Equality rules for minors shopping

doublej

Is it lawful for a store to refuse access to schoolchildren other than on terms that adults do not have imposed on them.

Two stores close to a school have policies that single out ALL pupils for treatment that is not meted to any other patron.

One of them only grants access in groups of 3, the other has an employee at the exit seeking the school kids proof of purchase receipts.

Are these actions lawful? they are based upon the fact that they are a group of school kids but surely would not be permitted if done on racial,ethnic,gender etc grounds?

Pro Hoc Vice

Yes a shop can do so,

The equal status act

"(3) Treating a person who has not attained the age of 18 years less favourably or more favourably than another, whatever that other person's age, shall not be regarded as discrimination on the age ground."

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2000/act/8/section/3/enacted/en/html

As amended

"“(3) (a) Treating a person who has not attained the age of 18 years less favourably or more favourably than another, whatever that person's age shall not be regarded as discrimination on the age ground.

(b) Paragraph (a) does not apply in relation to the provision of motor vehicle insurance to licensed drivers under that age."

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2004/act/24/section/48/enacted/en/html

MarkAnthony

Children also lack the ability to contract, except for necessaries. So depending on the shop they can refuse outright, which they can of course do anyway.

Also you're a bunch of sticky fingered sods, or some of you are. I went to two fairly good schools and both had issues with shop lifting.

Apply common sense OP.

endacl

I used to work in a video shop (remember those?) around the corner from two schools. I fully understand why a shop would limit access. Nothing to do with shoplifting. Groups of teenagers arriving in to your place of work to just kill time and hang out are a pain in the hole. I used to lock the door for half an hour around 4 pm. Regulars would just drop their returns in to the butchers next door. If they needed to come in for any reason, they'd give me a wave and I'd unlock. No issue. Everybody understood why. I wasn't a grumpy auld fella, by the way. I would have been only a year or two older than them myself at the time.

It's not discrimination. It's pain in the hole avoidance. And justified.

doublej

So a shopkeeper can refuse service to a group of travellers that are minors without repercussions from Equality or Pavee Point?

galljga1

doublej wrote: »

So a shopkeeper can refuse service to a group of travellers that are minors without repercussions from Equality or Pavee Point?

What if they are gay underage travellers and want a wedding cake?

doublej

I'm advised they lack the ability to contract, they can marry but you can't force them to pay

MaxFlower

galljga1 wrote: »

What if they are gay underage travellers and want a wedding cake?

What if they are gay black underage travelers and want a wedding cake?

Can I add 'I am not a racist but......'?

Seesee

If you say that minors lack the ability to contract then do Three have the right to refuse to discuss a child's mobile phone contract with the parent without the child first authorising it? Happened me this week with my 13 year old and I'm bit miffed as I'm paying for it. (Sorry to hijack OP)

MarkAnthony

Firstly the marriage of a minor renders them an adult IIRC and thus are able to enter into contracts. Brings me back to my first post on boards, but that's a different story and username :pac:

As for contracts the contract is voidable not void ab initio. (Open to correction). Either way Data Protection is another thing entirely.

Bear in mind the definition of necessary changes over time. Could a mobile be considered a necessity in 2015 - I'd argue probably

Victor

MarkAnthony wrote: »

Could a mobile be considered a necessity in 2015 - I'd argue probably

I think that would depend on age and the phone / cost, especially if the phone company adds and 18-month contract on to it.

Food would be a whole other matter.

Pro Hoc Vice

doublej wrote: »

So a shopkeeper can refuse service to a group of travellers that are minors without repercussions from Equality or Pavee Point?

No as long as it can be proved the refusal is due to membership of a social group not the age.

Carawaystick

doublej wrote: »

the other has an employee at the exit seeking the school kids proof of purchase receipts.

What does the employee do if the children have a receipt but refuse to show it to the employee?

Very close to false imprisonment there...

anvilfour

I must confess I actually did this when I was Assistant Manager of a store.

In our defence I have to say that the shop was very small and sold high value tech products e.g laptops, iPhones etc.

We had French kids who would visit from various schools for day trips in the Summer, they would come in groups of around a dozen, buy nothing and try to play games on the laptops, leaving oily fingerprints over the display cases and screens of everything they would touch. My staff were run ragged cleaning up after them also buying customers were finding it difficult to get around the shop - as I said, it was cramped!

Naturally we didn't mind people coming into browse but in the end we put a sign in the door saying that school groups weren't allowed in. The sign was in English and French and we would have applied this to British kids had they come swarming in, in the same way.

Around two days later, one of the school teachers came in, loudly demanding to speak to the Manager and since I was the only member of staff who could speak French and on duty I led her to a corner where she proceeded to accuse me of sexism, ageism, racism and pretty much everything else under the sun.

She seemed to have the impression that we were barring the kids because they were foreign, I explained on the contrary I am an avid Francophile, they just hung around getting in everyone's way, making a mess and didn't buy anything!

In the end we agreed that if the kids saw anything in the window they liked, then they could come in accompanied by a teacher and we'd happily sell it to them. Needless to say that never happened!

nuac

galljga1 wrote: »

What if they are gay underage travellers and want a wedding cake?

Be extra careful if they are all blind and black