Motor Tax and Third Party Extension

shanepb94

Hi,

I am looking about buying an BMW e39 530d, but cannot justify paying the €1500 tax.

If I have the car in someone else's name, and have it NCT'd so I can drive it on my own policy's third party extension, is there anyway around having to tax the car or who would be held responsible for not having it taxed?

Looking for an alternative to putting it 2.0L on the book while keeping it 3.0L in the car.

Thanks in advance.

mickdw

shanepb94 wrote: »

Hi,

I am looking about buying an BMW e39 530d, but cannot justify paying the €1500 tax.

If I have the car in someone else's name, and have it NCT'd so I can drive it on my own policy's third party extension, is there anyway around having to tax the car or who would be held responsible for not having it taxed?

Looking for an alternative to putting it 2.0L on the book while keeping it 3.0L in the car.

Thanks in advance.

If you can't tax it, don't buy it.
You can drive around without tax like any other random person but the car will be impounded if caught.

CiniO

shanepb94 wrote: »

Hi,

I am looking about buying an BMW e39 530d, but cannot justify paying the €1500 tax.

That's understandable.

If I have the car in someone else's name, and have it NCT'd so I can drive it on my own policy's third party extension,

Assuming someone will be happy to give you the car which he owns and is registered in his name, then there should be no problem with that.

is there anyway around having to tax the car

To tax it legally, you would need a valid insurance policy on the car.
Motortax offices don't seem to check insurance details you provide, but providing false information on official forms like motortax renewal form is a very serious offence.

or who would be held responsible for not having it taxed?

Driver and possibly owner

Looking for an alternative to putting it 2.0L on the book while keeping it 3.0L in the car.

That's completely illegal.

drunkmonkey

Nope you got to tax it, you could always turn it into a taxi to get cheaper tax.

After a few weeks driving it you'll soon learn to justify it. Just cut back somewhere else.

If you smoke giving up will save you the tax and a lot more.

endacl

Is this a wind up?

shanepb94

endacl wrote: »

Is this a wind up?

Nope, not a wind up..... Just a shot in the dark!

I know people have been told by Liberty staff (in a round about way) that the car does not need tax to be driven under third party extension.
So you can be insured but not taxed!

But if I follow, a car need insurance to be taxed?


The solution taken by a lot of e39 drivers is to have the car 2L on the book, in a family members name, and driven on an extension policy...... So in the case of an accident seeing as their policy covers them to drive any vehicle regardless of engine size and no one has really lied to any insurance company, are they covered?

Not looking for the legal or moral part as such right at this minute...... Just insurance to cover third party, fire and theft?

drunkmonkey

Ok if you don't want to pay the tax do your sums on what's the fine for having no tax is and work in the law of probability of how often you expect to be fined.
Don't worry about messing with 3rd party extensions, just don't tax it. The fines will hardly be more than the tax.

CiniO

shanepb94 wrote: »

Nope, not a wind up..... Just a shot in the dark!

I know people have been told by Liberty staff (in a round about way) that the car does not need tax to be driven under third party extension.
So you can be insured but not taxed!

But if I follow, a car need insurance to be taxed?


The solution taken by a lot of e39 drivers is to have the car 2L on the book, in a family members name, and driven on an extension policy...... So in the case of an accident seeing as their policy covers them to drive any vehicle regardless of engine size and no one has really lied to any insurance company, are they covered?

Not looking for the legal or moral part as such right at this minute...... Just insurance to cover third party, fire and theft?

Most likely yes.
If policy says you can drive other cars which doesn't belong to you, neither to your employer, etc..... and you fulfill all those conditions, then IMO you are covered.

Alan_007_

I'd say it's not worth it. You'll get picked up for having no tax fairly quickly with either a checkpoint or an ANPR car.
What would you say to a Gard at a checkpoint about why the car is NCT'd, but with no tax or insurance in the window?

shanepb94

Alan_007_ wrote: »

I'd say it's not worth it. You'll get picked up for having no tax fairly quickly with either a checkpoint or an ANPR car.
What would you say to a Gard at a checkpoint about why the car is NCT'd, but with no tax or insurance in the window?

Okay, so if the car was NCT'd and taxed (*somehow without an insurance policy), and my third party extension is technically covering me, could they ONLY fine me for not displaying an insurance disk?

*if, to go slightly overboard, you
1. Insured the car
2. Taxed and NCT'd it with correct policy
3. Cancelled insurance
4. Drive on third party extension (Still taxed and tested)
?

Alan_007_

I'd say it's not worth it. You'll get picked up for having no tax fairly quickly with either a checkpoint or an ANPR car.
What would you say to a Gard at a checkpoint about why the car is NCT'd, but with no tax or insurance in the window?

CiniO

shanepb94 wrote: »

Okay, so if the car was NCT'd and taxed (*somehow without an insurance policy), and my third party extension is technically covering me, could they ONLY fine me for not displaying an insurance disk?

*if, to go slightly overboard, you
1. Insured the car
2. Taxed and NCT'd it with correct policy
3. Cancelled insurance
4. Drive on third party extension (Still taxed and tested)
?

Seems correct.

mickdw

Just to clarify. You would need to check the terms and conditions attached to any insurance extension but in general and this had been confirmed here before - the 3rd party extension applies regardless of tax or nct. It is only for additional benefits such as comprehensive cover under 3rd party extension that tax and nct are required.

thebiglad

For most driving other car extensions to be operative the car needs to be insured by its 'registered owner' so you will have to insure the other car.

All you will be looking to avoid is the annual tax and as the other posters have said you need to balance the probability of the Garda stopping you against the cost of tax and benefit.

if you did get stopped then I would expect the offences of tax and NCT would also apply to the registered owner so they would be drawn into the matter.

IMO just not worth it.

shanepb94

mickdw wrote: »

Just to clarify. You would need to check the terms and conditions attached to any insurance extension but in general and this had been confirmed here before - the 3rd party extension applies regardless of tax or nct. It is only for additional benefits such as comprehensive cover under 3rd party extension that tax and nct are required.

With Liberty

"the vehicle is not owned by you or your employer or hired to you or them under a hire-purchase or lease agreement;

you currently hold a full European Union (EU) licence;

the use of the vehicle is covered in the Certificate of Insurance;

cover is not provided by any other insurance;

you have the owner’s permission to drive the vehicle;

the vehicle is in a roadworthy condition;

you still have your vehicle and it has not been damaged beyond cost-effective repair; and

your occupation is not restricted by our acceptance criteria."

pippip

It would be a pain in the a££.

Every time you went by a garda car with APNR you'd be pulled over and have to spend 15mins explaining it.

slimjimmc

thebiglad wrote: »

For most driving other car extensions to be operative the car needs to be insured by its 'registered owner' so you will have to insure the other car.

Can you back that up?

Valetta

Biggest problem I see with this is having the car seized.

The guards at the side of the road won't be interested in who owns it, or who's name is on the log book.

Foxhole Norman

If you can't justify the tax, I wouldn't go buying one. Maybe look for a 525d, 525i or 520i to save on the tax?

Alan_007_

pippip wrote: »

It would be a pain in the a££.

Every time you went by a garda car with APNR you'd be pulled over and have to spend 15mins explaining it.

Even worse, you'll get a fine in the door a couple of weeks later for no tax without ever being pulled over.
Happened me just after I bought my car.

Mycroft H

thebiglad wrote: »

For most driving other car extensions to be operative the car needs to be insured by its 'registered owner' so you will have to insure the other car.

All you will be looking to avoid is the annual tax and as the other posters have said you need to balance the probability of the Garda stopping you against the cost of tax and benefit.

if you did get stopped then I would expect the offences of tax and NCT would also apply to the registered owner so they would be drawn into the matter.

IMO just not worth it.

FBD and Liberty just need it to be Taxed and Tested. Your insurance (third party) would suffice for the insurance end of it. Thus, you're now road legal.

frozenfrozen

nothing better than the look on a guards face when they see there's a valid tax disk for 1809 euro you can see the whites of their eyes go red as they fill up with rage because they thought they would get to impound a nice car

Valetta

frozenfrozen wrote: »

nothing better than the look on a guards face when they see there's a valid tax disk for 1809 euro you can see the whites of their eyes go red as they fill up with rage because they thought they would get to impound a nice car

You think?

Sad post, really.

colm_mcm

Utmost good faith

Definition

Legally, the parties to an insurance contract are assumed to have entered the contract in the 'utmost good faith,' which means they have not misrepresented any facts and intend to abide by the terms of the contract.