Architects fee as a percentage of build cost

bluferbl

An architect has quoted his price as being a percentage of the build cost for an extension i.e. the fancier finish etc. the more he makes.

Is that the norm?

Thanks in advance.

Strolling Bones

It is but nothing to stop you asking for a fixed sum instead.

BryanF

bluferbl wrote: »

An architect has quoted his price as being a percentage of the build cost for an extension i.e. the fancier finish etc. the more he makes.

Is that the norm?

Thanks in advance.

'Fancier' finish the more time detailing and time on site with builder to get 'fancier' finishes

Yes it's the norm

How much is a service for a Bentley v a service for a micra ????

ruskin

bluferbl, an architect asking for a percentage fee of the build cost is downright extortion for a one-off build or extension. A previous poster mentioned that a more elaborate finish requires more detailing- this is not true. If your architect sits down with you and prepares a detailed package for tender, then you both should be clear about the work involved. Any of the architects and engineering techs. that I know wouldn't dream to ask for a percentage cost on such jobs (even though I'm sure they would like to) as the market is so competitive. You do not have pay extortionate prices for the high standard you require.

c montgomery

I think this is complete BS and reminds me of celtic tiger crap.

They should charge for their time and that alone and the final cost of what their working on should be irrelevant.
I would ask for hourly rate.

The analogy of Bentley vs micro is also BS.
Imagine if your suppliers though like this, (is that shower going to a penthouse? Sorry it 700 rather than 300 then)

BryanF

c montgomery wrote: »

I think this is complete BS and reminds me of celtic tiger crap.

They should charge for their time and that alone and the final cost of what their working on should be irrelevant.
I would ask for hourly rate.

The analogy of Bentley vs micro is also BS.
Imagine if your suppliers though like this, (is that shower going to a penthouse? Sorry it 700 rather than 300 then)

You get what you pay for

ruskin

c montgomery wrote: »

I think this is complete BS and reminds me of celtic tiger crap.

They should charge for their time and that alone and the final cost of what their working on should be irrelevant.
I would ask for hourly rate.

The analogy of Bentley vs micro is also BS.
Imagine if your suppliers though like this, (is that shower going to a penthouse? Sorry it 700 rather than 300 then)

100% correct- what you spend on finishes, etc. is your own business, the architect should charge for their time like any profession, and not try and leech some more money off your build.

ruskin

To be perfectly honest, if you pay an architect based on a percentage of the build cost, and not a fixed rate, then more fool you.

c montgomery

BryanF wrote: »

You get what you pay for

That's basic statement means nothing.
Price is not indicative of quality work and being honest you sound like someone with a vested interest in maintaining the % method.

If I was getting a new kitchen extension and decided to get marble floors and counters adding 20k to the cost should my architect get an extra few hundred even though it had no addition work for him? I think not.

bluferbl

This is the exact point that I was thinking. The architect drew up some 'snazzy' plans (despite being told that only plain finishes are required). Obviously it's in his interest to make it as expensive as possible, which is entirely not in our interest.

c montgomery wrote: »

That's basic statement means nothing.

If I was getting a new kitchen extension and decided to get marble floors and counters adding 20k to the cost should my architect get an extra few hundred even though it had no addition work for him? I think not.

Calahonda52

c montgomery wrote: »

That's basic statement means nothing.
Price is not indicative of quality work and being honest you sound like someone with a vested interest in maintaining the % method.

If I was getting a new kitchen extension and decided to get marble floors and counters adding 20k to the cost should my architect get an extra few hundred even though it had no addition work for him? I think not.

Just before I add you to my ignore list:

if ur marble floors and counters fail to pass muster in some shape or form: whose PI will you follow?

What I do is agree a fixed price but am very clear on whats covered: extreme case wont stand over, or insure, the risk associated with say the heating system, lighting systems, or entire kitchens and flooring if they are too fancy.

c montgomery

Calahonda52 wrote: »

Just before I add you to my ignore list:

if ur marble floors and counters fail to pass muster in some shape or form: whose PI will you follow?

What I do is agree a fixed price but am very clear on whats covered: extreme case wont stand over, or insure, the risk associated with say the heating system, lighting systems, or entire kitchens and flooring if they are too fancy.

Ignore away, I fail to see the need to tell me of this.

It's pretty straight forward, people with a vested interest will argue for the % method as it's a way of charging more.
Majority of truly professional people charge per hour.

DOCARCH

c montgomery wrote: »

Majority of truly professional people charge per hour.

Most people will not (agree to) pay by the hour! It is the fairest way, but most will not agree to it.

I can tell you (from personal experience) that % fees, more often than not, do not cover the hours spent on a project! If I could get a reasonable hourly fee I would be delighted!

Strolling Bones

c montgomery wrote: »

Majority of truly professional people charge per hour.

That is simply not correct. Clients fear the running taxi meter affect.

Fixed fee or %

Pick your poison.

Bonzo Delaney

Surely when you price for a prospective job you sit down and think xy&z will prob take so much of my time and extra is extra plus materials. Everyone has their projected yearly wage divide that by how many hours you intend on working for the year and wohla a fixed price is found.
If your too busy your prob too cheap and if the phone is dead your too dear. When a percentage price is found I'd imagine it's worked backwards to make sure your covered. It's like giving a price per sq m. I'd always work itemised back from that and adjust accordingly so everything's covered and anything extra is extra and agreed before commencement.

Gumbo

ruskin wrote: »

To be perfectly honest, if you pay an architect based on a percentage of the build cost, and not a fixed rate, then more fool you.

c montgomery wrote: »

That's basic statement means nothing.
Price is not indicative of quality work and being honest you sound like someone with a vested interest in maintaining the % method.

If I was getting a new kitchen extension and decided to get marble floors and counters adding 20k to the cost should my architect get an extra few hundred even though it had no addition work for him? I think not.

I'm not an architect or involved in anything from a % charge or fixed charge area, but you two guys sound like you should not be here as you clearly don't know what goes on in the profession.

From your previous posts it's obvious you have issues with architects or maybe the fact that you have to pay for their professional service.

Ruskin, you are in no way qualified to be giving advice in the forum considering your basic ignorance with regards to Building Regulations and a home owners requirement to adhere to them. Especially in areas of fire safety etc. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=96867242

hedonaut

Why would it cost more for an architect to sign off on solid hardwood floors than laminate floors?

tina1040

I'm in the middle of a project. I didn't like the idea of % when I first heard of it. It seems to be the norm though. Do you know of architects who agree a fixed fee?

Quazzie

hedonaut wrote: »

Why would it cost more for an architect to sign off on solid hardwood floors than laminate floors?

Because if your floors buckle due to a building defect who's PI are you claiming off?

hexosan

Quazzie wrote: »

Because if your floors buckle due to a building defect who's PI are you claiming off?

If the building was defective wouldn't both floors buckle so how is this a valid point.

Quazzie

hexosan wrote: »

If the building was defective wouldn't both floors buckle so how is this a valid point.

But the finish cost has a massive bearing on the amount being claimed and therefore also on next years premium.

hexosan

Quazzie wrote: »

But the finish cost has a massive bearing on the amount being claimed and therefore also on next years premium.

I will admit that I have no knowledge of PI insurance premiums but with car insurance an €800 claim payout and a €10,000 payout have the same effect on the following years premium. Once a claim is made the premium rises but it doesn't rise in line with the size of the payout.