What have current ICU executive achieved this year

pawntof4

I'll start with an easy one

The Glorney and Faber cup were run very successfully

brilliantboy

I'm not looking forward to seeing the bill though

reunion

Is this thread what have they done like any normal executive would? i.e. set a date for the AGM?

Or what they have done differently? i.e. published draft minutes of executive meetings?

I think it should be latter. Otherwise this thread is too easy to derail with mockery.

Sparks

reunion wrote: »

Is this thread what have they done like any normal executive would?

To be fair, that wouldn't be damning with faint praise. It's surprisingly (and depressingly) rare for committees in Irish sports NGBs to actually do solid work on the basic stuff. A committee that kept the lights on, made sure the competitions happened, kept accurate records and didn't make a mess of things is actually not the bare minimum in Irish sport

checknraise

They hosted the glorney cup which was a great event by all accounts.
Darko organised a grant of 5,000e towards the glorney cup.
Sponsorship was organised for the Irish junior championships.
Pat spoke well on the radio debating whether chess is a sport.

Pete Morriss

checknraise wrote: »

Sponsorship was organised for the Irish junior championships.

Really? I was told the opposite.

As for the money for the Glorney, I have searched both the Glorney and European Chess Union websites, and found no mention of that. It's not like Azmaiparashvili not to publicize such generosity. Maybe the money really was given, and maybe there is an item on the ECU website that I have missed, but I wouldn't rely on any statement to that effect on the ICU website.

cdeb

There was sponsorship - t-shirts for all competitors and a cup for best under 8 girl I think.

Nothing financial.

Chess_Coach

LOL

ECU did not publish this . Well done Pete you are amazing .
How many times I have asked you at the meetings what will you do regarding sponsorship ?
How many potential sponsors have you contacted ?
Any success ? You might if you were not busy with sending false emails to the Executive members for setups . You have done this to late Bernard Palmer who then washed you with pint of beer. Remember!

The 5000 e was given to ICU by ECU.

This makes 4000 e saved per year as junior officer - 12 000 e plus 5 000 e total of 17 000 e for ICU

Now how much money did you save or make for ICU ?
Wait wait

It is zero isnt it ?

Or could you tell us what have you done regarding Child Protection Policy ? I have wrote to you numerous time didnt I

This Executive had that sorted but this is maybe just maybe not that important to you or is it ?

I am looking forward to see you again at AGM Pete I have more question for you now . It is regarding emails sent privately to other officers and one Arbiter Norm .
Please make sure that you have answers or maybe you could explain it here .
Thanks

Chess_Coach

checknraise wrote: »

They hosted the glorney cup which was a great event by all accounts.
Darko organised a grant of 5,000e towards the glorney cup.
Sponsorship was organised for the Irish junior championships.
Pat spoke well on the radio debating whether chess is a sport.

emmmmmm

Child Protection Sorted
NCC rules amended
Data Protection law respected and fully controlled
Minors data safe and protected
Action regarding one Arbiter Norm - regulated
Junior Coaching Project was excellent
Transparent budget with strict control
Minutes from meeting published
ECU President and Secretary visit - Darko
Fide President support to Glorney - Darko and KOC
Norm Tournament for 2016 in plan - agreed

But please chess friends ask Pete what has he done ? Please ?

Tim Harding

Chess_Coach wrote: »

reed

But please chess friends ask Pete what has he done ? Please ?

Personally I had nothing against you Darko until tonight when I had to read reams and reams of self-justifying c**p in bad English from you. Save your speech for the agm.

Pete is not a candidate so what he has done or not done a year ago is irrelevant to how people will vote this year.

What is more relevant to how we impartial players will vote is the extremely unpleasant smell coming from the current ICU chairperson [originally I wrote "EC president" - wrong term, must be going senile, very sad] and his totally noxious and incompetent P.R.O.

Fish rot from the head.

Chess_Coach

Tim Harding wrote: »

Personally I had nothing against you Darko until tonight when I had to read reams and reams of self-justifying c**p in bad English from you. Save your speech for the agm.

Pete is not a candidate so what he has done or not done a year ago is irrelevant to how people will vote this year.

What is more relevant to how we impartial players will vote is the extremely unpleasant smell coming from the current EC president and his totally noxious and incompetent P.R.O.

Fish rot from the head.

*snip*

My Croatian and Serbian is much better then your English and my 2nd language is much better then yours .

You defend your best friend here your pal who did nothing as Chairman of the ICU . It is important very important Tim what he have done last year . You will see it is regarding one Arbiter Norm .

I have no idea what is EC but you ll not bully me here or anywhere .

I am not afraid of your kind c...p . I talk like this but I work for Irish chess 24 / 7 . Ask your pal . He knows .

Do not talk in the name of many I talk just in my name . You represent nobody but yourself . However you might think that you are some kind of the leader of the huge crowd. Then wake up alone as usual .

Many now can see that this is hijack at the Executive . Ask GG just to tell you what was the ICU password given to GG by Mark Orr and publish it here .

This passwords hide the nature of all that was going in in Executive .

*snip*

Lecale

EC is probably executive committee. The elections should not be fought over issues of how much you personally dislike A or B. It is about what they did for Irish Chess. I think that this thread should try to stay on topic. Let us talk here about what the ICU executive actually did. Is that possible, or can Irish Chess players not manage even that?

Chess_Coach

You are well misinformed by haters on this blog. If you knew the truth you would maybe change your mind . AUDARE ET ALTERA PARS.

ComDubh

Tim Harding wrote: »

Fish rot from the head.

Lovely expression! Here's another relevant one from Shaw: "I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."

reunion

Mod note: please stay on topic.

reunion

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Child Protection Sorted
NCC rules amended - that's not an achievement. NCC rules have been in place for all executive.
Data Protection law respected and fully controlled - according to your accusations on Mark Orr this would be untrue. Also something every executive has done.
Minors data safe and protected - See point above
Action regarding one Arbiter Norm - Not an achievement
Junior Coaching Project was excellent - was it not other years?
Transparent budget with strict control - No budget available: note same as every other executive
Minutes from meeting published - mandated and these are only DRAFT versions are available. I note the draft version of the latest minutes which remove the MCU rep without consultation is still missing.
ECU President and Secretary visit - Darko Executive
Fide President support to Glorney - Darko and KOC Executive
Norm Tournament for 2016 in plan - Already one yearly

See my notes above, not all those listed actions are achievements. Some of them are what happen every year in Irish chess.

Chess_Coach

ECU President visit was organized by me only not the Executive sorry .
No Data was not safe as you will see from report .
Your notes are not correct at all . Budget will be available in time . No the budget was not published when JOC was Chairman .

Lecale

I'm interested to know what data safety means here.:)
For instance, storing Data in the UK doesn't make it unsafe.
Storing data where it is accessible through a wordpress front end would be said by most security experts to make it unsafe.

Chess_Coach

Storing data on personal PC ( for backups ) and passing to other without telling so to the Executive might be .
There is interesting post at one other page regarding this but I cant say where as mods are just waiting for chance to ban me .

Sparks

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Storing data on personal PC ( for backups ) and passing to other without telling so to the Executive might be .
There is interesting post at one other page regarding this but I cant say where as mods are just waiting for chance to ban me .

No, they're not.
And by the way, what you are describing is explicitly not a breach of the Data Protection Act so long as the PC you're talking about is within the EU and the data is not released from that PC in a way that breaks the Act (and you would have to prove that the release had happened, in a courtroom).

Chess_Coach

Sparks you are obsessed with courtroom .
What should be proven will be proven . Remember dont be personal as you have history of hate towards Executive and some of their members .
Well documented here

reunion

Chess_Coach wrote: »

ECU President visit was organized by me only not the Executive sorry .
No Data was not safe as you will see from report .
Your notes are not correct at all . Budget will be available in time . No the budget was not published when JOC was Chairman .

If you are taking all the credit (and saying you did it), then it's not an achievement of the executive then is it?

Were you doing it as the development officer of the ICU? Then it was the ICU executive that did this - not you. You can be happy knowing you had a part to play (as the development officer) and you can say the amount of work you put in, but it is not you who invited them over - it is you as the development officer which is the ICU executive.

I'm sure someone thanked you for it (if that's what you are looking for), but you must choose, is it the executive or you personally? You don't get both.

Sparks

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Sparks you are obsessed with courtroom .

You're talking about accusing a professional of breaking a law that relates to his profession. That is why the courts get dragged in. It's not an obsession; it's how life works. You make public accusations about someone that affects their ability to earn a living and you should expect that that's serious enough to wind up in a court.

you have history of hate towards Executive and some of their members .
Well documented here

I have a history of being physically assaulted by one of the current executive. That's not the same thing as a "history of hate".

Chess_Coach

Sparks

I didnt so that so why do you hate me so much. Who is the person I wrote bad about and where ?

L1m1tless

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Storing data on personal PC ( for backups ) and passing to other without telling so to the Executive might be .
There is interesting post at one other page regarding this but I cant say where as mods are just waiting for chance to ban me .

chess_coach no mods want to ban anyone. We want this forum to be a useful resource for all.
We know you are a great coach but we don't need reminding of it every 5 minutes!

From the outside it looks like you are hoping to be banned. I don't take part in these conversations as I like to be as impartial as possible.

I hope you continue to contribute to the forum in a civil and constructive way.

Thanks

Sparks

I don't. That's the difference between those two things Darko.

Chess_Coach

Answer my question Sparks please ?

cdeb

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Answer my question Sparks please ?

Oh, the irony!

Sparks

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Answer my question Sparks please ?

You edited your post to add the question so this is the first time I've seen it. The person you've accused of breaking the data protection act on the FB group was Mark Orr.

cdeb

Mod note - Chess_Coach banned for one week for continually dragging threads off topic and arguing about moderation. Both in contravention of the boards.ie rules (not just the rules of this forum)

We want to facilitate discussion here, not allow people post whatever they want whenever they want in order to avoid pointed questions.

reunion

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Sparks you are obsessed with courtroom .
What should be proven will be proven . Remember dont be personal as you have history of hate towards Executive and some of their members .
Well documented here

I think you are confusing someone as a person and someone as an officer of the ICU. When you are on the ICU executive, the membership have a right to ask the officer questions, be critical of the decisions made and discuss decisions and actions by the ICU executive.

Asking these questions and discussing these topics do not constitute hatred towards a person. I can think person X as position Y is poor and need to be removed from office. That does not mean I think person X is "insert an insult/negative attribute here" or that I hate them.

Sparks wrote: »

That's not the same thing as a "history of hate".

When he says history of hate, I'm guessing he means the last few weeks where chess players have been asking for answers to basic questions which the executive have ignored.

Sharkey47

Hi guys. I was a person who played chess to a reasonable level in the 1980s and 1990s before life got in the way and I had to stop . It is the game I love even if my only chess playing now is trying to solve JJ Walsh's puzzle every morning.

I am horrified by what I have been reading here over the past few days. The level of vitriol and aggression is beyond belief. Is this what chess has become in Ireland?

I think it is imperative that rank and file chess players should attend the forthcoming AGM as it is patently obvious something has gone very badly wrong in the administration of chess in Ireland. Whether this is due to the current Executive or is a continuation of a trend over a number of Executives is for each individual to make up his own mind.

Irish chess deserves better than this.

CINCLANTFLT

Same here... I've been watching these interactions for a while now... It makes me have no interest in getting involved in chess in Ireland...

cdeb

CINCLANTFLT wrote: »

Same here... I've been watching these interactions for a while now... It makes me have no interest in getting involved in chess in Ireland...

Can't say I blame you.

Which is a shame, as for the vast part, there's a great social element to the game here and 99% of the players get on great with each other.

But you'd surely struggle to find a sport with a more destructive 1%.

Pete Morriss

CINCLANTFLT wrote: »

Same here... I've been watching these interactions for a while now... It makes me have no interest in getting involved in chess in Ireland...

I can well understand that, but that would be a great shame. I can assure you (and Sharkey47, and any others reading) that almost all chess events in Ireland are very enjoyable, and that the players at them are welcoming, kind and generous. That's why I got drawn back into chess some ten years ago, after having been out for over 20 years.

The trouble is that some two or three people lose the run of themselves on social media - though even they can be warm in person at chess events. The trouble is compounded because two of these people are on the current ICU executive, and are using it as an extension of their social media campaigns. Hopefully they will no longer be on the executive in a month's time (one of them is not standing anyway) and we can then get back to playing chess in a supportive and friendly atmosphere again.

NubieOne

If I can get back to the original subject of this thread, this is my considered contribution based my own research over the last week or so since I started following Chess on boards. It’s been an interesting journey indeed.

Positive achievements
1. Glorney ( Best Ever ? ) This has to be number one on the list and the proposed new incoming team ( see details )seem to acknowledge this by not running a candidate against the man who almost single handily achieved this, the Junior Officer Desmond Beatty
2. Getting the President of Ireland to agree to be the Patron of the Irish Chess Union This one shouldn’t be underestimated as it should seriously help get outside sponsorship of ICU events
3. Child Protection Policy No previous executive have managed to get this sorted to the extent that this one has. There is now a recognisable framework for all involved in chess in Ireland to come officially under the umbrella of a proper Child Protection Policy
To be fair to the current executive, I think these are very good achievements. The others listed by Chess_Coach are either normal expected items that any executive would be criticized for not doing or they just haven’t done them yet (i.e. transparent budget)
Negative achievements
1. Failure to submit the Galway Rapid Play for FIDE rating As far as I know, this event was not submitted for rating because the ICU executive believed that one of it’s members had been denied admittance to the event without an acceptable reason being given. In a recent statement on the official website, the chairman claims that it was not rated because, and I quote “could not be rated because they did not comply with the relevant FIDE rules” I have scanned the FIDE handbook and I can’t see any FIDE regulation that was breached here, maybe the ICU Tournament Director can point me to what I’m missing. If so, then this item should be taken off this list.
2. Disciplinary Process irregularities It has been the practice of previous executives to form an independent subcommittee to deal with the disciplinary matters, in accordance with the code of practice on the website. However, it must be pointed out that clause 13 of the constitution allows them to deal directly with these matters provided the requirements of Natural Justice are adhered to. In both the cases of Mark Orr and more recently, Gerry Graham, the committee can hardly claim that they adhered to the principals of natural justice (see here)
3. The alienation of the Irish event organisers The initial decision to introduce this new policy doesn’t seem to have been given much discussion at executive level and was certainly never discussed with the major event organisers before the rushed introduction. This rushed introduction seems to have been designed to target the largest event in the calendar, Bunratty. Only after a backlash from the event organisers did a meeting happen to consult and I believe discussions were on-going for a while. If the recent statement from event organisers is to be believed, these discussions have now broken down. The ICU executive have stated that some of the event organisers have contacted them to agree with their new proposals. If they would tell us who these are, it might help us make up our minds as to who to believe in this debate before we have to vote at the AGM.
4. Failure to update the Constitution with the changes agreed by the 2014 AGM To be fair, this one could probably be levelled at most previous executives as well but this executive seems to claim to be the most open and transparent of all and the proposed new Constitution coming before the EGM on October 4th is not correct. Whether or not the changes being introduced are adopted, the changes made to the Constitution at last year’s AGM will be lost, see here post numbers 172 and 175. If this is a fair and open executive, this needs to be addressed before the EGM goes ahead.
5. The National Chess Club Championships fiasco Where do I begin with this one, let’s just make a list of what we know happened
1. The executive give the event to the wrong province, it should have been Leinster’s turn, it was awarded to Munster
2. Instead of appointing an arbiter themselves, as the rules dictate, they ask the Ennis Chess Club to source an arbiter for the event themselves
3. They offer no advice or guidance to the organisers / arbiter as to how this event should be run except to point them to the rules
4. The inexperienced arbiter (at least inexperienced in running the NCC) makes a mistake in the draw of the 3rd round, leading to no legal draw possible in round 4. This leads to repeated pairings and, as has been explained to me since, this actually does mean that the FIDE server will refuse to accept the event for rating.
5. However, the ICU ratings officer could easily have edited / deleted the duplicated games and then ICU rated the event, this they decided not to do.

My question in all this is - where was the ICU Tournament Director during all this and why was he not more involved to make sure these types of problems didn’t happen? In either the current rules, or the new proposed rules, he’s the person responsible for this event !

Retd.LoyolaCpt

NubieOne wrote: »

If I can get back to the original subject of this thread, this is my considered contribution based my own research over the last week or so since I started following Chess on boards. It’s been an interesting journey indeed.

Positive achievements
1. Glorney ( Best Ever ? ) This has to be number one on the list and the proposed new incoming team ( see details )seem to acknowledge this by not running a candidate against the man who almost single handily achieved this, the Junior Officer Desmond Beatty
2. Getting the President of Ireland to agree to be the Patron of the Irish Chess Union This one shouldn’t be underestimated as it should seriously help get outside sponsorship of ICU events
3. Child Protection Policy No previous executive have managed to get this sorted to the extent that this one has. There is now a recognisable framework for all involved in chess in Ireland to come officially under the umbrella of a proper Child Protection Policy
To be fair to the current executive, I think these are very good achievements. The others listed by Chess_Coach are either normal expected items that any executive would be criticized for not doing or they just haven’t done them yet (i.e. transparent budget)

No arguments here.

Pete Morriss

NubieOne wrote: »

Positive achievements

2. Getting the President of Ireland to agree to be the Patron of the Irish Chess Union This one shouldn’t be underestimated as it should seriously help get outside sponsorship of ICU events.

Just for the record, this was an achievement of the previous Executive, not this one.

NubieOne

Pete Morriss has just correct me, it seems the previous committee got the President of Ireland to be Patron of the ICU. I also notice that my post didn't appear as I wanted it to, the links didn't show ( I don't have that privilege yet ) and the spacing was't great either. I'll try to improve the readability below.

Positive achievements

1. Glorney ( Best Ever ? ) This has to be number one on the list and the proposed new incoming team ( see details )seem to acknowledge this by not running a candidate against the man who almost single handily achieved this, the Junior Officer Desmond Beatty

2. Child Protection Policy No previous executive have managed to get this sorted to the extent that this one has. There is now a recognisable framework for all involved in chess in Ireland to come officially under the umbrella of a proper Child Protection Policy
To be fair to the current executive, I think these are very good achievements. The others listed by Chess_Coach are either normal expected items that any executive would be criticized for not doing or they just haven’t done them yet (i.e. transparent budget)

Negative achievements

1. Failure to submit the Galway Rapid Play for FIDE rating As far as I know, this event was not submitted for rating because the ICU executive believed that one of it’s members had been denied admittance to the event without an acceptable reason being given. In a recent statement on the official website, the chairman claims that it was not rated because, and I quote “could not be rated because they did not comply with the relevant FIDE rules” I have scanned the FIDE handbook and I can’t see any FIDE regulation that was breached here, maybe the ICU Tournament Director can point me to what I’m missing. If so, then this item should be taken off this list.

2. Disciplinary Process irregularities It has been the practice of previous executives to form an independent subcommittee to deal with the disciplinary matters, in accordance with the code of practice on the website. However, it must be pointed out that clause 13 of the constitution allows them to deal directly with these matters provided the requirements of Natural Justice are adhered to. In both the cases of Mark Orr and more recently, Gerry Graham, the committee can hardly claim that they adhered to the principals of natural justice (can one of the mods edit a link to any definition of natural justice please )

3. The alienation of the Irish event organisers The initial decision to introduce this new policy doesn’t seem to have been given much discussion at executive level and was certainly never discussed with the major event organisers before the rushed introduction. This rushed introduction seems to have been designed to target the largest event in the calendar, Bunratty. Only after a backlash from the event organisers did a meeting happen to consult and I believe discussions were on-going for a while. If the recent statement from event organisers is to be believed, these discussions have now broken down. The ICU executive have stated that some of the event organisers have contacted them to agree with their new proposals. If they would tell us who these are, it might help us make up our minds as to who to believe in this debate before we have to vote at the AGM.

4. Failure to update the Constitution with the changes agreed by the 2014 AGM To be fair, this one could probably be levelled at most previous executives as well but this executive seems to claim to be the most open and transparent of all and the proposed new Constitution coming before the EGM on October 4th is not correct. Whether or not the changes being introduced are adopted, the changes made to the Constitution at last year’s AGM will be lost, see here post numbers 172 and 175. If this is a fair and open executive, this needs to be addressed before the EGM goes ahead.

5. The National Chess Club Championships fiasco Where do I begin with this one, let’s just make a list of what we know happened

1. The executive give the event to the wrong province, it should have been Leinster’s turn, it was awarded to Munster

2. Instead of appointing an arbiter themselves, as the rules dictate, they ask the Ennis Chess Club to source an arbiter for the event themselves

3. They offer no advice or guidance to the organisers / arbiter as to how this event should be run except to point them to the rules

4. The inexperienced arbiter (at least inexperienced in running the NCC) makes a mistake in the draw of the 3rd round, leading to no legal draw possible in round 4. This leads to repeated pairings and, as has been explained to me since, this actually does mean that the FIDE server will refuse to accept the event for rating.

5. However, the ICU ratings officer could easily have edited / deleted the duplicated games and then ICU rated the event, this they decided not to do.

My question in all this is - where was the ICU Tournament Director during all this and why was he not more involved to make sure these types of problems didn’t happen? In either the current rules, or the new proposed rules, he’s the person responsible for this event !

cdeb

I guess just as a mod note - this thread is for discussing the positives of the current exec.

No problems with Nubie's post - but there's a separate thread (kind of by default) for the negatives of the current exec here.

So if Nubie's contra points do generate discussion, I might move the relevant posts over to the other thread to keep everything together.

RoundTower

NubieOne wrote: »

Positive achievements
1. Glorney ( Best Ever ? ) This has to be number one on the list and the proposed new incoming team ( see details )seem to acknowledge this by not running a candidate against the man who almost single handily achieved this, the Junior Officer Desmond Beatty

I'll point out that Pat is also not running a candidate for junior officer (see his post on icu.ie). Desmond doesn't want to run as part of either team and I expect both teams want him as junior officer.

really123

Just finished my evening shift and posting here as a long time member of the ICU.

I have great respect for Pat and I really do think that he has the best interests of Irish chess at heart.

Pat secured a mandate last year and this really could have been a new dawn for Irish chess.

Pat's first mistake (and probably the one that will be his undoing) was allocating the role of PRO to the most toxic and divisive candidate available. Daly had ran for election previously for an ICU role. The members voted and elected someone else. Its really unclear how Pat could have thought putting Daly into this PRO role could have benefited chess in Ireland.

Two members of the ICU exec post here regularly (Darko at least identifies himself), Daly has numerous nom de plumes and the aggression is uncomfortable (I wont name all Daly's aliases here as the mods will probably ban me) . Darko has threatened people through IM, Daly denies he even reads the posts here, when his posts are so obvious to everyone that knows him.

One could have allowed Pat his year to learn, but when he nominated Daly for the position of PRO again for the upcoming year???? One has to really question his logic. Has he not seen the divisions created by the PRO? Has he not seen the facebook page that is run by two of his executive members Darko and Daly?

Even Daly realised that he would never be elected and withdrew as he and everyone else knew that he would never have been voted in. Darko will align to anyone and really needs to take accountabilty for whats being posted on a site where he is moderator along with the PRO.

I like Pat, he could have made a difference. Darko is a good coach and should stick to that. He comes across as ignorant and foolish on social media. (his response to this is 'what have you done for chess' but this mail will go over his head). Daly is toxic and anyone who has been even remotely related to chess in Ireland knows that. I'm not sure what his agenda is but PRO was a crazy allocation. Fair play to him for refusing the nomination.

reunion

Mod note: combined 2 threads together, to avoid duplication.