Hypocrites

Little Mickey

I wasn't sure where to post this so mod please move this elsewhere if required. Well just a mini rant. Today I have found a really good place to find hypocrites gathered in swarms - at open farms. I have been for a walk in Jesmond Dene park in Newcastle-upon-Tyne and there is an animal corner in the park - not so much of an open farm but it has farm animals. The weather was nice so there was loads of people about. There they were, looking at the hens, looking at the lambs and various other animals. Comments were exclaimed such as "awh, how cute" and "awh, aren't they lovely". Going by the law of averages it is safe to say that the greater majority of people there were meat eaters. So these same people will sit down for their dinner later and what will they have? Chicken or lamb perhaps? Beef maybe? So, not so cute after all. Total hypocrites, made me angry. It would appear that the complete disconnection between what is on the end of your fork and where it has come from is a big reason why the ratio of meat eaters to vegans / vegitarians is so large.

Grays Sports Almanac

I wouldn't label them all hypocrites.

It's a societal thing. All these people grew up buying meat in a supermarket so there's a large disconnect between the reality of the meat industry and what people are exposed to in their everyday lives.

People are made to believe that animals by and large are treated well and slaughtered humanely for food and they're happy to live in that kind of ignorance because eating meat is 'normal' and healthy.

--LOS--

I'd say most of those people already believe two big myths;

1. we need to eat meat
2. the animals are killed humanely so its ok

They don't need to question anything when they just accept that so they just don't see what you see.

The myths are slow to dispel. All of the science, the evidence is there for ages, it's conclusive, but like anything like this it takes a while to treacle down to the point of common knowledge. Climate change deniers are still persistent after this long Meateaters are the same in my eyes.

Most people profess to be animal lovers, most people would say they're against cruelty to animals, but it's a massive disconnect obviously, they're saying one thing, their behaviour says another. How many people do you know that aren't vegan/vegetarian that even have any clue of the whole process of farm to plate, I mean a lot of the time if veganism comes up in conversation it becomes clear very quickly that the person you're talking to doesn't have a grasp of basic biology, people think cows are unlike all other mammals and just produce milk without being pregnant! And we're the weirdos for being logical. But then meateaters have to defy logic to explain away their cognitive dissonance. It's frustrating to deal with when you've already 'seen the light'. But then you have to remember that most of us weren't born into veganism/vegetarianism, we made the connection somewhere along the line so surely we could empathise with meat-eaters. But it's a strange thing because it is kinda something you have to stop and think about, before you are veggie/vegan you don't tend to question a belief system that is invisible. Sometimes things seem so obvious to us and when it's not to most other people it can lead you to anger and disdain for people who are the people we once were. I think it does help to understand the psychology of it so you don't turn against the whole of humanity :pac: Melanie Joy has a good talk on carnism.....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pujzQq91b7I

I was reading "eat like you care" a while back, I think it's written more for meat-eaters and it would be a great book if you're questioning your habits, but I would recommend it if you're already vegetarian or vegan too, it goes through all those common questions that people ask, can be a handy reference for speaking to meateaters. The first half of it from memory focuses on two main beliefs that everyone already has. One of them was that we all agree unnecessary suffering is wrong. It circles back to the two main beliefs (cant remember second one) throughout in a way that really makes a reader confront their contradictory thinking. I just like it because it works with a logic that is already there, we all love animals and most of us don't want to hurt animals, we're not so different after all. You can understand these things and still be angry of course, sometimes something will just really set me off. At the minute I'm sick of everyone sharing those pictures of that girl hunter and spouting vile about her and threatening her with all sorts, meanwhile they close their eyes to the dead animals on their plate every day. Or the ones who were all over that Tony the dog story, nearly 8000 people on facebook looking for justice, not afraid to mince their words about how barbaric animal cruelty is, but just some animal cruelty because they pick and choose. You show the same emotion about the animals you eat and you're a crazie. Those people are the most frustrating which I hate because they are usually more caring people but then it's just they show so much potential but it's a complete disconnect. But it's just as frustrating to see vegans wishing people dead and calling for people to be named and shamed, for what, so that an angry mob can descend on them and we can beat our belief in compassion and non violence into them is it I just cringe at comments in that vein online.

But going back to the petting zoo..... there's one near me in Amstel Park here. It's not the worst thing ever ok and I like seeing the animals there if I pass by. But it was open to people one day when my sister was here and it was full of kids free to walk around all of the animals and my sister went in too, she kept calling me in but I just wouldn't, there was already so many people in around the animals, I just wanted to leave them alone and not be annoying them. She couldn't understand what was wrong me that I wouldn't go in, but ye it's just an uncomfortable thing.

So the subtotal of all that waffle.....it's just classic cognitive dissonance, most people do (at least they believe they do) love animals and care about cruelty to animals, they then go through a load of mental gymnastics that lets them love animals and hurt animals at the same time, so they come across as hypocrites, they just need some help making the connection.

ch750536

Slightly related.

I was on a night out with 7 guys last night. I mentioned I don't drink milk. One of the guys said 'Err, whats wrong with milk' - I expected the 'he's a nutter' line to come out.

To my astonishment those who questioned milk consumption were the majority. Messages are getting through.

Zombienosh

I think about this lately, there are a good few people I know getting into fierce online debates about the hunting/Ricky Gervais pictures going around.
Now I mean getting seriously into some outrageous comments about killing people for harming these animals and about how upset they are because they love animals so god damn much...

but I know for a fact they eat them.......

Level 5 Vegan

Yeah the Ricky Gervais stuff brings them out in full force. I don't get too wound up about it, I guess it's the world we live in people don't make the connection, but I remember reading an interview with Ricky Gervais before and he was saying things like he's 'basically' vegetarian, just eats fish mostly but loves cheese couldn't give it up etc. Christ like he wasn't even trying.

Morrissey gets a lot of it too, but he wrote a post a couple of weeks ago on true to you titled 'Glastonbury Festival is not animal friendly' in which he had a go at the head of it about being a dairy farmer etc. So looks like he might actually be properly vegan. In fact he talks about hypocrisy because this was shortly after the Crufts' poisoning scandal.

BMJD

Ricky Gervaise:
2008

'So I'm nearly a vegetarian apart from chicken and very, very heavily disguised meats. You can't put a thing on my table that looks like it could run round the planet. I don't want to see eyes or legs. I don't want to be reminded this was an air-breathing mammal.'

http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2008/dec/14/ricky-gervais-food-restaurants


2014

Cheese aside, what are your other favorite foods?
I love Indian, Chinese. Italian is probably my favorite. It’s one of those countries where I know I can eat. Because I’m quite squeamish, really. I’m philistine and unsophisticated—not because of my great discerning palate but other reasons. Some are moral grounds, some texture. I try to rule out any cruelty; I don’t eat red meat. I eat some fish if it’s sustainable and ethical, and even then I don’t like slimy fish. Nothing to do with morality, I just don’t like anything too wriggly, or squid-y, or with too many eyes looking at me, or uncooked. Forget raw fish—I mean, they’re laughing at me with that. They don’t even cook it—no, I’m not having that! I’ll have fish fingers. That’s my favorite fish: The finger fish.

Anything you’ve come around to over the years?
No. My girlfriend loves oysters and…no. No! It’s a saucer of snot. Why would I do that? And then it gets emotional—I don’t want to eat a little friend or a pet. [Laughs] If I do eat meat, it’s got to be ethical. I want to know that it lived a great life before it was killed humanely. Then it needs to be disguised—I have to think it’s tofu. If I see a bit of blood or a vein—just, no. If I’m at all worried about the ethics of the meat, I’ll go vegetarian. In fact, in most posh restaurants, it’s like they’re challenging you. It’s like, “See that fish over there enjoying itself? We’re gonna cave its head in and bring it to you with its little face on. Are you man enough?”

http://www.bonappetit.com/people/celebrities/article/ricky-gervais-interview

To me, those look like the words of a Facebook like-whore/Twitter retweet-whore.

blatantrereg

Gervais is an awful hypcrite alright. Saw that stuff about him being a vegetarian except for meat and fish and that he loves to gobble cheese. (He wasn't trying to be funny, to clarify.) The outrage and fury by meat eaters towards the hunter is bizarre. The noisiest and most violent sounding critics of her seem to be completely indifferent regarding their own actions.

No interest in Morrissey personally, but I do get the impression he has the courage of his convictions. I read that he claims to get surges of rage when driving past mcdonalds and places like that. Strikes me as mite dramatic but I put it down to him being a genuine oddball, rather than that he's talking through his hoop. Don't know how his followers go on.

blatantrereg

I think he appeals to the sort of people who want to feel good about themselves for being compassionate animal lovers, but also don't want to compromise their own indulgence - or actually do anything that helps animals.... and like demonising other people who do slightly different but not necessarily worse things than they do themselves.

Level 5 Vegan

Yeah those Gervais interviews are just stupid. Worse than I remember now that I read them again. Actually doing a lot more harm than good if people listen to those justifications.

I have a few friends on facebook who seem to post about only 2 things. 1) Photos of their delicious chicken curry or 2) asking for signatures on an e-petition to release a 40 year old tiger from a petting zoo in Indonesia or some other stupid thing 10,000 miles away.

Who doesn't wanna be seen as an animal lover though I suppose. Even the most bashful of hunters and foie gras connoisseurs will post photos of their pedigree puppys etc.