Freesat box interfering with Saorview??

StopWatch

I thought i was going mad.
I Bought a manhattan hds2 Freesat box, connected it to my dish, all good.
Saorview channels are received via rabbit ears behind tv,Tv has saorview tuner built in, and signal was always 100%.
Once new box was installed some channels from Saorview disappeared.Weak or no signal error.
After some tinkering, i can see that as soon as box is powered on, signal drops to 50ish% for Saorview, so certain channels drop out.
Has anyone come across this? I thought i was going mad, but ive tested and retested, and it is definitely the box.
What can i do?

The Cush

StopWatch wrote: »

What can i do?

Move the aerial. The aerial is probably picking up a borderline Saorview signal and electrical interference from the new box has probably knocked out the weak signal.

This from Saorview

Can I Use An Indoor Portable Aerial, Rabbits Ears?

RTÉNL does not recommend the use of indoor portable aerials. They are too susceptible to localised physical and electrical interference. Terrestrial transmission of television, analogue and digital, is designed and built around rooftop reception.

winston_1

StopWatch wrote: »

I thought i was going mad.
I Bought a manhattan hds2 Freesat box, connected it to my dish, all good.
Saorview channels are received via rabbit ears behind tv,Tv has saorview tuner built in, and signal was always 100%.
Once new box was installed some channels from Saorview disappeared.Weak or no signal error.
After some tinkering, i can see that as soon as box is powered on, signal drops to 50ish% for Saorview, so certain channels drop out.
Has anyone come across this? I thought i was going mad, but ive tested and retested, and it is definitely the box.
What can i do?

So called rabbits ears are VHF aerials for DAB and FM radio. Completely unsuitable for UHF TV.
Get a proper UHF TV aerial, preferably on the roof as the broadcasters recommend.

McSim

StopWatch wrote: »

I thought i was going mad. Has anyone come across this? ... What can i do?

You are not alone.
Same issue described on this forum in the threads titled
"Saorview - Can Only Get 3 Channels"
"poor rte1 saorview signal"
The only solution for me so far is to power down the SAT box while watching the DVB-T2 channels.

kooga

interesting i had the above issue with a sky hd box interfering with the saorview signal.

I have an outdoor aerial and a dish with a sat and terrestial combiner single feed from them and out from the wallplate where they connect separately to the tv and sat box.

Last night to watch the cork city match on setanta i hooked up my sky hd box, when the box was on and you switched back to the tv tuners there was no signal coming in across all the saorview channels. When the box was turned off at the wall all channels returned, even if the box was in standby still no saorview signal.

The tv is normally connected to a manhatten freesat box and no issue whether it is turned on, off or in standby

Thanks in advance

Thurston?

kooga wrote: »

I have an outdoor aerial and a dish with a sat and terrestial combiner single feed from them and out from the wallplate where they connect separately to the tv and sat box.

Last night to watch the cork city match on setanta i hooked up my sky hd box, when the box was on and you switched back to the tv tuners there was no signal coming in across all the saorview channels. When the box was turned off at the wall all channels returned, even if the box was in standby still no saorview signal.

The tv is normally connected to a manhatten freesat box and no issue whether it is turned on, off or in standby

If you're watching a high band channel on the Manhattan receiver, like Pick TV or Sky News, how does Saorview look?

kooga

Thurston? wrote: »

If you're watching a high band channel on the Manhattan receiver, like Pick TV or Sky News, how does Saorview look?

all fine, the tv is mostly connected to the freesat box and all the channels are watched with no issue flicking between the sources.................the only exception was last week when watching wimbledon on the red button i went back to saorview and there was no signal for RTE 1 only.

thanks for looking at this

Thurston?

All red button feeds except red button 1, are on a high band TP.

Anyhow, what I was getting at is I think the root cause might be poor Saorview signal, & it doesn't take much to knock it over, whether it be interference from the LNB via the sat./terr. diplexer or, interference radiating from the Sky box itself. Thought maybe changing from low to high band TPs could worsen or lessen interference from the LNB.

This is the mobile home setup you referred to in another thread? So it's just aerial > sat./terr. diplexer > fairly short cable > sat./terr. diplexer in wallplate > TV?

kooga

Thurston? wrote: »

All red button feeds except red button 1, are on a high band TP.

Anyhow, what I was getting at is I think the root cause might be poor Saorview signal, & it doesn't take much to knock it over, whether it be interference from the LNB via the sat./terr. diplexer or, interference radiating from the Sky box itself. Thought maybe changing from low to high band TPs could worsen or lessen interference from the LNB.

This is the mobile home setup you referred to in another thread? So it's just aerial > sat./terr. diplexer > fairly short cable > sat./terr. diplexer in wallplate > TV?

Thurston, not the mobile home set up but inlaws place

you are right that is the cable run
tks

STB.

kooga wrote: »

interesting i had the above issue with a sky hd box interfering with the saorview signal.

I have an outdoor aerial and a dish with a sat and terrestial combiner single feed from them and out from the wallplate where they connect separately to the tv and sat box.

Last night to watch the cork city match on setanta i hooked up my sky hd box, when the box was on and you switched back to the tv tuners there was no signal coming in across all the saorview channels. When the box was turned off at the wall all channels returned, even if the box was in standby still no saorview signal.

The tv is normally connected to a manhatten freesat box and no issue whether it is turned on, off or in standby

Thanks in advance

Do you have the RF Modulator switched on ?
If so Turn the RF Out on the Sky Box off. Services 0 0 1 etc

The other chaps problem with the Manhattan box sounds like poor aerial placement. "via rabbit ears behind tv". That is not how to maximise signal from Saorview. Ideally the indoor aerial should be placed by a window cill. Crappy aerials are subject to all sorts of RF including mobile phones, routers and cars going by. Extend the cable to get it near a window.

Thurston?

Assuming the Sky box in question even has a modulator, all you can do in the menu is turn off the power for 'magic eyes' etc., not the modulator itself. (Though I would think it goes off when the box is in standby, but OP still has problem.)

And it would be odd for it to be interfering unless for some reason he'd routed the aerial via the Sky box.

Thurston?

kooga wrote: »

Thurston, not the mobile home set up but inlaws place

you are right that is the cable run

Well, I wouldn't expect signal losses for 2 diplexers + short cables to be any more than about 6dB. As for the level display on the TV - is it a Samsung? - I know my own, even with moderate levels as measured by a meter, will show well into the 80s on the TV display, so in your case it's possible it's starting off at a pretty low level at the aerial.

I know the quality display is reading 100%, the reference I have for how this may be calculated is the NorDig specs that Saorview follows &, I'm no engineer, but the formulas include the BER figure from after the 1st stage of error-correction, I think above a certain signal-to-noise threshold it's based purely on this but, as I say I'm not really qualified to comment as to how good a guide to signal robustness this quality figure is. Experience with a few receivers though, would lead me not to have too much faith in their percentage readout quality displays ...

STB.

Thurston? wrote: »

Assuming the Sky box in question even has a modulator, all you can do in the menu is turn off the power for 'magic eyes' etc., not the modulator itself. (Though I would think it goes off when the box is in standby, but OP still has problem.)

And it would be odd for it to be interfering unless for some reason he'd routed the aerial via the Sky box.

So many assumptions Thurston.

Could be something as simple as bad quality sat and aerial cables. Now add a HDMI cable from the Sky Box crossing the aerial connection where the DVB-T signal is already weak into the mix..... and hey presto.

Do they even ground Sky boxes ? They didnt up to recently and you could get RF from the components alone (like the CAS for example) in scenarios of poorly screened cable/low terrestrial signal..... You didnt need to be feeding anything through the box or have modulators turned on in order to recreate this.

Thurston?

Main point I was making is that the modulator can't be switched off in the menu, just save him wasting a bit of time.

And I had already mentioned weak terrestrial signal, & interference radiating from the box myself.

kooga

Stb and Thurston thank you for all the feedback, armed with what you've told me I think I should book a call out for a competent installer to call out and give the system a look over.

STB.

You should and try and eliminate them youself first Kooga. It might save you the money.

And Thurston, I wasnt having a go. I agree that there are too many variables never mind assumptions. Its normally a combination of badly screened cabling, too low or overloaded terrestrial signal and badly designed or grounded boxes that cause the issues.

kooga

STB

checked the sky box and the rf out is off.

Thurston?

kooga wrote: »

checked the sky box and the rf out is off.

Unless I'm very much mistaken, that's only for the 9 volt power supply. Doesn't it appear in the menu as 'RF2 power supply', or something like that?

To the best of my knowledge, the modulator only goes off when the box is put into standby, but the LNB is still powered, & looking at a high band 'default' TP. (Though newer models might be a bit 'greener' in this respect.) Setanta is also in the high band, which is why I brought this up earlier.

If your box is one that actually has an onboard modulator, it will have an aerial-in socket, & RF1 & 2-out. Newer types don't have a modulator, & need an add-on such as the IO-link.

And if it has RF-in/outs, you didn't actually have the TV aerial routed via these anyway?