Landlord Dispute - PRTB Dispute Filed

vintagecosmos

Hi All,

Long time browser but first time asking for advice.

I have been in a property for more than a year. The hot water / heating system gave out in April and I have been passed from pillar to post between plumbers / agents / landlord. A plumber assessed it and gave a price to landlord which they weren't happy with. So they got a second opinion. That plumber then agreed with the first plumber.

Landlord has now suddenly decided to move back into the property giving me 1 months notice. (I sincerely doubt this to be genuine based on their profile and place of work).

I contacted PRTB. Filed a dispute this morning for improper reason to terminate. Also in relation to the maintenance of the property.

Interestingly, the agent has advised me to withhold the last months rent. But as I understand this will be me breaching the lease.

I wanted to ask for advice in relation to this. Should I withhold rent? Do you think it is possible landlord will back down and repair hot water and renew lease?

I am well settled in the area and there are not many apartments around so my preference is to remain in place.

Thanking you in advance.

VC

Michael D Not Higgins

The landlord's agent advised you to withhold the rent or what agent? If it was the landlord's agent then it is just an agreement to use the deposit as last month's rent. If another third party, then it is breaching the lease and I would advise against it.

As to the rest, I can't comment. If you believe the landlord is lying then go through the PRTB process and see what happens.

Cuddlesworth

You don't have much choice in the matter. The PRTB will more than likely fine him for not fixing the property and ask you to leave it(as you can't provide proof against his intentions). Best option would be to look for new accommodation, since you're living in a property with broken hot water and a bad relationship with your landlord.

If he sells it or tries to move new tenants in, then lodge a new PRTB case for compensation.

vintagecosmos

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

The landlord's agent advised you to withhold the rent or what agent? If it was the landlord's agent then it is just an agreement to use the deposit as last month's rent. If another third party, then it is breaching the lease and I would advise against it.

As to the rest, I can't comment. If you believe the landlord is lying then go through the PRTB process and see what happens.

Thanks for that. The person is the original estate agent. But he washed his hands of it a couple of months ago as he was frustrated in dealing with the owner.

vintagecosmos

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

You don't have much choice in the matter. The PRTB will more than likely fine him for not fixing the property and ask you to leave it(as you can't provide proof against his intentions). Best option would be to look for new accommodation, since you're living in a property with broken hot water and a bad relationship with your landlord.

If he sells it or tries to move new tenants in, then lodge a new PRTB case for compensation.

Thanks. yes I think your right. Its just such a pain. It seems I will have 42 days notice to find somewhere else. And getting hot water back seems likely not to happen.

athtrasna

Withholding rent is illegal. No posts advocating this please. This is your one and only warning.

Mod

vintagecosmos

athtrasna wrote: »

Withholding rent is illegal. No posts advocating this please. This is your one and only warning.

Mod

Thanks. Does that mean even if the estate agent has instructed me to hold onto the last months rent I shouldn't?

Michael D Not Higgins

vintagecosmos wrote: »

Thanks for that. The person is the original estate agent. But he washed his hands of it a couple of months ago as he was frustrated in dealing with the owner.

You'll need to expand more on the situation. Do you pay rent to the agent? Are they holding the deposit for the landlord?

athtrasna

vintagecosmos wrote: »

Thanks. Does that mean even if the estate agent has instructed me to hold onto the last months rent I shouldn't?

As per the RTA2004 withholding rent is illegal.

Graham

FYI, after a year you're entitled 6 weeks (42 days) notice: http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/types_of_tenancy.html#lef263

Lux23

In this case, could the tenant continue to pay rent and stay where he is until the PRTB have sorted out the dispute?

Cuddlesworth

Lux23 wrote: »

In this case, could the tenant continue to pay rent and stay where he is until the PRTB have sorted out the dispute?

Yes. Why you would really want to in those circumstances is something else entirely though.

billythefish99

Theres nothing you can do to force the landlord to service the property you are paying for unfortunately. Its entirely up to the landlord whether he bothers or not, and there is no way to pursue for damages as far as I know. What a joke.

Graham

billythefish99 wrote: »

Theres nothing you can do to force the landlord to service the property you are paying for unfortunately. Its entirely up to the landlord whether he bothers or not, and there is no way to pursue for damages as far as I know. What a joke.

The landlord must provide:

A sink with hot and cold water
A fixed heating appliance in each room, which is capable of providing effective heating and which the tenant can control

If your home does not meet the minimum standards

Local authorities (in their role as housing authorities) are responsible for enforcing these minimum standards. If you think that your home does not comply with the standards, you should complain to the local authority, whether you are a local authority tenant or housing association tenant. If you are a private tenant and you think your accommodation is sub-standard or your landlord refuses to carry out repairs that are included on the aforementioned list, you can ask the local authority to make the landlord comply with the standards. See 'Where to apply' below.

Failure to comply with the minimum standards can result in penalties and prosecution. Housing authorities can issue Improvement Notices and Prohibition Notices to landlords who breach the minimum standards regulations. An Improvement Notice sets out the works that the landlord must carry out to remedy a breach of the regulations. If the landlord does not do these works, the housing authority may issue a Prohibition Notice, directing the landlord not to re-let the property until the breach of the regulations has been rectified.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/repairs_maintenance_and_minimum_physical_standards.html

billythefish99

Graham wrote: »

The landlord must provide:

A sink with hot and cold water
A fixed heating appliance in each room, which is capable of providing effective heating and which the tenant can control

If your home does not meet the minimum standards

Local authorities (in their role as housing authorities) are responsible for enforcing these minimum standards. If you think that your home does not comply with the standards, you should complain to the local authority, whether you are a local authority tenant or housing association tenant. If you are a private tenant and you think your accommodation is sub-standard or your landlord refuses to carry out repairs that are included on the aforementioned list, you can ask the local authority to make the landlord comply with the standards. See 'Where to apply' below.

Failure to comply with the minimum standards can result in penalties and prosecution. Housing authorities can issue Improvement Notices and Prohibition Notices to landlords who breach the minimum standards regulations. An Improvement Notice sets out the works that the landlord must carry out to remedy a breach of the regulations. If the landlord does not do these works, the housing authority may issue a Prohibition Notice, directing the landlord not to re-let the property until the breach of the regulations has been rectified.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/repairs_maintenance_and_minimum_physical_standards.html

Thats great, but it doesnt help the OP stay in the property he is paying for.

Graham

billythefish99 wrote: »

Thats great, but it doesnt help the OP stay in the property he is paying for.

I didn't suggest it would, it was a counterpost to your suggestion 'nothing can be done' to prevent anyone else reading your post and taking it as fact.

vintagecosmos

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

You'll need to expand more on the situation. Do you pay rent to the agent? Are they holding the deposit for the landlord?

Rent is paid to a third party. Possibly a business partner of the landlord. Not to the agent. The deposit was paid to the landlord directly via bank transfer.

vintagecosmos

Graham wrote: »

The landlord must provide:

A sink with hot and cold water
A fixed heating appliance in each room, which is capable of providing effective heating and which the tenant can control

If your home does not meet the minimum standards

Local authorities (in their role as housing authorities) are responsible for enforcing these minimum standards. If you think that your home does not comply with the standards, you should complain to the local authority, whether you are a local authority tenant or housing association tenant. If you are a private tenant and you think your accommodation is sub-standard or your landlord refuses to carry out repairs that are included on the aforementioned list, you can ask the local authority to make the landlord comply with the standards. See 'Where to apply' below.

Failure to comply with the minimum standards can result in penalties and prosecution. Housing authorities can issue Improvement Notices and Prohibition Notices to landlords who breach the minimum standards regulations. An Improvement Notice sets out the works that the landlord must carry out to remedy a breach of the regulations. If the landlord does not do these works, the housing authority may issue a Prohibition Notice, directing the landlord not to re-let the property until the breach of the regulations has been rectified.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/repairs_maintenance_and_minimum_physical_standards.html

Thanks. So should I report to the local authority as well as the PRTB? I assumed the PRTB was the one stop shop. They were pretty helpful on the phone I have to say. And I didnt have to wait long to be connected.

billythefish99

Graham wrote: »

I didn't suggest it would, it was a counterpost to your suggestion 'nothing can be done' to prevent anyone else reading your post and taking it as fact.

Let me clarify - If a landlord decides to refuse to service something in your home that is required for it to be habitable (like a heating system), nothing can be done to force him and your tenancy is effectively over with no recourse available.

Michael D Not Higgins

vintagecosmos wrote: »

Rent is paid to a third party. Possibly a business partner of the landlord. Not to the agent. The deposit was paid to the landlord directly via bank transfer.

In that case do not do anything the agent says.

Graham

billythefish99 wrote: »

Let me clarify - If a landlord decides to refuse to service something in your home that is required for it to be habitable (like a heating system), nothing can be done to force him and your tenancy is effectively over with no recourse available.

I won't give a legal opinion on your understanding however it looks like the PRTB can (and do) make awards against landlords for 'failure to properly maintain a dwelling'. Here's just one example: http://www.prtb.ie/docs/default-source/tribunal-reports/tr0514-000651-report.pdf?sfvrsn=0

vintagecosmos

Graham wrote: »

I won't give a legal opinion on your understanding however it looks like the PRTB can (and do) make awards against landlords for 'failure to properly maintain a dwelling'. Here's just one example: http://www.prtb.ie/docs/default-source/tribunal-reports/tr0514-000651-report.pdf?sfvrsn=0

Thanks for that. I read it and may use it going forward. Would I be unreasonable to request a months rent compensation for not having hot water/heating for 6 weeks?

Michael D Not Higgins

vintagecosmos wrote: »

Thanks for that. I read it and may use it going forward. Would I be unreasonable to request a months rent compensation for not having hot water/heating for 6 weeks?

I don't think you get to decide what is a fair amount. That would be up to the PRTB.

Graham

vintagecosmos wrote: »

Thanks for that. I read it and may use it going forward. Would I be unreasonable to request a months rent compensation for not having hot water/heating for 6 weeks?

As other have said, it's unlikely you get to specify any amount. Just make sure that the PRTB are aware your complaint includes the landlords unwillingness to maintain the property. Specifically, the failure to provide heating/hot-water etc etc etc.

If you can back that up with dates/times/number of communications etc, I'm sure it wouldn't hurt your complaint.

spaceHopper

Start looking for a new place, get the LL to give you a written reference now before he finds out about the PRTB complaint or get one from the agent, can the agent find you a place? Contact the LL about the deposit to get it back then after you move out if it's rented again you would have a valid claim against the LL

vintagecosmos

Thanks all. Started to look for a new place. All your advice is really appreciated. I'll update if anything comes of the dispute.

VC

vintagecosmos

Hi All,

Just to update. Found a new place and moving in shortly.

PRTB called me to say mediation will be happening in the next few days/week.

Still no response from the current landlord.

I have a question about termination. My landlord has not responded to my requests to repair the hotwater/heating in the property for 2 months. Am I able to issue an immediate termination and request the return of my deposit?

Michael D Not Higgins

vintagecosmos wrote: »

Hi All,

Just to update. Found a new place and moving in shortly.

PRTB called me to say mediation will be happening in the next few days/week.

Still no response from the current landlord.

I have a question about termination. My landlord has not responded to my requests to repair the hotwater/heating in the property for 2 months. Am I able to issue an immediate termination and request the return of my deposit?

No, and breaching the terms of your lease just before PRTB mediation wouldn't be smart. Do everything by the book, explain you have had to search for and move into another apartment because you had no heating/hot water and have been diligently paying your agreed rent despite not getting your legal minimum standards.

The PRTB will likely rule against the landlord and you should get your deposit and hopefully something to compensate you for the landlord's negligence of his duties.

Cuddlesworth

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

No, and breaching the terms of your lease just before PRTB mediation wouldn't be smart. Do everything by the book, explain you have had to search for and move into another apartment because you had no heating/hot water and have been diligently paying your agreed rent despite not getting your legal minimum standards.

The PRTB will likely rule against the landlord and you should get your deposit and hopefully something to compensate you for the landlord's negligence of his duties.

Not sure I agree with this. While the above might be true, the reality is that the PRTB judgement has no bearing on him actually paying it. If he digs his heels in the OP will have to go through the arduous process of chasing the debt through the district court and onwards. The cleaner the break, the better for him.

Miamiheat

billythefish99 wrote: »

Let me clarify - If a landlord decides to refuse to service something in your home that is required for it to be habitable (like a heating system), nothing can be done to force him and your tenancy is effectively over with no recourse available.

Totally disagree. I took my landlord to PRTB and lost because I should have "known" as per the mediator that i was entitled to write an ultimatum to the landlord giving him 2 weeks to fix the issue otherwise i could pay someone to do it myself and get refunded (i dont remember if that included deducting the bill from the rent or asking for a refund from landlord). It had to be a written notice and the PRTB said in most cases the landlord will oblige once they see the letter.

vintagecosmos

Thanks for advice. I couldn't get through to threshold in the end but called up the landlord. Basically reached an agreement to drop the PRTB case if the deposit is refunded straight away. Its a clean break if it goes smoothly which is fine for me. I feel i deserve much more than that given whats gone on the last 2 months but it means I can just get on with life.

Thanks again for all your advice. Really appreciate it.

VC