Running costs, are we so bad ?

oleras

Since this topic seemed to have derailed the other thread, lets start a dedicated one, so we don't go off topic.

Can anyone give a comparison between us and the other EU countries wrt running costs on a 2.5L petrol turbo 6 cyl doing the daily grind ?

Tables would be fab.

Boskowski

Cheaper in Germany anyway as both tax and insurance are considerably less. Petrol probably a bit dearer.

oleras

Boskowski wrote: »

Cheaper in Germany anyway as both tax and insurance are considerably less. Petrol probably a bit dearer.

Whats the annual tax on a 2.5l petrol in Germany ?

Insurance for say a 35 year old ?

CiniO

Hard to compare if we don't know exact make and model.
But f.e. Ireland vs Poland.
(assume average mileage 15k per annum and average fuel consumption 10l/100km (28MPG) and owner in 30s with full NCB and car about 10 years old)

Ireland
Tax - €1080
Insurance - €1200
Fuel - €2100 (assuming petrol at €1.40)
Servicing/repairs - €1000
NCT - €55
Total per annum: €5345

Poland
Tax - €0
Insurance - €130
Fuel - €1605 (assuming petrol at €1.07) or
Fuel LPG - €756 (assuming LPG at €0.42 and 20% higher consumption)
Servicing/repairs - €400
NCT - €25
Total per annum: €2160 (on petrol) or €1311 (on LPG)

IMO that's a fair comparision of running costs.

Brasso

oleras wrote: »

Whats the annual tax on a 2.5l petrol in Germany ?

Insurance for say a 35 year old ?

In Germany it goes by CO2 since 2009, same as here. But for an older engine it's done on cc and which euro emissions band it is in, eg. Euro I or Euro IV. From what I could find the rate for a euro IV petrol engine is €6.75 so for a 2500cc engine that would be multiplied by 25 giving you annual tax of €168.75. A saving of €911 over the Irish rate, plus the fact that since €1080 is such a significant amount of money you might not be able to afford it all at once and would have to opt for the more costly option of quarterly payments. I have no idea about insurance.

Boskowski

I can't say for everything but I'm driving a 2.5l petrol 6 cylinder. Costs me €1080 to tax here. In Germany it would cost me €184. I looked it up.
Insurance anything between €300 and €400 for 3rd party. Just did an online quote.

That sucks. Ah well I didn't come here for the great motoring experience I guess :pac:.

BMJD

Feels good knowing that we are saving the planet though, doesn't it?

cletus

@Cinio: What would the average industrial wage in Poland be?

listermint

BMJD wrote: »

Feels good knowing that we are saving the planet though, doesn't it?

It's the insurance this year that has to be noted as incredible. Not sure that has anything to do with planet saving.

It appears to be just going up and up across the board unchecked.

And this whole not accepting older cars how does that fly on the Continent. I'd imagine it doesn't been in the likes of France etc all you see is older vehicles on the road.

How is it they are getting away with this registration shaming over here.

cormie

CiniO wrote: »

Hard to compare if we don't know exact make and model.
But f.e. Ireland vs Poland.
(assume average mileage 15k per annum and average fuel consumption 10l/100km (28MPG) and owner in 30s with full NCB and car about 10 years old)

Ireland
Tax - €1080
Insurance - €1200
Fuel - €2100 (assuming petrol at €1.40)
Servicing/repairs - €1000
NCT - €55
Total per annum: €5345

Poland
Tax - €0
Insurance - €130
Fuel - €1605 (assuming petrol at €1.07) or
Fuel LPG - €756 (assuming LPG at €0.42 and 20% higher consumption)
Servicing/repairs - €400
NCT - €25
Total per annum: €2160 (on petrol) or €1311 (on LPG)

IMO that's a fair comparision of running costs.

Wow, how is insurance so cheap in Poland? Going by the Polish dash cam videos I've seen you've just as many crazy drivers, but maybe not such a prominent claim culture?

cletus wrote: »

@Cinio: What would the average industrial wage in Poland be?

I think it's about €400 a month.

jimgoose

cletus wrote: »

@Cinio: What would the average industrial wage in Poland be?

Here's a useful Wikipedia article. According to Eurostat in 2014, the average monthly net income in Poland was €635, but Germany was much like ourselves at €2,315 and €2,284 respectively. Interestingly, the UK is coming in fairly high at €2,810. That'll be all the bowler-hatted types in That Loondon pulling up the average, no doubt:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_average_wage

cormie

Ah maybe I was told the figure for minimum wage was around €400 a month!

nd

monthly average income in Ukraine is €132

colm_c

We also have to compare not only average wages, also taxes (direct/indirect) but also people density.

If there are more people using the same space, then there is more opportunity to spread taxes.

Germany: 609 people per sq mile
Poland: 328 people per sq mile
Ireland: 153 people per sq mile

Source: http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0934666.html

Don't get me wrong, the motor tax here is high for CC, but we also have to remember the cars are going to be cheaper because of it.

2004 German 525i (11k)
http://suchen.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/details.html?id=191439020

2004 Irish 525i (4k)
http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/bmw-525i-automatic-new-nct-low-mileage/10239335?offset=12

Now obviously there are differences in the cars themselves, but that's a fair chunk in price difference regardless.

So I don't think it's fair to compare motor tax rates without all other factors.

CiniO

cormie wrote: »

Wow, how is insurance so cheap in Poland? Going by the Polish dash cam videos I've seen you've just as many crazy drivers, but maybe not such a prominent claim culture?

Indeed insurance cost is significently cheaper than here, even if you accout for average salary, it still comes much cheaper in most cases.
Reason for that - probably as you say - much less money being claimed, and no big money being paid for small injuries like in Ireland.
Also fact that compliance is very high (vast majority of cars are insured compared to Ireland where 6% are uninsured) surely puts the price down.
And system is much simpler with not too many factors affecting premium price and cover being valid in nearly all cases.
However prices quoted were for third party only. Fact is that usually additions in Ireland are not expensive (f.e. tpft for 900, full comprehensive for 1000 so only 11% more) but in Poland you can get third party for 100 but full comp for 250 (so 150% more)