Broadband too fast?

Irish Steve

OK, this is going to sound strange, but I am beginning to think my broadband is too fast, and it's causing the machine I'm using to have problems.

What I think is happening is that I decide I want to go to a specific page, and hit the return key, and on quite a few occasions, I don't get a response for quite some time, to the extent that if I hit stop, and refresh, I get the page back almost instantly. It's very noticeable if I do a google search.

The broadband here is Fibre, 80+ Mb, and my ping is sub 10 Ms, usually around 6 or 7, I'm working over Gigabit Ethernet and the machine is an Acer E521, which has an AMD A6 processor, quad core, and there's 6 Gb of memory in the machine, a 1Tb disc, and it's cleaned up regularly, and defragmented. The OS is Win 8.1 with all updates applied.

I have Bit defender anti Virus and screening software running, most of the time, I'm using Firefox browser.

I've tried using different DNS servers, the IP, Google and OpenDns, as well as another that was suggested as being fast, but it's making no noticeable difference

My suspicion is that the first response from the remote server is coming back faster than the machine here is turning round, so it's missing it, and then going into a timeout wait loop, but there's so little real diagnostic information available with Win8, it's hard to be sure.

So, is anyone else seeing issues like this, or aware of a setting option that might make a difference to this.

damienirel

Broadband too fast - you are joking right?

What are you doing on the remote server? Have you tried pinging it(ip address)to see the response times? Maybe you're being routed through some other networks in that case try a tracert if you're on windows - it's all a bit vague until I know what you're connecting to and what you're doing i.e browsing - ftping etc.

Irish Steve

basic browsing, nothing special, no FTP or similar, the machine is basically being used for mail (thunderbird) and browsing, with searches usually routed via Google search, which is particularly problematic with this issue, but I also see it on places like Maplin.co.uk, select a specific product for more details and it goes into a wait state, if I stop the load, and refresh, most times, it's back almost instantly, but if I leave it, the delay is significant, which makes me think an early packet got lost, the rest arrived, and the refresh gets it the next time, and the rest are already cached.

ED E

The odd time I get it in chrome where a certain tab will get stuck on a pageload for ~10s. Always chalked it up to ****ty JS.

If you're right, wireshark will show the HTTP responses (if the site isnt HTTPS).

beauf

I would suspect the page is loading something else like an ad or a referral ad etc, or maybe some page animation, graphic, and you're killing that process when you hit stop, and it just renders the basic page without that stuff. I would check the ad blockers are working. Maybe even use a different browser as a test with all scripts, ads, blocked.

mass_debater

Get an adblock add-on and make sure you have no toolbars installed

Irish Steve

beauf wrote: »

I would suspect the page is loading something else like an ad or a referral ad etc, or maybe some page animation, graphic, and you're killing that process when you hit stop, and it just renders the basic page without that stuff. I would check the ad blockers are working. Maybe even use a different browser as a test with all scripts, ads, blocked.

Valid thought, I have adblock running, so it might be something to do with that, but if it is, there's no immediate evidence of it.

ItHurtsWhenIP

I get this occasionally with Firefox and I'm on a 3Mbps/1Mbps Fixed Wireless. It happens once or twice a day with different websites. I'm so used to it I just hit stop and refresh without a second thought.

I think ED_E hit the nail on the head with crappy JS.

p.s. - I nearly crapped my pants at the thread title!!! :P

Irish Steve

MMFITWGDV wrote: »

I get this occasionally with Firefox and I'm on a 3Mbps/1Mbps Fixed Wireless. It happens once or twice a day with different websites. I'm so used to it I just hit stop and refresh without a second thought.

I think ED_E hit the nail on the head with crappy JS.

p.s. - I nearly crapped my pants at the thread title!!! :P

That's what's making me think turn round speeds, I'm getting regular nearly 90Mb, with 6ms pings, and 18 Mb Upload speeds, and even something like a simple google search (something like "A380 baggage bin size"), with Google DNS resolution, will fail first time probably 30% of the time.

I shall have to see if I can find the IP time out setting, and play with it to see if it makes any difference.

mass_debater

Irish Steve wrote: »

That's what's making me think turn round speeds, I'm getting regular nearly 90Mb, with 6ms pings, and 18 Mb Upload speeds, and even something like a simple google search (something like "A380 baggage bin size"), with Google DNS resolution, will fail first time probably 30% of the time.

I shall have to see if I can find the IP time out setting, and play with it to see if it makes any difference.

Get a better router that caches DNS, makes pages you regularly visit resolve instantly. Why are you using Google DNS, use your providers, they are local in their network and will respond much quicker

Irish Steve

mass_debater wrote: »

Get a better router that caches DNS, makes pages you regularly visit resolve instantly. Why are you using Google DNS, use your providers, they are local in their network and will respond much quicker

Using Google DNS as it seems to resolve faster, and be more responsive, I may have a problem changing routers, as I don't have full unrestricted access to the settings on the existing Huwaei router that is connected to the fibre link, and the provider doesn't use a common setting for all users on their network.

mass_debater

Irish Steve wrote: »

Using Google DNS as it seems to resolve faster, and be more responsive, I may have a problem changing routers, as I don't have full unrestricted access to the settings on the existing Huwaei router that is connected to the fibre link, and the provider doesn't use a common setting for all users on their network.

Bridge it and add a better router, it'll do wonders for your response times

Irish Steve

Not even sure I can bridge it, due to the lockdown from the supplier. I will have a chat with the tech support at the ISP (Imagine) and see what they have to say, they were reasonable with some issues a while back, so I might get some useful mileage out of that.

Any suggestions of a reasonable router that won't break the bank?

mass_debater

Irish Steve wrote: »

Not even sure I can bridge it, due to the lockdown from the supplier. I will have a chat with the tech support at the ISP (Imagine) and see what they have to say, they were reasonable with some issues a while back, so I might get some useful mileage out of that.

Any suggestions of a reasonable router that won't break the bank?

All you need is to get the PPPoE login details then either flash a stock firmware on it or get another providers modem and bridge that.

Archer C7, 8 or 9. Check out this thread
http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057367191/26/

jimmycrackcorm

Open the dev tools on the browser (F12) and check the network stats. It'll tell you what is being delayed during the page cycle

Irish Steve

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Open the dev tools on the browser (F12) and check the network stats. It'll tell you what is being delayed during the page cycle

Perfect, thanks for that, it will indeed give me exactly the information I'm looking for, and hopefully help with tracking down what's happening.

damienirel

Irish Steve wrote: »

Valid thought, I have adblock running, so it might be something to do with that, but if it is, there's no immediate evidence of it.

Dodgy JavaScript will effect everybody - so even if it was that - everybody doing google searches would be complaining so that's also ruled out.
No need to do debug the response times either, unless you want to go off and become a web developer I would suggest you don't waste your time.

I'm sure as you gathered from other posters, there is no such thing as "internet too fast" - if a packet is lost for whatever reason, the client requests it get re-transmitted. There is no "magic"synchronization between your pc and the webserver.
I don't see why you'd need to mess with your dns servers or your router if it works at all, it's more than likely 100% perfect. And using googles dns apart from being a bit daft will not make a noticeable difference. So I suggest you go back to the isps dns like a previous poster mentioned.

Let's cut to the chase here -
Based on your anecdotal evidence there's every chance you've got malware on your PC. My advice to you is install something like malwarebytes do a full scan and see what it throws up.

That is my 2 cents worth.

Irish Steve

damienirel wrote: »

Dodgy JavaScript will effect everybody - so even if it was that - everybody doing google searches would be complaining so that's also ruled out.
No need to do debug the response times either, unless you want to go off and become a web developer I would suggest you don't waste your time.

I'm sure as you gathered from other posters, there is no such thing as "internet too fast" - if a packet is lost for whatever reason, the client requests it get re-transmitted. There is no "magic"synchronization between your pc and the webserver.
I don't see why you'd need to mess with your dns servers or your router if it works at all, it's more than likely 100% perfect. And using googles dns apart from being a bit daft will not make a noticeable difference. So I suggest you go back to the isps dns like a previous poster mentioned.

Let's cut to the chase here -
Based on your anecdotal evidence there's every chance you've got malware on your PC. My advice to you is install something like malwarebytes do a full scan and see what it throws up.

That. is my 2 cents worth.

Sorry to disappoint you, but I am VERY sure that there is NO malware on the machine, or if there is, it's not being found by either bitdefender, or Malwarebytes, as they are both in use, one full time and one on a regular scan basis.

This is very much an issue of packet loss on the early stage of the response from the remote server, my original suspicion was that it was a DNS resolution issue, but using alternate DNS servers has made it fairly clear that the DNS is not the issue, and if I leave it long enough, it will force a resend, and then it completes correctly, but with a timeout of about 30 seconds, that gets tedious.

mass_debater

Irish Steve wrote: »

Sorry to disappoint you, but I am VERY sure that there is NO malware on the machine, or if there is, it's not being found by either bitdefender, or Malwarebytes, as they are both in use, one full time and one on a regular scan basis.

This is very much an issue of packet loss on the early stage of the response from the remote server, my original suspicion was that it was a DNS resolution issue, but using alternate DNS servers has made it fairly clear that the DNS is not the issue, and if I leave it long enough, it will force a resend, and then it completes correctly, but with a timeout of about 30 seconds, that gets tedious.

Sounds exactly like a toolbar

damienirel

Not disappointed - but interested.
Try this. Could be just a stale dns mapping cached.
https://www.whatsmydns.net/flush-dns.html

Irish Steve

Might be, there's no much beyond standard Firefox running, to try and keep it fast. I haven't tried IE recently to see if the same is happening there, I got out of the habit of using IE because of old hardware and out of date browser that couldn't be upgraded to a safe level, but this machine has 8.1, so should be reasonably safe with appropriate care, I'll give that a go and see what happens with it.

Worth a try at least,

Thanks for the thought.

Irish Steve

damienirel wrote: »

Not disappointed - but interested.
Try this. Could be just a stale dns mapping cached.
https://www.whatsmydns.net/flush-dns.html

DNS cache gets cleaned out regularly as part of a general clean up with CCleaner, seems not to make much difference to this issue, though it does help to keep the browser cache small and fast.

damienirel

Okay - next step is back up your bookmarks and uninstall firefox - afterwards run ccleaner to be sure all files get deleted including the registry clean and reinstall firefox.

Irish Steve

damienirel wrote: »

Okay - next step is back up your bookmarks and uninstall firefox - afterwards run ccleaner to be sure all files get deleted including the registry clean and reinstall firefox.

Been thinking the same, will need to plan that, as I have some other work that needs to be done first. Will let you know what comes out of the woodwork. In theory, not much, as this machine is relatively new, and hasn't had much work to do yet.

Johnboy1951

Have you considered running a Live Linux on that machine to see if it has any problems?

If not it would definitely point to a operating system problem.

Irish Steve

I have an old XP Dual Core laptop with a decent HDD and 4 Gb of memory that would make a very good Linux machine, it's been under consideration for a while. Too many other issues right now, but definitely being considered, given some of the ongoing pain of Windows support and stability.

mass_debater

Irish Steve wrote: »

I have an old XP Dual Core laptop with a decent HDD and 4 Gb of memory that would make a very good Linux machine, it's been under consideration for a while. Too many other issues right now, but definitely being considered, given some of the ongoing pain of Windows support and stability.

What he means us boot a Linux distro from DVD to see if there are any hardware issues, you can boot Linux without installing or affecting the existing setup of the machine

Irish Steve

mass_debater wrote: »

What he means us boot a Linux distro from DVD to see if there are any hardware issues, you can boot Linux without installing or affecting the existing setup of the machine

Ahh, ok, that could indeed be worth a try, albeit that being paranoid, I will need to make a full backup first to make sure I don't corrupt anything important, like my mail database.

mass_debater

Irish Steve wrote: »

Ahh, ok, that could indeed be worth a try, albeit that being paranoid, I will need to make a full backup first to make sure I don't corrupt anything important, like my mail database.

It doesn't touch your drive, loads from the disk into memory

catfax

Adblock and Firefox they are a bad combo, in particular adblock/adblock plus cause severe memory leaks in Firefox which balloons RAM usage and makes Firefox stall/stutter. If you are going to use an adblocker use uBlock Origin it's not as effective but it doesn't cause the variety of problems adblock causes in Firefox.

Also Firefox can behave oddly with AMD GPU's if the CPU is under pressure, visual corruption/refresh issues.

Irish Steve

Update.

Decided to bite the bullet and let this machine upgrade to W10, once I'd got a good backup.

Took a while, and when it eventually stabilised, the performance of the Internet was dire, it would lock up completely every 20 minutes or so,

Checked for new drivers on the Acer site, but it was on the latest driver, then checked the Realtek site, to find that they'd released a new driver a few weeks ago, so installed that, and since then, the issues with both W10 and the slow down problems appear to have gone away.

What I've also noticed is that the driver for the Ethernet card has also been updated for earlier versions of Windows, so it's beginning to look like the issue was hardware related.