Landlords biased against families with children?

lilmissprincess

I live with my partner and our 17 month old son. Thanks to worsening circumstances with our current landlord we have to leave our 2 bedroom apartment in Cork city in the next two weeks. We had gotten to the stage where a deposit had been handed over for a house and were all set to move in when the landlord changed her mind and said we weren't what she was looking for (despite looking for a family). My trawling of Daft and endless phonecalls and meetings with letting agents has had a resounding theme - landlords don't want you if you're a student (grand, we're not), unemployed (both permanent full time employees of good companies for considerable amounts of time), have pets (we don't have any) or have kids (this is the kicker with us). Unfortunately we can't exactly give the kid his marching orders and tell him its time to head into the big bad world, so in two weeks time we're facing being out on the streets with him. From what I've been told its not legal to discriminate on family status, but I didn't realise this would be such an issue. Cork has never been so bad for rental accommodation, we're paying above the odds and it still isn't enough. We don't drive, so the properties further out and not on bus routes don't work for us.

Has anyone else had this experience? Is there a way to go up against it or are we doomed thanks to our Peppa-loving friend? Thanks

pwurple

Hi, I rent in Cork, and the problem is not the children, it's the bloody neighbours. I rented to a family before, and they were perfectly lovely, but the feckin neighbours drove me completely nuts complaining that the baby woke early in the morning (big woop I know!) or that the child bounced a ball on the floor. Honestly, I couldn't be dealing with phone calls from neighbours anymore, so I don't rent to families in an apartment anymore.

It might be time to bite the suburbia bullet and go for a semi-d on a bus route. Have you tried Douglas, Wilton, Beaumont, togher etc?

Wanderer78

tough one but i think it maybe time for a car when you get your accommodation situation sorted. would make your life a lot easier. best of luck with it op

Not driving is a massive disadvantage in this day and age really one of you at least should learn to drive.

Wanderer78

Skyler Hallowed Vehicle wrote: »

Not driving is a massive disadvantage in this day and age really one of you at leat should learn to drive.

id recommend both learn to drive. would make a massive improvement for your options as a family not just for accommodation but for other aspects of your lives

newacc2015

I know from neighbours letting their house to families twice. Both times they had negative experiences with the children eg crayons on walls, damaged wood work from children. Things parents wouldnt notice over time, but a landlord on inspection would

Maybe offer 10-20% above the list price to sweeten the landlord?

poker--addict

I had 18 months of silence. A family just moved in upstairs. 3 weeks of pounding/heavy footsteps or running anytime from 7am until 9pm. I work shift work and need to sleep during the day. I can understand why people get upset. I would not pay over and above though just to get around a landlord

newacc2015

How? Management companies charge owners extra for having dogs in their Apartment blocks in NYC for the extra cleaning and wear & tear on the property.If you are a landlord and have the choice between a single professional, who will rarely be there. Or a couple with a baby that could case damage. Which one do you pick? The single professional.

toadfly

To be honest OP I don't blame the landlord. We were talking about renting our house out lately and if we did I wouldn't rent to a family with kids. I'd have dogs over kids. Might seem harsh but we have just painted the whole house as all the walls were ruined from stickers and kids writing on them. Not a hope I would put that expense on myself again.

jaymcg91

Agreed - when we moved into ours, all the f***king stickers that refuse to come off the walls and windows - nightmare.

I think people forget that when they rent that it's not actually their house. Treat your own house as you wish, but be respectful when you're renting.

MarkAnthony

We really need long term unfurnished lets to be encouraged by tax breaks, and proper tax breaks not Cap gains as proposed. That way as a LL you wouldn't care if it was a kid/dog/wombat the lessee hands back the place freshly painted and cleaned out.

As it is we're all trying to protect €200 of sofa and a half arsed paint job done as a nixer by Jimmy down the road. Lose, lose for everyone.

Lia_lia

I know what it's like in Cork OP, there is feck all! Took me 5 months to find place a year and a half ago, however I hear it's a lot worse now. Prices on Daft are gone up a good bit. Luckily our landlady never raised our rent as she likes us as tenants. I've a feeling she will next year though.

Anyway. It might be worth checking out places on train routes also (Cobh, Midleton etc). I have colleagues with young families that get a train and bus into work. Not ideal but they do it! Much cheaper rent for bigger houses. May not suit with work though..

It may also be a case of just waiting longer to see if anything pops up, however this is probably not an option if ye must be out of the current place in two weeks. The fact that it is college time may also be why it's hard to find places. Although it's generally a different market..

Wanderer78 wrote: »

id recommend both learn to drive. would make a massive improvement for your options as a family not just for accommodation but for other aspects of your lives

This is very true. However, if neither of you can drive it will take a while and a lot of money. Theory test, 12 lessons, driving test, licenses, car, insurance, tax etc etc costs a bomb and takes at the very least 6 months. But worth getting started on learning to drive. I have just bought a car recently and I'm doing my test soon enough. Don't need one at all, just wanted to learn and may need one in the future.

I don't have kids so don't have any advice in relation to that! Best of luck though.

MouseTail

When you say you have to leave due to worsening circumstances with your LL, does that mean you don't have a reference? Could the place you have lined up have pulled out after speaking to your LL? That may be your issue rather that your child.

pwurple

Is your work located in the city center or are you currently bussing to that?

Cork is fairly well served by public transport and is so compact that a couple of bikes might be an option too.

orthsquel

Op I read this last night only had a chance now to reply.
I don't know about the situation tbh but specific places that would be family-friendly to rent in might be places like Maryborough Woods (there's an ad up this morning on daft for a 2 bed house) in Douglas, which as far as I remember is quite a mixture of various styles and sizes. Also Mount Oval in Rochestown (by Garryduff), which is near Marborough Woods, both have bus services. Grange/Frankfield has several big housing estates, as does Donnybrook also on bus routes. Also try Pembroke Wood in Passage West, also very family friendly area and estate but with a mixture of different types of houses and sizes. Would be worth trying Carrigaline and Ballincollig, both have bus services and housing estates.

I agree with the suggestion of Cobh and getting the train in. It may be worth considering anywhere on the train line, even Midleton.

I think anything around near vicinity of UCC/CIT/CUH i.e. Wilton/Bishopstown back towards the city general areas would be either students or professionals or house shares in general, and I think anywhere that young professionals are hearded to like Jacob's Island (Ballinure) wouldn't be really ideal as you'd really need a car for that specific area.

pwurple

Jacob's Island is served by the 219 bus to Mahon I think?

ted1

newacc2015 wrote: »

How? Management companies charge owners extra for having dogs in their Apartment blocks in NYC for the extra cleaning and wear & tear on the property.If you are a landlord and have the choice between a single professional, who will rarely be there. Or a couple with a baby that could case damage. Which one do you pick? The single professional.

Dogs dint bing in apartments, they need at the very least a good sized garden

orthsquel

pwurple wrote: »

Jacob's Island is served by the 219 bus to Mahon I think?

True but that is only a Mon-Fri service (and a very long service, grand if you wanted to get to Douglas but a very indirect route to city centre). Even in the updated timetable from Monday it's Mon-Fri and will only stop outside RCI. The 215 (Blarney - city centre - Mahon Point) route is a better route with full service (i.e. incl weekends), EDIT: I actually drove down this way today to see how far the 215 bus route does go, it looks like it does go right down to the gates of the Jacob's Island apartments (the ones you see from everywhere) and then turns around - which makes sense - back towards Mahon Point direction, although I couldn't be sure of that for certain. I did have a look around the area, as far as I could go that is, other than the big apartments there's a second gated apartment complex/duplex houses that you see from the road going into Jacob's Island before the roundabout (Haven I think it's called) and there's numerous houses in between, and new ones being built. All very large ones though. I didn't go through the estate entirely as there were quite a number of small kids playing so was a bit mindful of that. Seems to be a bit of green space and of course you have access to the walk... although if you were looking for maybe a central playground for everyone I didn't see one (although there could be one) and if needed a creche, I didn't see any signs for one (although there could be one), if either of those would be something you might want to have, without having to take a bus or without driving.

pwurple

pwurple wrote: »

I rented to a family before, and they were perfectly lovely, but the feckin neighbours drove me completely nuts complaining that the baby woke early in the morning (big woop I know!) or that the child bounced a ball on the floor.

Another illustration that many apartments in Ireland, because of size and poor standards of construction and insulation, are simply not fit for long term living.

borderlinemeath

ted1 wrote: »

Dogs dint bing in apartments, they need at the very least a good sized garden

Because Manhattan is full of decent sized gardens :rolleyes:
A dog doesn't actually need a decent sized garden, that observation suggests an owner who either doesn't want to walk the dog, or doesn't want to let the dog in to be with their family - so why have a dog?
Dogs can fare brilliantly in apartments, some breeds suit far better than others, you wouldn't keep a collie or a beagle or a springer spaniel in an apartment, but greyhounds, whippets, bulldogs, and pretty much all toy dogs and plenty of other breeds fare brilliantly in apartments. The problem with Irish apartments is the poor soundproofing, management company rules and lack of outdoor facilities for dogs in certain built up areas. Plenty of businesses have been set up for dog walking, dog day care and dog socialisation classes to help people who live in built up areas become responsible pet owners.

OP, I would agree, many landlords don't want children because of the degredation that parents tend to see as regular "wear and tear" My husband is in the process of reletting a house in Dublin that had a family for 3 years and every stick of furniture had to be thrown in a skip, and a new kitchen installed because they obviously swung out of the doors. I can't comment on the Cork area as I don't know it at all, sorry.

borderlinemeath

borderlinemeath wrote: »

or doesn't want to let the dog in to be with their family - so why have a dog?

This is total nonsense. Loads of people have very happy outdoor dogs who never set foot inside the house from the day they are born. People with them outside and the dog has space to play when people are away. They then have a shed or kennel to shelter in obviously rather than being inside covering furniture in hair and dog smell. I think its cruel to keep a dog inside a house or apartment all day in fact they should be outside running around and playing.

borderlinemeath

Langston Bald Topic wrote: »

This is total nonsense. Loads of people have very happy outdoor dogs who never set foot inside the house from the day they are born. People with them outside and the dog has space to play when people are away. They then have a shed or kennel to shelter in obviously. Outside is the place for dogs in most cases (some dogs just cant be outside due to coat but most can) imo not stuck in an apartment or house covering it in hair and putting a smell of dog everywhere.

Nox001, we got into this in far finer detail on a different thread, your opinion is your opinion but some of your ideology on keeping pets is absolutely wrong, and has been proven by behaviourists and science and I called you out on it over on AH. I'm not getting into it on this thread as it's not the issue, but it was a point that I had to reply to, given my experience.

athtrasna

Mod note:

Take it to pm please guys. Thanks

pwurple

Deleted User wrote: »

Another illustration that many apartments in Ireland, because of size and poor standards of construction and insulation, are simply not fit for long term living.

Bizaarly, the same neighbour didn't complain about the DJ that lived there previously, who was coming home from work at about 4am, often with a bu ch of friends.

The apt is actually pretty well insulated, it's one of the criteria I was looking for when I bought it. I lived in it myself and didn't hear a thing from neighbours. (although I know the vast majority are not soundproof)

lilmissprincess

We found a place that didn't mind about the kids, a gated apartment complex with a communal garden and quite a few other young families as well - it's not the kind of place I was looking for when we started our hunt, but getting rid of our landlord and our letting agent who had strange practices at the best of times (I've seen her mentioned on here a few times) was the important part - as well as finding somewhere that would be big enough to host half of Smyths and a toddler who likes to run around.

I understand that with renting somewhere there is always the risk of the tenant leaving the place in a state - my dad is a contractor who deals with the aftermath for landlords, so I've seen (and helped clean up) the mess that can be left behind so I get that they're not willing to take the risk. However, something does need to be done to make sure that genuine good tenants who have a child, who will ensure the place is given back as it was received, are able to find a place. Fingers crossed that this place has us sorted until we are ready to buy.

On the driving thing, unfortunately I've got a back injury which is holding things up in that regard, thankfully the place we got is within a reasonable walking distance of both the city and Douglas.

Thanks for all the suggestions.

H3llR4iser

pwurple wrote: »

Bizaarly, the same neighbour didn't complain about the DJ that lived there previously, who was coming home from work at about 4am, often with a bu ch of friends.

The apt is actually pretty well insulated, it's one of the criteria I was looking for when I bought it. I lived in it myself and didn't hear a thing from neighbours. (although I know the vast majority are not soundproof)

I think it can be a bit hit and miss; Some people are extremely anal about noises, usually the people who never lived in apartments and are used to the (relative) quietness of an house. Others on the other hand, lived all their lives in apartments and have a natural ability to block out disturbance.

That said, noises on different wavelengths travel differently - it's entirely possible that the DJ and his friends weren't heard, and the kids are. One extremely odd and funny story I have has to do with the upstairs neighbour in the apartment I lived in until two years ago: he would be home, watching TV, having friends over, having his girlfriend spend the night and you wouldn't hear a thing. If he went to the toilette, however, I could hear him pee as if he was in my own toilette with the door open!

Somehow the voices of 4-5 people, music, TV audio, videogames and whatnot didn't travel through the floor, but the sound of a tiny stream of water hitting standing water did .

jlm29

lilmissprincess wrote: »

but getting rid of our landlord and our letting agent who had strange practices at the best of times

I had a bit of a giggle at this- it's all right for me, I know, I never have to see said letting agent again. It's almost 6 years I think since I was looking for accommodation in cork. It just baffles me that this woman is still on the go!!! How does she do it!