Very small farming Commercial vehicle tax.

223vmax

I have a few acres of land that I graze sheep on during the summer months. I have bought a jeep to pull a trailer as my every day car is not suitable to do so. I have been into the tax office to tax the vehicle and was told I need to fill out a RF 111A form to tax as commercial - even though its declared commercial on the vehicle registration document. This form requires me to add my Income Tax registration number. Now being a lad who grazes a couple of acres in the summer I don't have a tax registration number nor am I registered as a company. This got me thinking surely all farmers are not declared as companies and are registered with CRO. Or am I wrong? What do full time farmers do to get the vehicle taxed? Naturally I have a sheep herd number and & pig number etc...

Zr105

223vmax wrote: »

I have a few acres of land that I graze sheep on during the summer months. I have bought a jeep to pull a trailer as my every day car is not suitable to do so. I have been into the tax office to tax the vehicle and was told I need to fill out a RF 111A form to tax as commercial - even though its declared commercial on the vehicle registration document. This form requires me to add my Income Tax registration number. Now being a lad who grazes a couple of acres in the summer I don't have a tax registration number nor am I registered as a company. This got me thinking surely all farmers are not declared as companies and are registered with CRO. Or am I wrong? What do full time farmers do to get the vehicle taxed? Naturally I have a sheep herd number and & pig number etc...

Is it not just your pps number that you need for it, and normally a declaration yoke that it'll only be used for farm purposes and then a weigh docket from approved weigh bridge

Chiorino

RF111A and PPS number.

223vmax

See attached. It asks for income tax registration number.....Maybe that is what lad do and use PPS number?

whelan2

223vmax wrote: »

See attached. It asks for income tax registration number.....Maybe that is what lad do and use PPS number?

i used pps number and also had to have certificate of commercial insurance for the vehicle

Farrell

whelan2 wrote: »

i used pps number and also had to have certificate of commercial insurance for the vehicle

Can you also add herd number?

whelan2

Farrell wrote: »

Can you also add herd number?

think so, i had to go home and get the actual certificate of insurance , cert on windscreen wouldnt do:rolleyes:

Farmer Pudsey

In some Counties you have to be registered as paying tax as a sole trader. What this means is that you need to be making a tax return on farm income even if you are losing money at it.

If your PPS no is only registered as PAYE they may not allowe you to tax vehicle as commercial. However if you are only farmiong a few acres how come you need a jeep. I have nearly 70 and use hauliers as I find it cheaper. I have a small two cow box that I use if I need to move a single animal or two. I use a van to tow this.

223vmax

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

In some Counties you have to be registered as paying tax as a sole trader. What this means is that you need to be making a tax return on farm income even if you are losing money at it.

If your PPS no is only registered as PAYE they may not allowe you to tax vehicle as commercial. However if you are only farmiong a few acres how come you need a jeep. I have nearly 70 and use hauliers as I find it cheaper. I have a small two cow box that I use if I need to move a single animal or two. I use a van to tow this.

I have sheep, pigs and a couple of ponies. Sick of tearing the arse out of cars pulling stuff. Also filling the boot beyond capacity with bags of meal etc.

smokey-fitz

Use your flock or herd number. Ive been doing it for the last few years with no problems. My brother and mother have done the same so no big deal.

Farmer Pudsey

smokey-fitz wrote: »

Use your flock or herd number. Ive been doing it for the last few years with no problems. My brother and mother have done the same so no big deal.

It depends on the county you are in some county councils require you to be reghistered and paying tax as a sole trader.

223vmax

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

It depends on the county you are in some county councils require you to be reghistered and paying tax as a sole trader.

Which counties?

blue5000

PM sent:cool:

grazeaway

As the above say, herd number will do. That's what I have done with the caddy

Zoo4m8

In Wicklow..used the herd number, absolutely straightforward ..

rangler1

A neighbour of mine got to commercially tax his using his poultry no. I think he has about ten hens

bradygaz

Zoo4m8 wrote: »

In Wicklow..used the herd number, absolutely straightforward ..

Ah was just asking this on the smallholdings forum... In Wicklow myself and have few acres leased for pigs & veg but up a rough steep lane and rough on the car and the boot will only be getting fuller!!... planning on changing to small commercial Sorrento or something in the new year...

Will try the herd number and commercial insurance ...sole trader will be attached to my PPS no...

patsy_mccabe

I've heard that now, if you are taxing a commercial vehicle for the first time, you need to have the herd number in your own name. Is that true?

I know someone it happened to. He had a commercial before too, but they wouldn't accept the form signed by a gardai. Crazy. The only reason he has the commercial is for work on the farm, his elderly fathers farm.

_Brian

I've heard if a few lads applying for flock numbers for home kept chickens and using this for commercial tax purposes.

It's all a bit random from county to county.

arctictree

This whole area seems to be a bit of a joke to be honest. I don't know any lads that have been refused commercial tax and insurance. They all use PPSN No's, flock no's etc etc

Legally aren't you only supposed to be using the Jeep then for farm work? Half the country should be in jail so.

bradygaz

Statement on Wicklow county council site is as follows:

"Applicants should note that if the vehicle is used at any time for social, domestic or pleasure purposes it must be taxed at the private rate"

Would love to know if anyone ever was stopped on this point or got fined etc... would be crazy waste of resources

west79

bradygaz wrote: »

Statement on Wicklow county council site is as follows:

"Applicants should note that if the vehicle is used at any time for social, domestic or pleasure purposes it must be taxed at the private rate"

Would love to know if anyone ever was stopped on this point or got fined etc... would be crazy waste of resources

As long as this law gets some of the travelling sales men off the road (the ones that never pay tax) it is well worth the bother of filling a few details onto a form. I'm all for it

bradygaz

west79 wrote: »

As long as this law gets some of the travelling sales men off the road (the ones that never pay tax) it is well worth the bother of filling a few details onto a form. I'm all for it

I am all for the law too and more than happy to fill out the forms and prove i need the vehicle for my farm work ... I do think though it should be tightened on who can get it but when a person does qualify I think there should be a legal allowance to use the vehicle for outside work.

Zoo4m8

bradygaz wrote: »

Ah was just asking this on the smallholdings forum... In Wicklow myself and have few acres leased for pigs & veg but up a rough steep lane and rough on the car and the boot will only be getting fuller!!... planning on changing to small commercial Sorrento or something in the new year...

Will try the herd number and commercial insurance ...sole trader will be attached to my PPS no...

Don't want to rain on your parade but bought a van back in June and what I thought would be a straight forward process after my experience with the Jeep turned into a complete farce.
Would not accept the form with herd number signed by Garda wanted Glanbia or mart statement, went down again with these to be met by another staff member who said I needed a communication from the dept with my name on it before she could proceed...getting rightly pissed by now, almost gave up but got thick :mad:
Back down with everything again and handed the wad of paperwork over,
'Grand' says she and proceeds to issue the disc, then she stops and says 'where's your tax clearance cert' .. 'Ah sh1t' I thought but I reckoned it was worth winging it , 'it's there with the rest of the stuff' I said ' sure the dept wouldn't issue a payment unless I was tax compliant' ... 'Oh right ' she said and handed over the disc...

Your sole trader status might help but thought I'd give you the heads up..

alps

bradygaz wrote: »

Statement on Wicklow county council site is as follows:

"Applicants should note that if the vehicle is used at any time for social, domestic or pleasure purposes it must be taxed at the private rate"

Would love to know if anyone ever was stopped on this point or got fined etc... would be crazy waste of resources

Yes....and the fine is 3 times the difference of what you should have been paying in private tax......so heading up for 3k with a jeep.
Know of a guy took the crew cab discovery to munster final in Killarney and got stopped by the Gardai on the way.
...Guard asked where they were going...
.....To the match Guard. ..
...That's grand lads , be careful..

3 weeks later 3 grand fine in the post....

Your answer must be work related....

epfff

alps wrote: »

Yes....and the fine is 3 times the difference of what you should have been paying in private tax......so heading up for 3k with a jeep.
Know of a guy took the crew cab discovery to munster final in Killarney and got stopped by the Gardai on the way.
...Guard asked where they were going...
.....To the match Guard. ..
...That's grand lads , be careful..

3 weeks later 3 grand fine in the post....

Your answer must be work related....

Rubbish
Another urban legend
If that was the only conservation with garda how did he know but he was on business at the match

Maybe he was going up to supervise / mystery shopping his employees selling the hats and flags
Maybe he was just going up to do market research to see if his existing business could diversify into event catering

I go to a few matches on and off purely to network couldn't care if neither team turn up
if garda asked me where I was coming from I wouldn't say work would I be considered obstructing the course of justice

Garda will have great fun proving that 1