Public Right of Way

Full Marx

Hi All, looking for a bit of advice. I'm not a farmer however I own a bit of (good) grassland, 25 or so acres. I look after it and maintain it but there hasn't been any real use of it (aside from recreational) in 6 years, I used to let relatives keep their horses on it (but they have land closer to themselves now).

However on the land there are a number of historical, monastic ruins. (this is why I have not sold the land, as well as having my house on the property)). Sometimes tourists or those who are into history come out to look at it and have done for years. I don't mind this (the opposite in fact) and I've made access easier by putting in those self closing gates etc and a few signs. I presume there is some right of way the public have, or a general right to see national monuments?

Anyway to get to the point my neighbour has asked if I can do him a favour and rent him the land, he wants to put some cattle and a bull on it. I told him I don't mind sheep, but I'm wary about the bull. This is because I'm afraid some visitor could get hurt, he said just to throw up a beware of bull sign and it will be fine, but I imagine having a bull in the field would be interfering with the right of way?

Any advice lads?

Melodeon

Talk to your solicitor.
Don't go creating a public right of way where one doesn't exist already!

Base price

The law as it stands at the moment and pertinent to your situation.
Hope you enjoy a bit of reading
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1995/en/act/pub/0010/

cj maxx

As said earlier , get legal advice

Full Marx

Melodeon wrote: »

Talk to your solicitor.
Don't go creating a public right of way where one doesn't exist already!

People have been visiting the place for donkeys years - and I'm happy to have the public visiting. Does anyone else have historical stuff on their land, how do you deal with people wanting to see it?


Thanks everyone, sounds like it's easier just to say no tbh

Base price

Full Marx wrote: »

People have been visiting the place for donkeys years - and I'm happy to have the public visiting. Does anyone else have historical stuff on their land, how do you deal with people wanting to see it?


Thanks everyone, sounds like it's easier just to say no tbh

Did you get a chance to read the link.
What would you do if you had a spring well on your land? Say no??

smokey-fitz

If you like having people visit and thats what you want then keep it that way. Just say no to the farmer that wants to put cows and a bull on it.

If you put cattle on it people wont be as inclined to go onto it. As you already said sheep would be ideal, they will keep the ground in good order and wont destroy any monuments or relics that are there but you will need to have the boundries fenced properly for sheep.

On the otherside if you lease for cattle, it may well give you a nice bit of cashflow but that might not be your objective.

Full Marx

Have an update...

Popped over to the neighbour this morning and told him that he can put his sheep on it (as smokey-fitz said it would be ideal, the land is very well fenced) but not cattle and especially not a bull and explained why. He tried to change my mind but I wouldn't, he then made me an offer to buy it (a crap offer) which I refused, then he lost the plot completely and started roaring and shouting, calling me everything under the sun and saying he'd smash up "your precious ruins". I was shocked and it seemed his anger was something to with me not working the land. Seemed to think he was entitled to it even though my family have owned it (and used to own a good chunk of his land) for years. I'll do whatever the hell I want with it. Didn't engage and just left. (although felt like telling him I was going to plant trees on it lol)

Went over to another neighbor who I really get on with (who I should have talked to first) and he told me under no circumstances to rent land to that lad as I would never be able to shift him off it.

Real eye opener, and a load of drama I didn't need. He can forget about any help from me ever again in the future, I would have been a sound neighbor too, this is the first time I ever said no to him, obviously felt he could bully me.

Going to keep an eye on him, if he shows any inclination to follow up on his threats I'll have to get on to the cops.

Anyone ever have any crap like this before?

TopTec

Ah, Land Rage.......

I'm only here a few years and have already come across more than a few instances... nephew against uncle, brother against brother, cousin against cousin.... even people who moved away when they were kids have land rage from afar. Guards called round to neighbours house recently... huge shouting match between nephew and uncle over a piece of land.

I have several different farmers round me and help out with one of them. The top two topics of conversation is...... the weather and land.

You've done the right thing Full Marx.

TT

onyerbikepat

OP, you're better to keep him well clear of the land. It's not just his renting it, but if you ever went to sell it down the road, he would 'feel' that it was his to buy.
From some strange reason, some farmers who rent land over a number of years feel that they are entitled to buy it and will intimidate those that try to bid on it too.

Sacrolyte

We'll done. Top marks Full Marx.

Deepsouthwest

Full Marx wrote: »

Have an update...

Popped over to the neighbour this morning and told him that he can put his sheep on it (as smokey-fitz said it would be ideal, the land is very well fenced) but not cattle and especially not a bull and explained why. He tried to change my mind but I wouldn't, he then made me an offer to buy it (a crap offer) which I refused, then he lost the plot completely and started roaring and shouting, calling me everything under the sun and saying he'd smash up "your precious ruins". I was shocked and it seemed his anger was something to with me not working the land. Seemed to think he was entitled to it even though my family have owned it (and used to own a good chunk of his land) for years. I'll do whatever the hell I want with it. Didn't engage and just left. (although felt like telling him I was going to plant trees on it lol)

Went over to another neighbor who I really get on with (who I should have talked to first) and he told me under no circumstances to rent land to that lad as I would never be able to shift him off it.

Real eye opener, and a load of drama I didn't need. He can forget about any help from me ever again in the future, I would have been a sound neighbor too, this is the first time I ever said no to him, obviously felt he could bully me.

Going to keep an eye on him, if he shows any inclination to follow up on his threats I'll have to get on to the cops.

Anyone ever have any crap like this before?

Think u really dodged a bullet keeping that guy out!

ganmo

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

Think u really dodged a bullet keeping that guy out!

Sounds more like a train

mf240

Dont mind him op. Hes just a grabber , its your land to do with as you please.

smokey-fitz

Yea kinda had a idea he could of been that sort by your openening thread. He didnt give a **** about want you wanted. Trying to push you into agreeing what he wanted.

Spoilt child syndrome. Ill start kicking and screaming if I dont get my way :P

Steer clear and avoid all future dealings with him.

djmc

I would be careful that a asshxxe like that isn't claiming bfp or any other grants on my land
He could be trying to worm his way in to claim squatters rights saying that it was abandoned and he was using it with over 12 years.
I would ring the department or let to someone else.
Even put a few donkeys beside the one that's already there and claim grants yourself

Sacrolyte

Just one other thing. He will be back so be ready.

Full Marx

Caught him on the land today. Only because I was there myself checking that he didn't do anything overnight.

Was shocked to see me (I couldn't be seen from the lane) and tried to be a smart prick saying he was just looking at the ruins.

I think he got the point of what I said to him and he won't be back.

Base price

OP since you have historic ruins on your land and as you said earlier often have people visiting them then I strongly suggest that you buy a few of these signs and put them up on the gate (entrance), high up on a tree near as close to the entrance as possible etc just to cover your ass
I also assume that you have insurance in place - public liability.

Full Marx

Base price wrote: »

OP since you have historic ruins on your land and as you said earlier often have people visiting them then I strongly suggest that you buy a few of these signs and put them up on the gate (entrance), high up on a tree near as close to the entrance as possible etc just to cover your ass
I also assume that you have insurance in place - public liability.

I understand the duty of care, I have warnings similar to that but TBH they do feck all if someone gets hurt.

Base price

Full Marx wrote: »

I understand the duty of care, I have warnings similar to that but TBH they do feck all if someone gets hurt.

TBH I don't know and thankfully have not had any reason to know.
I read the link (that I posted earlier) a few years ago as we have a spring well and fairy fort on the land. The spring well was used by neighbours until the early 1970's when the local piped water scheme was introduced. The well is no longer used or tested for drinking quality etc. Every few summers we get visitors from America and the UK who would be sons/daughters/grandchildren of the same neighbours that drew water from it, asking us would it be ok if they visited the well and maybe take pictures. The well is in the middle of a 14 acre field with a drain off stream to the lake.
We have Beware of Bull, Electric fence, FBD sign and Occupiers Liability signs at the gate/entrance.

Base price

Two things that I though about after posting above:
1) Duty of care includes making sure that any "hazards" are effectively sign posted or fenced off/made safe - like a quarry or old ruin where falling stones could injure someone.
2) Fairy forts ain't that popular :mad:
The only time someone called to the house to look at the fairy fort was in the 1980's when a man doing research for the national monument society?? asked if he could measure it.