Some newbie questions

PaulieC

New here - hello! Newish to adult cycling too...went on a work day out to Ballinastoe last November and had a blast so decided to buy an mtb on BTW scheme (because I was going to go at least once a week, I'm working about 2 miles away from Ticknock - been up there exactly 0 times). The bike is used now exclusively for commuting (~10k each way). A number of cyclists have told me I am mad riding that heavy yoke and I should get a road bike, something that I am not totally averse to.
I have a good aerobic fitness base from years of running, but currently not so much due to a persistent foot injury, so I am looking at cycling as a supplement to running in order to maintain fitness/weight. I did a 30-mile spin on Wednesday up around Howth head and found it most enjoyable, if not that speedy.

Was wondering:

Is the speed/performance difference between an mtb and a road bike somewhat quantifiable ? I know there are many variables, but if I got a road bike that weighed less that 10kg (mtb is about 17kg), how much will that benefit me (all other things being equal). Will 5-6kg really make that much difference when there is 75kg of me on top ?

Likewise for clipless pedals. I read that they are very helpful particularly when climbing. Again, is this quantifiable ?


Thanks in advance...

quozl

Weight of the bike won't make much of a difference unless you're commuting over the mountains. The much more aerodynamic position on a road-bike will make a fair difference though, and the faster you go the bigger the difference as air resistance increases with speed squared. You can also more easily engage the large glute muscles when you're more bent over in a road-bike style position.

I find it very noticable between my hybrid and my road-bike but it's probably only a few kph difference. Both have identical 28mm slick tyres and weight is pretty much identical. Difference is my position on the bike.

I don't really believe clipless pedals make that much of a difference to power personally, but I find them more comfortable and more relaxing. You don't have to worry about your feet coming off if you unexpectedly hit a bad surface.

PaulieC

quozl wrote: »

Weight of the bike won't make much of a difference unless you're commuting over the mountains.

Will it make a big difference in riding in the mountains for pleasure ? Commuting is one thing, but if I wanted to go out for a few hours up around the Dublin/Wicklow mountains, would I see big advantages ?

Qualitymark

quozl wrote: »

I find it very noticable between my hybrid and my road-bike but it's probably only a few kph difference. Both have identical 28mm slick tyres and weight is pretty much identical. Difference is my position on the bike.

How is your position on the bike different?

quozl

Qualitymark wrote: »

How is your position on the bike different?

Mountain bikes and hybrids tend to have shorter top-tubes for the bike size. Also even if you had the same top-tube and stem length then drop bars have the added reach to the hoods & the drops - ie the extra reach difference between when you hold the tops and when you hold the hoods.

So you're going to be more stretched out and therefore lower down on a road-bike than a hybrid or mountain bike.

iwillhtfu

The weight of the bike will almost always make a difference regardless of where you're cycling unless of your course you're doing downhill mtb.

It's more the make up of the bike that will make you travel faster though. Skinnier/smooth tyres etc.

MTB's are great for off road use but not so good for road use and btw 17kg is a seriously heavy mountain bike it must be made of cast iron.

To answer your question a road bike will make cycling on roads in wicklow/dublin more enjoyable but cycling off road in the same areas on the mtb can be equally if not more enjoyable.

PaulieC

iwillhtfu wrote: »

MTB's are great for off road use but not so good for road use and btw 17kg is a seriously heavy mountain bike it must be made of cast iron.

Specification
Frame: 6061 aluminium
Fork: Suntour XCM 29 100mm
Wheels: Shimano RM66 hubs, Mach 1 rims, Michelin XC Racer 2.1in tyres
Drivetrain: Shimano M931, Acera 9-speed shifters and f-mech, Deore Shadow r-mech
Brakes: Shimano M395
Weight: 14.43kg (31.81lb)
Sizes: M, L, XL
Size tested: M
Read more at http://www.mbr.co.uk/reviews/hardtail/lapierre-raid-329-review-2013#OWwoWYhyOHwrKlgI.99

It is definitely more than 14.43 kgs..

smacl

PaulieC wrote: »

Will it make a big difference in riding in the mountains for pleasure ? Commuting is one thing, but if I wanted to go out for a few hours up around the Dublin/Wicklow mountains, would I see big advantages ?

It definitely makes a big difference going from a heavy wide tyred MTB to a drop road bike, but the road bike may take a bit of getting used to and feel a bit weird starting out. Most people are quicker, but it took me a couple of months to get used to the road bike. Moving from a 14kg hybrid to a 10kg road bike I got about a 10%-15% speed increase over a long spin, much more comfort due primarily to being able change position, and a feeling of better stability when descending in the drops. Like Quozi, I find clipless also improve confidence descending over poor surfaces knowing your feet won't bounce out of the pedals, more than any power improvement.

tp25

clipless will give you an advantage if you are in the forest and you are climbing with your body weight on the front, often you won't be able to climb on pedals as you will slip while with spd you can make sure you are attached to the bike.
Also with spd you can learn way easier how to jump over obstacles and I feel that your balance of power which you put into the pedaling is balanced more evenly.

iwillhtfu

I wouldn't get to caught up on the weight anyway as you pointed out yourself there's 75kgs you're bringing to the equation which isn't a bad thing either. It almost always comes down to power/weight ratio. Some stronger lads will push a heavier bike/rider weight than weaker lads will a lighter package if you get me.

In any case if you're commuting on that raid a decent spec hybrid would be a big step up in comparison and a road bike would be a further step up but a different riding style. A hybrid you can abuse on kerbs pot holes etc a road bike or more so it's tyres tend to be more delicate.

Although there are exceptions

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BM0oQIRIyrs

tp25

PaulieC wrote: »

Specification
Frame: 6061 aluminium
Fork: Suntour XCM 29 100mm
Wheels: Shimano RM66 hubs, Mach 1 rims, Michelin XC Racer 2.1in tyres
Drivetrain: Shimano M931, Acera 9-speed shifters and f-mech, Deore Shadow r-mech
Brakes: Shimano M395
Weight: 14.43kg (31.81lb)
Sizes: M, L, XL
Size tested: M
Read more at http://www.mbr.co.uk/reviews/hardtail/lapierre-raid-329-review-2013#OWwoWYhyOHwrKlgI.99

It is definitely more than 14.43 kgs..

why not get some bike from adverts with a higher spec? i.e. ragley?

Jakey Rolling

PaulieC wrote: »

New here - hello! Newish to adult cycling too...went on a work day out to Ballinastoe last November and had a blast so decided to buy an mtb on BTW scheme (because I was going to go at least once a week, I'm working about 2 miles away from Ticknock - been up there exactly 0 times). The bike is used now exclusively for commuting (~10k each way). A number of cyclists have told me I am mad riding that heavy yoke and I should get a road bike, something that I am not totally averse to.
I have a good aerobic fitness base from years of running, but currently not so much due to a persistent foot injury, so I am looking at cycling as a supplement to running in order to maintain fitness/weight. I did a 30-mile spin on Wednesday up around Howth head and found it most enjoyable, if not that speedy.

Was wondering:

Is the speed/performance difference between an mtb and a road bike somewhat quantifiable ? I know there are many variables, but if I got a road bike that weighed less that 10kg (mtb is about 17kg), how much will that benefit me (all other things being equal). Will 5-6kg really make that much difference when there is 75kg of me on top ?

Likewise for clipless pedals. I read that they are very helpful particularly when climbing. Again, is this quantifiable ?


Thanks in advance...

You might want to try slick road tyres on the MTB. I have used Continental Travel Contact 1.75" on mine for years and can match my road bike for speed on some descents. Typical average speed on a longer spin is 25kph vs. 30kph on my road bike. As others have said part of this is down to better aerodynamics on the road bike.

I also like to use my Zefal half toe clips as a half way house between platforms and clipless.They just cover the front of the toes, don't have straps but stop your feet slipping off on unexpected bumps. Great for around town if you want to wear regular shoes/runners.

PaulieC

tp25 wrote: »

why not get some bike from adverts with a higher spec? i.e. ragley?

I would prefer to have a bike that is suitable for the use it gets the majority of the time. If I'm commuting more than anything else, I think a road bike (of some description) would be more suitable ? Can always hire an mtb should the situation arise...

tp25

PaulieC wrote: »

I would prefer to have a bike that is suitable for the use it gets the majority of the time. If I'm commuting more than anything else, I think a road bike (of some description) would be more suitable ? Can always hire an mtb should the situation arise...

you have a couple of options:

1) commuting: road bike + fenders (permanently attached), you won't be able to go off road with that but will serve you well while commuting
2) light mtb with good equipment at least SLX or higher: i.e. deore xt with front lockable shock absorber (120mm or 150mm for fun when you are off road) + a set of different wheels (road tyres) for cummuting, bear in mind the rear cassette to have the same number of gears on both sets of wheels
3) cx bike (heavier than road bike but you are able to go on gravel with bit of fun)
4) i'm not a fan of hybrids so I won't comment here
5) as a 2nd bike a full suspension bike for weekends

hire is an option but if you feel a rush to go off road trip to a hire place may extinguish your temptation.

can you afford two bikes? road (mon-fri) and mtb (weekends)?

how far is your commute?

PaulieC

tp25 wrote: »

you have a couple of options:

1) road bike + fenders (permanently attached), you won't be able to go off road with that but will serve you well while commuting
2) light mtb with good equipment at least SLX or higher: i.e. deore xt with front lockable shock absorber (120mm or 150mm for fun when you are off road) + a set of different wheels (road tyres) for cummuting, bear in mind the rear cassette to have the same number of gears on both sets of wheels
3) cx bike (heavier than road bike but you are able to go on gravel with bit of fun)
4) i'm not a fan of hybrids so I won't comment here

hire is an option but if you feel a rush to go off road trip to a hire place may extinguish your temptation.

can you afford two bikes? road (mon-fri) and mtb (weekends)?

how far is your commute?

Thanks for that. A CX bike sounds interesting. I guess I can afford two bikes financially (the most difficult part there is explaining to the Mrs. why I need two bikes), but I'd need to have a good look at storage space. I have a shed, but it's pretty small and has 3 bikes in already. The back yard isn't big enough for another shed.

Commute is 10km each way. It's fine at the moment (I do need a better front mudguard solution) and I have "slick" tyres on already (though they are 2.2" wide, so definitely not slim).

tp25

PaulieC wrote: »

Thanks for that. A CX bike sounds interesting. I guess I can afford two bikes financially (the most difficult part there is explaining to the Mrs. why I need two bikes), but I'd need to have a good look at storage space. I have a shed, but it's pretty small and has 3 bikes in already. The back yard isn't big enough for another shed.

Commute is 10km each way. It's fine at the moment (I do need a better front mudguard solution) and I have "slick" tyres on already (though they are 2.2" wide, so definitely not slim).

maybe try sell current bike if you are not 100% happy with it.
purchase a winter ready commuting bike (with mudguards front and back) to be reliable and keep you happy on a daily basis.

start looking for a weekend off road fun bike.

if you attach any metal bar between the walls of the shed, just at the height of the roof of the shed you will be able to hang your new bike(s) by the saddle without any disruption to your current bikes.

2.2 is bit fatty no matter how slick they are, comfy tire to ride that's a plus.
selling a bike will give you opportunity to purchase new one and there is a chance you gonna love it more than the old one.

later if you can try to get a set of dedicated mudguards (to fit your tyre size without rubbing and rattle) on your new bike.

I recommend to buy second hand bike and do with a proper service (not necessarily in the shop but find a guy who know what he is doing, and give him your few new parts (brake shoes, tyres and tubes you gonna love) plus adjustments to the derailleur and then the bike should be like new or better.

I just say my opinion, you might be happy with something else. Make sure you get your frame size right. Remember smaller frame will give you more control and more fun.

what's your current bike? 17kg's that's massive