To change or not to change

Whispered

We currently have a 05 2l diesel Santa Fe. Along with tax, insurance and maintenance we put probably €80 a week in fuel to cover my husband travelling to work and then weekend driving.

I'm wondering if it would cost less long term to sell the thing and get a newer car, in better condition with a smaller engine on hire purchase.

It would be less on tax, maybe less insurance (?), fewer problems (although it's doing well in fairness) and with a newer, smaller engine, less on fuel.

What would be the quickest, easiest way to compare please?

vandriver

How many miles a week?
Is the car paid for?

Whispered

Car is paid for. Well he still has a loan but it's one of those loans that keeps getting topped up ha.

He does about 65km a day, weekends vary hugely. Maybe another 200km on average. Sometimes more (the 80 fuel would be average spend I'd say)

biko

There are some cost calculators online, like http://parkers.car-costs.co.uk/ and http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-1633412/Calculator-True-cost-running-car.html

Another way to calculate cost of another car is to estimate cost for insurance, fuel etc in an excel spreadsheet and see how is stacks up against current costs.

Toyotafanboi

Parkers say's the Mk1 Santa Fe does 39mpg, so assuming OP's is doing 39mpg, that's roughly 500 miles a week @ €80.00 to refill.

lets take a 2011 Hyundai ix35 as a comparison car.

2005 Santa Fe 2.0d (2wd?), 500 miles @ 39mpg = €80.00
2011 ix35 1.7d (2wd), 500 miles @ 53mpg = €59.00

2005 Santa Fe, 1 years tax: €710
2011 ix35, 1 years tax: €280

2005 Santa Fe, 26,000 miles (one years driving) incl. fuel and tax: €4870
2011 ix35 26,000 miles (one years driving) incl. fuel and tax: €3348

so a saving in running costs of €1522 p/a or just under €30 per week.

lets not forget you have to buy the new car though.

2005 Santa Fe worth roughly €3k
2011 ix35 costs roughly €17k

so, very roughly speaking a cost to change of around €14k, to save €1.5k per year, so it'd be nearly 10 years before you actually "save" anything at all.

there are very few situations where changing to a new car will actively save you any money. you can justify it if you think the Santa Fe doesn't suit your needs, or you feel it's too big or getting on in the years or whatever, but as an exercise in saving money, it's not much good.

What cars had you got in mind to change to?

say if you went for a brand new Nissan Pulsar for example and availed of the €4k scrappage decal they are offering.

2015 Pulsar 1.2 Petrol, 500 miles @ 56mpg = €60.00 (same as ix35 diesel)

2015 Pulsar, 1 years tax: €200

2015 Pulsar, 26,000 miles (one years driving) incl. fuel and tax: €3320

2015 Pulsar 1.2 starts @ €21k minus €4k for the Santa Fe = €17k cost to change.

so a saving of €1490 a year in running costs, pretty much the exact same as a 2011 ix35, but still a €17k cost to change so you're looking at 11 years before a real "saving" occurs. the benefit of this option for example is that the pulsar would be brand new, comes with a big warranty etc etc.

whomitconcerns

Now if you factor in the maintenance and associated costs on a 2005 Vs that same pulsar...it's a lot less than 11 years before you make a saving.

After 6 years you have saved 9k at least in running costs plus 4/5k in maintenance at least on your 2005.

Toyotafanboi

whomitconcerns wrote: »

Now if you factor in the maintenance and associated costs on a 2005 Vs that same pulsar...it's a lot less than 11 years before you make a saving.

After 6 years you have saved 9k at least in running costs plus 4/5k in maintenance at least on your 2005.

i don't think so really. i really doubt they are spending €1k per year maintenance on the Santa Fe. A full service and 2 tyres at an independent might come to around €500, i'd say it'd be very similar on the ix35 and really anything that can break on the Santa Fe (DMF, EGR etc) can all still fail on the much newer ix35 for a similar cost to repair once it's outside it's 1 year warranty.

i still don't see the clear logic in spending 14k up front to save €1.5k in 9 years time. and don't forget, in 9 years time when the saving finally kick in, the OP will probably fancy a change of car again.

imo the OP is currently in the sweet spot of motoring, finance wise. the still have a fresh looking, somewhat up in the years car that they know well to be reliable, they owe nothing on and that isn't depreciating on them, it's just costing them tax and fuel.

Whispered

Whispered wrote: »

Car is paid for. Well he still has a loan but it's one of those loans that keeps getting topped up ha.

He does about 65km a day, weekends vary hugely. Maybe another 200km on average. Sometimes more (the 80 fuel would be average spend I'd say)

If the 80/week is correct and the estimated weekly km total thereabouts too its doing nowhere near 39mpg, more like 25

I don't think many 05 Santa Fe averaged 40mpg, they are guzzlers.

cros13

Or, Since you are basically a perfect candidate for an EV, I've taken the liberty of updating Toyotafanboi's well laid out post:

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

say if you went for a brand new Nissan LEAF for example and availed of the €4k scrappage decal they are offering until the end of July.

2015 Leaf, 800 km @ 18kWh/100km = €11.52 (assuming 0.08c night rate electricity)

2015 Leaf, 1 years tax: €120

2015 Leaf, 42,000 km (one years driving) incl. electricity and tax: €719

2015 Leaf starts @ €21k minus €4k for the Santa Fe = €17k cost to change.

so a saving of €4091 a year in running costs

No servicing costs beyond €100 for an annual visual inspection and a minimum 20% discount on insurance. And I've pretended you are paying for every scrap of electricity instead of using the ESB infrastructure which is free until December 2016.
And yes those costs are real, I've used the US EPA fuel economy numbers instead of Nissan's massaged figures. The Leaf is a larger more practical and better specced car than the Pulsar. I'd spend the extra €2k to go for the mid-range model with the cold pack.

People wonder why EV owners can be a bit smug....

Toyotafanboi

that's really impressive! genuine saving after 4 years. that's worth considering.

Augeo wrote: »

If the 80/week is correct and the estimated weekly km total thereabouts too its doing nowhere near 39mpg, more like 25

I don't think many 05 Santa Fe averaged 40mpg, they are guzzlers.

i had taken the parkers figure and worked the mileage back before i seen the OP's second response with their mileage in it it's just a handy site because it gives to official figures for most cars. i know the official figures are to be taken with a pinch of salt, but it gives you a good starting point when doing some comparative maths.

cros13

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

that's really impressive! genuine saving after 4 years. that's worth considering.

Yup, four years ago the Leaf was €10k more expensive, had less boot space and the battery wasn't more sensitive to temperature swings, the heater used to use ten times the power of the current heater and the drive wasn't as refined. Didn't really make sense unless you were really into make your own sandals from hemp. There were also no rapid chargers about so you used to be stuck inside the range, and now you can drive to Minsk or Malin to Mizen head and back on the rapid charger network.

Now that it's the same price as a Pulsar to buy and and all those issues have been fixed. The running costs mean that for the average motorist you'd have to be mad not to consider it. If you are very high mileage or very low mileage stick with petrol or diesel until the 400-500km range EVs launch in 2017/2018 but everyone else should really start taking a look now at what moving could save them.

Even if you are a petrolhead, that kind of saving for your day-to-day commuting and trips around the shops mean that you can pay for a heck of a weekend car.

4 year old leaf doesn't sound overly attractive for north of €10k

cros13

Augeo wrote: »

4 year old leaf doesn't sound overly attractive for north of €10k

A decent four year old Leaf would cost at least €13k, In fact because of the VRT credit and exchange rate it's even more expensive than that in the UK for once.
They've held up their value fairly well considering the price of a new one dropped €10k, those four year old Leaf still have four years remaining on the powertrain warranty. They cut the warranty to 5 years on the new one.

Even so.... they've had a total of three battery replacements for 40,000 units sold in europe in 4 years. In the same period Nissan has done five per 10,000 full car replacements on petrol/diesel models with serious engine defects.

My former Leaf (now in the care of my parents) has done 56,000km and lost less than 1% of the battery capacity according to the data from ODBII. There are Leaf's running as Taxis with 200,000+km on the clock and thousands of rapid charges all with less than 10% loss.

Whispered

Seriously guys, huge thanks. I'm so grateful for the time you've put into helping me!

I'm swayed to hold onto the current car but am interested in learning more about the EV. It does sound like it's worth a look. Some of the things I like about the Santa Fe:

1) we have a 6 month old baby. I feel like he is safe when I'm driving it. The one ev I was ever in felt like a strong gust of wind might topple it. However that was maybe 10 years ago.

2) boot space, general space really. We can fit the dogs, their gear, the baby, his gear and ourselves in without a lot of room to spare.

3) we genuinely do a lot of mountainous driving. Granted it is all on roads, but a lot of uphill. (Ha and obviously downhill )

Would an EV be up to that do you think?

I'm heading off to google now but would be really interested to hear from you.

cros13

Whispered wrote: »

1) we have a 6 month old baby. I feel like he is safe when I'm driving it. The one ev I was ever in felt like a strong gust of wind might topple it. However that was maybe 10 years ago.

The Leaf weighs more than 1500kg and the battery is built into the floor beneath you. It's drives as smooth as a Mercedes S-Class and would be very difficult to topple over. The Leaf has a five-star NCAP crash rating which beats the '05 santa fe's four star rating.

Whispered wrote: »

2) boot space, general space really. We can fit the dogs, their gear, the baby, his gear and ourselves in without a lot of room to spare.

The 141 Leaf increased the boot space to around 400L, it's now larger than the boot in the Skoda Octavia, the current Santa Fe (being a crossover SUV style thing) has 500L. Many of the current Leaf owner have no problem fitting strollers etc. into the boot. Most Nissan dealers (who sell the Leaf, check first because if they don't sell the Leaf they will try to run it down and steer you to a different model) will give you a few days test drive to try out the car and see does it suit you. I'd recommend taking them up on that offer.

Whispered wrote: »

3) we genuinely do a lot of mountainous driving. Granted it is all on roads, but a lot of uphill. (Ha and obviously downhill )

You'll use more power going uphill but as for getting up the hill... the Leaf has more torque (essentially pulling power) than your santa fe. Again plenty of existing drivers in West Cork and Kerry could give you better guidance.
I drive up El Teide in Tenerife a couple of times a year, and I really miss the power of my i3 or my old Leaf trying to make my way up in a rented diesel Mini Countryman.

Take a look at this map of charge points to see if you are covered on your usual routes (another 20 being added this year, Bandon I think is being fitted this month.):

https://www.esb.ie/electric-cars/electric-car-charging/electric-car-charge-point-map.jsp

Leaf rapid chargers are ChaDeMo, so just deselect the other boxes to see where you can charge quickest. A rapid charger will bring the car from empty to 80% in about 20 minutes. Realistic real world range is 130-160km, though there is a larger battery coming in September that will add 25% to the range. Personally given that your average daily drive is 65-70km I'd grab the €4k scrappage before it expires at the end of July.

Whispered

We are still thinking about this. I'm swaying towards the leaf and my husband wants to sell the jeep once through nct and buy another banger. So far we've agreed that best thing is keep the jeep.

However I'd be really interested in test driving a leaf. I think if we could get finance for it, for the same as we are spending to keep the current car in the road it makes more sense. Provided it meets our needs for space etc.

Can anyone recommend a garage in Kildare or Dublin. And how do test drives work with insurance etc? Do they just lend you the car??!