happen at this event and we are going to fantasy book here. Its schedueled to be Brock and Taker 3, but Brock throws a massive hissy fit and walks out on the company in January. Its up to you to find a replacement and book the angle? What do you do?

Who does Taker face and how do you book the angle.....Go!

After your first post, why would your choice be better than your opponents?

GOOD LUCK LADS

WinnyThePoo

Firstly I’d like to congratulate everybody. A first round with phenomenal bouts. The standard has been through the roof and I hope to continue that with a coherent and structured contribution.

Wrestlemania 32 will be the biggest wrestlemania yet with an estimated attendance figure of up to 100,000 people in AT&T stadium in Arlington, Texas.

What a perfect stage for Mark Calaway to end his monumental wrestling career in his home state. So who would be the suitable opponent for The Undertaker to face?

I have been racking my brain hard for this. I personally did not want to go for the obvious choice and try something in my head that might seem fresh to you the reader.

Sting? The obvious money maker and dream match choice but as said above, I want to try something else.

John Cena? Whilst being a massive match. I think it should have happened a long time ago.

Bray Wyatt? Bray goes for revenge after last year?. Could work and I was thinking of The Undertaker and Sting going against The Wyatts, but I couldn’t really feel the angle out.

My Choice

KURT ANGLE



Kurt Angle is the biggest wrestling name wrestling outside of the WWE by far. People have hoped for his return. His smoothness in the ring and his jockular smack talk on the mic has always been missed.
Alone he is Money and take a look at his WWE honors alone


WCW Champion
WCW United States Champion
World Heavyweight Champion
4 time WWF Champion
Intercontinental Champion
European Champion
Tag Team Champion with 404 not found
King of the Ring Winner in 2000


Wrestling Observer Newsletter named him

Wrestler of the decade 2000-2009!


So to the angle

Whilst he obviously been tainted with poor health as this is fantasy booking I am giving him a full bill of health for this angle. Also Angle is coming back on a short term contract with limited apperances and won’t be expected to be around after Wrestlemania as well.

With Brock Lesnar leaving the company and doing it at least in a some what professional sense. We will have Undertaker v Brock 3 at Survivor Series in a Buried Alive Match. Have a nice long build for it. Of course the Undertaker Wins. At the TLC PPV Undertaker comes out and announces he will be entering the royal rumble match the following month. He says he wants one last shot at the title at his home town. On the same night a promo video appears on the titantron with the American flag and the word hero with no sound.

Raw the next night and the same video appears. After Jack Swagger comes down to the ring with Zeb Coulter. Jack swagger proclaims he represents the stars and the stripes, he is the true hero of America and he will win the Royal Rumble and go on to become the next great American WWE Champion.
The next raw the same video appears and once again. Jack Swagger accompanied by Coulter go through the same stick again but are interrupted by Bo Dallas. Who calls himself the true hero of the people and all they have to do is bolieve. Swagger and Dallas push each other around and both point at the Wrestlemania sign before the lights go out. The Undertaker appears and chokeslams both of them. The Undertaker takes a mic and reiterates that he will become the 2016 Royal Rumble winner and he will Main event in his homestate of Texas the biggest Wrestlemania of all time.

The same video appears on the following Smackdown and Raws with the superstars in the back all talking about the video and wondering who it could be. Could Brock be back?. What about Steve Austin? The Rock?.
We get to the Royal Rumble night and match. Superstar after Superstar enter and get thrown out and just for a bit of detail The Miz has a long and fine showing. When the buzzer finally sounds for the 24th competitor The Undertaker comes out. The ring is pretty full and the undertaker eliminates quite a few off the bat with Bo Dallas funnily eliminating himself because he’s terrified of The Undertaker.

We get to the 30 competitor to come out. The Buzzer sounds. The video plays again just for a moment silence then the words Intensity, Integrity and Intelligence flash up on the screen. ‘Medal’ Kurt Angles old theme sounds. Crowd go wild. Angle appears and stares down at the ring. The Undertaker, Kevin Owens, John Cena and Cesaro are all that are left. Angle runs in an eliminates Cesaro and Owens. Back to back moves and finishers happen. With eventually Angle and Undertaker eliminating themselves. John Cena wins Woohoo!.
The next night on raw. Angle appears. Bemoans his loss last night. Saying it won’t stop the Olympic gold medalist from getting his paws on the WWE Heavyweight championship again. He says he doesn’t care for The Undertaker. He has beaten the best in the business including The Undertaker and now the streak is over Undertaker is of no use to Angle. He continues to belittle the legacy of The Undertaker and as the fans start to boo he insults them. Angle wants gold again.

Triple H organises a number one contenders match for the WWE title. Angle is to face Roman Reigns. Winner goes to on face Sheamus at Fastlane for the WWE title(yea Sheamus is the champ after cashing in on Sting at the end of night of champions). Angle and Reigns face off in a physical battle with eventually Angle getting the upperhand. He gets Reigns in the ankle lock, as it looks like Reigns is gonna tap the lights go off. They turn back on and of course its The Undertaker. Angle’s not scared. He gets in Undertakers face shouting at him. Undertaker chokeslams him and then proceeds to tombestone him. Match ends with no winner.

Triple organizes a Fatal Four Way for the WWE title at fastlane between Sheamus, Reigns, Angle and Undertaker. Angle rips into his opponents on the go home show before Fastlane. He calls The Undertaker a coward for hiding in the dark. He says he’s more worried about his other opponents . He is full on heel and the crowds will hate him.
At the fastlane PPV The Undertaker does not appear during the title match to the crowds dismay. During a moment of dominance Kurt gets microphone and berates The Undertaker some more. Angle eventually loses the match to Reigns(Sheamus get pinned).
They next night on raw Angle during a promo blames everybody but himself for not winning the title. He even again insults The Undertaker calling him a coward who won’t even turn up for matches.

The Undertakers music goes off and he comes down to the ring. After a long stare. The Undertaker says he didn’t appear last night because he was afraid of what he would of done to Angle. He says Angle is a spoiled bitter man who never reached the level of greatness because he simply wasn’t good enough. He says he will give Angle a chance for greatness. By facing him at Wrestlemania 32. Angle says he’s not interested. He has already conquered the phenom. Undertaker teases ‘Brock may have ended the streak, but i’m giving you a chance to end me in a retirement match’.

After some humming and hawing Angle decides to accept and calls The Undertaker a footnote on his path glory. Angle trys to get Undertaker in an ankle lock before its switched into the gates of hell which angle escapes.he following few weeks Angle spouts promo’s and replays his greatest hits.

We get to Wrestlemania 32.

A fifteen minute match occurs with back to fort action. Towards the end Angle gets undertaker into his favourite submission breaking Callaways ankle in the process, but the undertaker doesn’t tap out and the referee doesn’t stop the match. Eventually Undertaker gets Angle into the gates of hell. Angle eventually taps out. The Undertaker wins.

Reasons for the undertaker winning. After Brock ended the streak the idea of Undertaker putting over a superstar again made little sense to me. He took his loss and made Brock Lesnar even more fierce. I also felt the whole Wyatt or any other young superstar going over didn’t have as big as match feel and getting Kurt Angle in again. Undertaker v Angle is money.

Please excuse grammitical(lol) mistakes etc.

Thank you for reading


Also goodluck to The Boston Crab who is one of the most knowledgeable posters here and I am very looking forward to his booking.

thebostoncrab

I'm a firm believe in the idea that CM Punk had with booking anything, "And then what?" There is no point focusing on just having a great match, you need to look at where that match brings you to afterwards. Sure, there are many matches you could with 'Taker going against part timers, but what happens after? Kurt retires? What happens for the next 12 months? How does booking a match affect the entire roster?

And that's I had in mind for my pick. I'm looking at the next 12 months, the next 24 months. I'm looking at the future. I want to book a match that will change the landscape of the WWE. I want to book Undertaker in a match at Wrestlemania that will have everyone talking and change everything. Who is facing 'Taker?

Seth Rollins.


And he is going over.


And I'm booking the finish that Seth hurts Undertaker so much that it forces Underraker to retire.


But why? Why would I do something like this? Because of "And then what?"

Beating Undertaker at Mania can't be done by a face, no matter how over he is, because he will get boo'd out the building no matter who he is. That's why I didn't go with my second choice of Daniel Bryan. It needs to be a heel, and it needs to be a heel who can also take the heat of beating Undertaker. Seth Rollins is more than capable of handling that. It would instantly maintain his status as the number one heel in the company and will establish him as a made man. And that's without taking into account retiring Undertaker. I wouldn't announce this as a retirement match because I think it gives away the finish too much. But if we use the stories of Taker collapsing after his matches, put out the question of his health, then book the finish with Seth giving Taker such a serious head injury that he medically can no longer wrestle, because of the reckless Seth Rollins who was so desperate for a victory over Undertaker that he cost the man his career? Brother you just established him as the biggest heel of our time.

And that's without going into the match itself. If Kurt Angle can bring out a top class match, think about how good of a match we would get out of a man like Seth who isn't limited by any injuries and is young and fresh enough to bring out moves and sequencers that Kurt could only dream about.

I'll go into my booking in more detail if needs by (I'm writing this on the Luas home from work- just want to get my choice in now rather than leave it any longer) but I think it's solid, gives you a great match, an amazing moment we'll never forget, and keeps the story alive well into the future.

beakerjoe

Bumping this because the match has been going a while now, both men have 2 rebuttals each

WinnyThePoo

Hi. Sorry for the delay. Damn work!.

'Then What'

Whilst I agree that in a perfect world every match and outcome has a follow through that can hopefully benefit both performers and move story lines and pushes ahead would be great, but this is WWE we are talking about.

Angle V Undertaker is spond inducing. Simple point. Cash Money Dollars. It's Wrestlemania. This is a match up made for the shows of shows.

Seth Rollins alongside Paul Heyman is the best thing in my opinion in WWE right now.
He can talk and he can pull a great match each time he enters the circled square. His push and his ability to handle it has been superb. I believe he is set for a babyface turn soon and I believe he is a babyface and he will be an excellent one.
Giving him the heat won't help him when he crosses the divide. He is a very marketable guy and is in my opinion destined to replace Cena as their go to face.

thebostoncrab

But Angle vs Taker does nothing to further the company. Both men will go away the next night. In fact, in your booking, Angle is retired! You bring him back and have him do the job to another part timer who is also on the way out? Why not give someone the already on the roster the programme with Kurt and have them retire the guy? That way, someone who is there the next night keeps the story alive. Plus, to be honest, I don't want to watch Angle fight 'Taker while thinking "Jesus I hope Angle doesn't do more damage to his neck."

And turn Seth babyface? Why? We have very few real heels that don't just get X-Pac heat. Seth is on the corner of becoming one the biggest heels in modern history. My story helps makes that a reality.

Kurt vs Taker will bring in money, but it's does nothing for the roster. Seth vs Taker will give you a better match, a solid story, a moment that lasts in our minds forever and will keep going long after the match.

WinnyThePoo

But Angle vs Taker does nothing to further the company. Both men will go away the next night.

Nothing to further the company. What did Sting vs Triple H do to further the company?. Even the second HHH - Undertaker. Wrestlemania is about big names and matches that appeal to a wide range of demographics so a lot of people will sign up to the network or buy the PPV.
Angle v Undertaker is akin to Sting v Triple H. Money.

Why not give someone the already on the roster the programme with Kurt and have them retire the guy? That way, someone who is there the next night keeps the story alive. Plus, to be honest, I don't want to watch Angle fight 'Taker while thinking "Jesus I hope Angle doesn't do more damage to his neck."

Why should we keep the story alive. Natural endings to feuds happen at Wrestlemania.

And turn Seth babyface? Why? We have very few real heels that don't just get X-Pac heat. Seth is on the corner of becoming one the biggest heels in modern history. My story helps makes that a reality.

Rollins is set for a face career. This is the guy to replace Cena. He is over now and will continue to get over as a face. He has the image and moveset.

Kurt vs Taker will bring in money, but it's does nothing for the roster. Seth vs Taker will give you a better match, a solid story, a moment that lasts in our minds forever and will keep going long after the match.

The streak is gone. Having a young guy go over now?. Why put that heat on someone who has the potential and already is on the path to becoming one of the biggest babyfaces of our time.

Why not just sit back. Grab a beer and watch The Undertaker vs Kurt Feckin' Angle. Clap when The Undertaker takes a bow and leaves the winner he began.

thebostoncrab

WinnyThePoo wrote: »

Nothing to further the company. What did Sting vs Triple H do to further the company?. Even the second HHH - Undertaker. Wrestlemania is about big names and matches that appeal to a wide range of demographics so a lot of people will sign up to the network or buy the PPV.
Angle v Undertaker is akin to Sting v Triple H. Money.

And you know what? It still pisses me off that Sting vs HHH didn't add anything beyond 'Mania. Every single match, no matter what its place on the roster, needs to keep the talent over and help grow the roster. Kurt vs Undertaker in a match where Kurt looses AND retires to a part timer does nothing for the roster. Zilt. It's a waste. If you're gonna have Kurt bow out, have him out over a talent that is going to be in the company for the future. In fact, I think Cesaro is that perfect man go into that spot. Cesaro vs Angle would be a better match and would push Cesaro into that main event. Again, the match helps the roster grow...just like Seth Rollins retiring Undertaker at 'Mania.

WinnyThePoo wrote: »

Why should we keep the story alive. Natural endings to feuds happen at Wrestlemania.

Because the story is why we watch wrestling. If I want guys just fighting for the sake of it I'll watch UFC. I want the drama, the spectacle, and I want to see where everyone's goes to next. The place to finish stories? I'd argue 'Mania is where stories also begin. Just ask the list of guys who won their first world title at the event, like Stone Cold Steve Austin.

WinnyThePoo wrote: »

Rollins is set for a face career. This is the guy to replace Cena. He is over now and will continue to get over as a face. He has the image and moveset.

I'm sorry, but Rollins is NOT the future face of the company. He is a good face, but he is an excellent heel. Cents isn't going anywhere anytime soon, so we to replace him at the next 'Mania. Rollins is the perfect heel and needs this to become the biggest heel we have seen in years, why stop that to put him in a place that he won't excel in?

WinnyThePoo wrote: »

The streak is gone. Having a young guy go over now?. Why put that heat on someone who has the potential and already is on the path to becoming one of the biggest babyfaces of our time.

Again, to make him the biggest heel. We don't have a heel at the same level of Cenas babyface appeal. Having him retire Undertaker (In a match that's not focusing on the streak. The focus is on him beating Undertaker so badly on this stage that 'Taker is forced to retire.) will make him grow to that level. There are others who will Cenas place (Balor, Bryan, Reigns) when the time comes.

WinnyThePoo wrote: »

Why not just sit back. Grab a beer and watch The Undertaker vs Kurt Feckin' Angle. Clap when The Undertaker takes a bow and leaves the winner he began.

I'm not denying it won't be a good match, it'll be great. But so would Seth vs Undertaker. The difference between the two?

"And then what?".

Why have the great match that ends there, when you can have the great match and gives us an unforgettable moment and lives on in storylines long after the bell is rung?

beakerjoe

Poll up!

beakerjoe

BUMP

beakerjoe

1 more day for folks to vote. A quarter final against Cheese Wagstaff awaits the winner.

beakerjoe

Bump, 13 votes so far, give it a read and vote god damn it