Tithe Applotment

Thomas from Presence

Hi all,


Just want to test a premise.

John Brunkard (great x 3 Grandfather) has approx 33 statute acres of land in Oldtown, Co. Dublin in Griffiths (1847 I think).

In the Tithe Applotments there are no Brunkards in Oldtown.

The premise - would it be fair to say that the Brunkard family came to lease this land in the time after the applotments?

shanew

or possibly that land was not eligible for Tithe payments


edit : that section of Griffith's Valuation published 15th June 1847

pedroeibar1

At 33 acres the land would have an assessed value IMO. The Tithe Act of 1823 changed the payment method from farm produce to cash based on the size of the land (it also brought pasture land into the tithe ‘pot’). Landowners, leaseholders and tenants had to pay, but conacre lessees did not pay. If the Brunkards owned the land I’d accept your premise that they moved to the area after ’23 – it would be a huge jump financially for a conacre labourer to acquire 33 acres in 20 years. It would be worth investigating pre-Griffith parish registers as they might contain clues – it is an uncommon surname so if one was there it most likely be a local connection.

Thomas from Presence

pedroeibar1 wrote: »

At 33 acres the land would have an assessed value IMO. The Tithe Act of 1823 changed the payment method from farm produce to cash based on the size of the land (it also brought pasture land into the tithe ‘pot’). Landowners, leaseholders and tenants had to pay, but conacre lessees did not pay. If the Brunkards owned the land I’d accept your premise that they moved to the area after ’23 – it would be a huge jump financially for a conacre labourer to acquire 33 acres in 20 years. It would be worth investigating pre-Griffith parish registers as they might contain clues – it is an uncommon surname so if one was there it most likely be a local connection.

Thanks for testing this with me. Just to confirm one point - they leased the land in this instance. From what I have read that the size suggests it was too big for the landowner, a William Digby, to be liable for the tithe.

The transcriptions for the applotments are very often incorrect so in this case I've been looking at the original books for the area.

We had a family in nearby Grallagh that were always known as the cousins and I'm trying to see if this John is where my family departs from them and if he managed to get his own lease. They're in the tithe books with a smaller holding.

It's quite strange prospect as it looks like a guy in his early 30s managed to come into a substantial lease that also included a quarry and a limekiln that he ran as a successful venture.

Thanks again for the input!

The Chieftain

Thomas from Presence wrote: »

Hi all,


Just want to test a premise.

John Brunkard (great x 3 Grandfather) has approx 33 statute acres of land in Oldtown, Co. Dublin in Griffiths (1847 I think).

In the Tithe Applotments there are no Brunkards in Oldtown.

The premise - would it be fair to say that the Brunkard family came to lease this land in the time after the applotments?

Multiple possibilities.
- The simplest and most probable is the one you mention, that they simply moved between the tythe and Griffith's valuations. I have several such occurrences in my families.
- Does the Oldtown townland have roughly the same extent in the tythe and Griffith's valuations? The OSI mapping, which is the basis for the GV, did not always use the same townland definitions as the tythe valuations. They could differ in number, names, borders, and extent. [In comparing extent, you have to allow for differences between Irish and statute measure, and also for remaining systematic differences of about 10%].
- Is there the possibility of multiple Oldtowns?
- Differences in where GV thinks they lived, and where everyone else thought they lived, in terms of which townland (I have seen this - separate effect from my second point).
- As Shanew already mentioned, some areas were not subject to tythe, and therefore may not appear.

pinkypinky

Chieftain, please don't resurrect old threads.