If the pope visited Ireland again

Laoislion8383

After watching the episode of reeling in the years that covers 1979 I found myself asking the question if the pope visited Ireland this year would there be as much hype and ceremony around such a visit.?? Obviously you wouldn't have Eammon Casey singing trying to rile up the crowd which annoyed me watching it, I know Ireland was a different country back then the church had us brainwashed and ignorant

Mrs OBumble

When the pope (eventually) visits again, it will be very different.

Compare the Eucharistic Congress in 1932 vs the one in 2013 (RDS was woefully underfilled) to get a sense of the difference.

Ireland is a different place now, TG, but there's still a sizeable Catholic segment, and a visit from the world leader, and the head-of-state of the Vatican, would still be a major event.

Laoislion8383

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

When the pope (eventually) visits again, it will be very different.

Compare the Eucharistic Congress in 1932 vs the one in 2013 (RDS was woefully underfilled) to get a sense of the difference.

Ireland is a different place now, TG, but there's still a sizeable Catholic segment, and a visit from the world leader, and the head-of-state of the Vatican, would still be a major event.

Yes Ireland is a different country now TG, of course a visit from the pope would be welcome and celebrated as you say he is the head of state of the Vatican, but it should be treated as that a visit from a head of state, and public apologise and acceptance of wrongdoing by members loyal to his state committed in this country has to be a must

Full Marx

If Francis visits there will be a huge turn out because he is quite popular, even among non catholics.

Laoislion8383

Full Marx wrote: »

If Francis visits there will be a huge turn out because he is quite popular, even among non catholics.

Not so popular with those within his own chuch I think, bit to liberal

am946745

Laoislion8383 wrote: »

After watching the episode of reeling in the years that covers 1979 I found myself asking the question if the pope visited Ireland this year would there be as much hype and ceremony around such a visit.?? Obviously you wouldn't have Eammon Casey singing trying to rile up the crowd which annoyed me watching it, I know Ireland was a different country back then the church had us brainwashed and ignorant

You would still have a million people going to Knock to see him.

Was Casey that bad?? Compared to what we know about what was covered up elsewhere.

And society today doesn't have a generation brainwashed and ignorant? Ask any 18 year old about the Aeneid or to list some Formal fallacies. So don't talk about the previous generation as being ignorant. That is not the Generation that is riddled with STD's, drug addiction tied to methadone clinics.

Juza1973

Laoislion8383 wrote: »

Not so popular with those within his own chuch I think, bit to liberal

I don't find him too liberal at all, and I'm quite conservative and anyway he is our Pope and you are supposed to support him, you can't cherry pick Popes.

Laoislion8383

am946745 wrote: »

You would still have a million people going to Knock to see him.

Was Casey that bad?? Compared to what we know about what was covered up elsewhere.

And society today doesn't have a generation brainwashed and ignorant? Ask any 18 year old about the Aeneid or to list some Formal fallacies. So don't talk about the previous generation as being ignorant. That is not the Generation that is riddled with STD's, drug addiction tied to methadone clinics.

No Casey is that thst bad compared to some of the stuff other members of the chuch got up to of course not, but it was the arrogance of them all that sickens me the preaching one thing doing another, the covers ups which still continue and the states involvement in it all. Of course this generation has its flaws every generation will but we are far more educated and clued in, STDs are not new you know everyone knows they are out there anyone that does not protect themselves from them are thick, drugs have always being around again anyone that choses the take them and get addicted well again that's their fault I don't buy into spending millions on helping people who don't want to help themselves simple as

galljga1

am946745 wrote: »

You would still have a million people going to Knock to see him.

Was Casey that bad?? Compared to what we know about what was covered up elsewhere.

And society today doesn't have a generation brainwashed and ignorant? Ask any 18 year old about the Aeneid or to list some Formal fallacies. So don't talk about the previous generation as being ignorant. That is not the Generation that is riddled with STD's, drug addiction tied to methadone clinics.

There is no chance of a million people going to see the pope anywhere in this country.

am946745

galljga1 wrote: »

There is no chance of a million people going to see the pope anywhere in this country.

So the million+ people that weekly go to mass on this Island won't go to see the pope if he came?

Laoislion8383

am946745 wrote: »

So the million+ people that weekly go to mass on this Island won't go to see the pope if he came?

Where did you get that figure for mass attendance?

galljga1

am946745 wrote: »

So the million+ people that weekly go to mass on this Island won't go to see the pope if he came?

Correct.

galljga1

am946745 wrote: »

So the million+ people that weekly go to mass on this Island won't go to see the pope if he came?

Garth Brooks, maybe, the pope, no.

Turtwig

galljga1 wrote: »

There is no chance of a million people going to see the pope anywhere in this country.

Probably not a million, I'd reckon it'd be several 100,000 though. Irish people still identify as Catholic they just don't obey the Church any more. Can't really fault them on that either given how much trust and authority they gave the church only for it to be abused.

galljga1

Turtwig wrote: »

Probably not a million, I'd reckon it'd be several 100,000 though. Irish people still identify as Catholic they just don't obey the Church any more. Can't really fault them on that either given how much trust and authority they gave the church only for it to be abused.

If it was a Phoenix Park gig or something similar you would have a couple of hundred thousand, but nowhere near a million particularly if he did a tour like JP2.

am946745

galljga1 wrote: »

If it was a Phoenix Park gig or something similar you would have a couple of hundred thousand, but nowhere near a million particularly if he did a tour like JP2.

1.5 Million people visit the Knock Shrine every year. Why do you think there would not be a million people to visit if the Pope came. However I seriously doubt we would have the infrastructure to manage that level. If he went to Armagh/Knock/Dublin easily over a million would go. Without a shadow of a doubt.

Mrs OBumble

Laoislion8383 wrote: »

Where did you get that figure for mass attendance?

4.5 million people in the Republic. Round it down to 4 to make the maths easier.

Approx 80% still say they're catholic. That's 3.2 million. Round it down to 3.

Even if only 20% attend each week (which I think might be a bit light), that's still 3m x 0.2 = 600,000.

So it wouldn't surprise me a bit if there are a million attending each week.



Annual statistics, based on official reports to head office, are on a website somewhere. I don't have time to Google it now, but it's not difficult if you put your mind to it.

Personally I wouldn't go to a Phoenix Park open-air Mass, 'cos I cannot stand the circus effect. Even with a pope like Francis. But I know many who would.

am946745

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

4.5 million people in the Republic. Round it down to 4 to make the maths easier.

Approx 80% still say they're catholic. That's 3.2 million. Round it down to 3.

Even if only 20% attend each week (which I think might be a bit light), that's still 3m x 0.2 = 600,000.

So it wouldn't surprise me a bit if there are a million attending each week.



Annual statistics, based on official reports to head office, are on a website somewhere. I don't have time to Google it now, but it's not difficult if you put your mind to it.

Personally I wouldn't go to a Phoenix Park open-air Mass, 'cos I cannot stand the circus effect. Even with a pope like Francis. But I know many who would.

In the Catholic Church the Island of Ireland was never divided. There does not exist a northern or southern catholic church. The Population of the Island is 6.4 million. 70% of the population is Catholic on the Isle (well thats what they tick on the census.).

Benny_Cake

You'd easily get a couple of hundred thousand in the Phoenix Park if Pope Francis visited. It would be a mix of mass-going Catholic's and people who would go along out of curiosity or the desire to be at an event with at least some historical significance. Heck, I'm no longer Catholic but I'd probably go along.

am946745

Benny_Cake wrote: »

Heck, I'm no longer Catholic but I'd probably go along.

Off topic. Why are you no longer Catholic?

Benny_Cake

am946745 wrote: »

Off topic. Why are you no longer Catholic?

Long story short, I just couldn't agree with a number of the social teachings and the church's views on some issues,combined with the scandals. It didn't seem honest to call myself a Catholic anymore. No wish to get into that though as it's off topic and I still hold a good deal of respect for a lot of people involved with the church,far better people than me.

Manach

Just in context of the OP and my one off IHMO, I would say the operative word is when. This is given the historical links, the active members of the Church (clerics & laity) and the general popularity of the Papacy - especially the current Pope. While I’d be more in tune with the learned previous incumbent, Pope Francis has proved to have a popular and engaging touch that re-enages with the popular roots of Christianity in vibrant living communities. Given his high position in various opinion poles, an issue might be to avoid politicans who are always seeking reflective light.

Peregrinus

We live in an age of celebrity, and the pope is a celebrity. A papal visit would be a big occasion and would attract large crowds. They wouldn't necessarily all be there because of a strong attachment to the Catholic church. (But, then, the same was true in '79.)

hinault

I think a papal visit would be well supported but it would not achieve the support of the first visit that happened in 1979.

Ireland was a very different country in 1979 and besides the demographic changes alone means that there would be a different experience compared to 1979.

On a related topic, I was considering the 1979 visit in light of the subsequent social changes that occurred following that visit.

I don't know if it is coincidence or not that following that visit, a sizeable number of Catholics here stopped practising the Faith in the years which followed.

eviltwin

There would be a big turnout, not so much out of reverence but for the experience of it, something to tell the kids. I'd go but I'd be protesting his visit. As a survivor I don't want that man in my country being fawned over until he makes amends for what his organisation did.

Berserker

I think that there would be a massive turn out if the pope visited Ireland. I probably wouldn't go myself but I would imagine that anyone who has the slightest affinity with the RCC and many curious non-RCC Christians would go to see him.

tommy2bad

I went the last time, not out of reverence or curiosity but because a crowd was going and a girl I fancied would be on the bus.
I expect the hype would be a lot less this time, so more true believers and the idle curious. A million? Not a hope in he'll, 3/4 maybe over a few gigs but if or when he comes it will be a 2 stop tour so 150 thousand tops.

I got the girl by the way, nothing brings people together like the lack of public toilets.