Ryan Moore confirmed as Ballydoyle New Number 1 Jockey

krustydoyle

Confirmed this evening

http://www.sportinglife.com/racing/news/article/465/9797198/horse-racing-news-aidan-obrien-confirms-ryan-moore-as-leading-ballydoyle-jockey

Francie Barrett

Surprised it took them this long to come to the decision.

krustydoyle

Its hard to imagine it was over money, I know i read somewhere a few years ago that Ballydoyle insisted that the jockey be based in Ireland so id say it was minor details like that.

madmoose

So glad he will be on gleneagles for the guineas for me then.

Andalucia

Joseph put a few nails in his own coffin last year, his ride on Gleneagles in France was one of them, after that Tabor called Aidans' bluff

jimjamcos

madmoose wrote: »

So glad he will be on gleneagles for the guineas for me then.

Yea, would much rather have him looking at Faydhan's arse than Joseph! :-)

andyman

I would imagine the weight was the final nail in the coffin. He just can't make the weight consistently anymore.

Good riddance too. The lad was making himself very sick

Harry Angstrom

I'm astonished that a professional no-nonsense profit-making organisation like Coolmore put up with Joseph's weight issues for so long. I feel sorry for him, but when you're putting up a pound or two overweight in Group races, it can make a huge difference at the business end. Were it not for the fact that he's Aidan's son, he would've been replaced earlier.

Lt J.R. Bell

Harry Angstrom wrote: »

I'm astonished that a professional no-nonsense profit-making organisation like Coolmore put up with Joseph's weight issues for so long. I feel sorry for him, but when you're putting up a pound or two overweight in Group races, it can make a huge difference at the business end. Were it not for the fact that he's Aidan's son, he would've been replaced earlier.

He might not have even got anywhere near the job in the first place, being so young.Sure Spencer got the job but he was related to Magnier

It would be funny if Joey wins a few big ones as the second jockey, like Moore has done for theybloss two years (eg Derby, Guineas..)

It would be nice if he shuts people up with some decent wins over hurdles

Not his biggest fan, but, its easy for us armchair jockeys to have a go, not knowing what 8stone 9 has felt like since we were very young.

It's mad, his only 21 and had done more than some jockeys in a lifetime. Look at Richard Hughes, a fine jockey with a huge yard and look at the amount of classics he has won compared to Joseph.

Murtagh,Smullen all multiple champion jockeys. Yet Joseph broke Kinanes long standing record in a season.

BumperD

Point of information. JOB was never appointed no 1. He just rode for them.
He's an excellent jockey. Nature caught up with him. That is all.

The last 3 stable jockeys were discarded in a business like fashion. I suspect the same will happen with Moore, despite his brilliance.

Gregk961

I really cant understand this move from Moores perspective. Coming off possibly his best season to date, all he has done is limited himself.

Pros: Hefty retainer, guaranteed classics, hefty retainer.

Cons: Less freedom, Irish midweek meetings (I presume he will be required for these) maximum pressure/expectations from connections, media, fans. Picking the wrong horse and have Donnacha, Joseph or god forbid Ana storming past you in the home straight.

Gregk961

BumperD wrote: »

Point of information. JOB was never appointed no 1. He just rode for them.
He's an excellent jockey. Nature caught up with him. That is all

Id be fairly neutral to Joseph, Im far from one of the ridiculous "that fella couldn't ride a pony" people but to say he is an excellent jockey is a stretch surely? I think if you were to ask him for his own honest opinion, excellent would not be the adjective used.

Weight issues aside, he made his fair share of mistakes throughout the years. Every top jockey makes errors but frequent (not as frequent as the pocket talkers will tell you) errors with pace and positioning are not the hallmarks of an "excellent" jockey. He made an absolute stinker just last weekend when trying to reinvent hinself as a NH jocke, never seen a horse get whipped before taking a flight before I dont believe?

Joseph is a decent jockey, but you could probably find a handful of 5lb claimers that could do the same job as him.

Should focus on being healthy and a normal young man for the time being

Lt J.R. Bell

Gregk961 wrote: »

I really cant understand this move from Moores perspective. Coming off possibly his best season to date, all he has done is limited himself.

Pros: Hefty retainer, guaranteed classics, hefty retainer.

Cons: Less freedom, Irish midweek meetings (I presume he will be required for these) maximum pressure/expectations from connections, media, fans. Picking the wrong horse and have Donnacha, Joseph or god forbid Ana storming past you in the home straight.

Well, he won some of his major races for O'Brien and the Japanese, and a German trainer and people not called Sir Michael Stoute, this year. He had a chance to ride Sole Power (rode him earlier in the year, but had to ride Stoutes horse at Newmarket last May)

He never came across as someone who cared about the media.

Chances of being beaten by Obrien kids,or Seamie and Colm, meh, it happens, all jockeys make wrong decisions

If it was good enough for Lester Piggott (alas Vincent Obrien), Mick Kinane, Johnny Murtagh and Fallon......

Would you turn down more Classics, Irish and British? The odd Breeders Cup?

BumperD

Gregk961 wrote: »

He made an absolute stinker just last weekend when trying to reinvent hinself as a NH jocke, never seen a horse get whipped before taking a flight before I dont believe?

Yes, that did look bad. Think that was one of first few rides over hurdles on course. So I wouldn't class him as an excellent nh rider as he's just starting out on that road and I wish him the best if he pursues that career.

Everyone has bad rides and he probably had more this past year given he was starving himself. In equal measure, I recall him being coolness personified in an Epsom derby a few yrs back when riding the red hot fav. Was it rip van winlkle he rode to win at the breeders cup? For a young man, he handled pressure with ease. I also recall him giving some peach rides at a galway festival one yr in his amateur days, bringing in 3 or 4 winners. Granted, he was born into a family and surroundings of opportunity that only a few get so he had every support in the world as he set out on his riding career.

I guess I'm just a little conscious of the regularity with which we are inclined to stick the boot in on people when things don't go right for them so I'm trying to balance it out.

Gregk961

Lt J.R. Bell wrote: »

Well, he won some of his major races for O'Brien and the Japanese, and a German trainer and people not called Sir Michael Stoute, this year. He had a chance to ride Sole Power (rode him earlier in the year, but had to ride Stoutes horse at Newmarket last May)

He never came across as someone who cared about the media.

Chances of being beaten by Obrien kids,or Seamie and Colm, meh, it happens, all jockeys make wrong decisions

If it was good enough for Lester Piggott (alas Vincent Obrien), Mick Kinane, Johnny Murtagh and Fallon......

Would you turn down more Classics, Irish and British? The odd Breeders Cup?

The thing is he had all those things anyway, with the only real exception being the no.1 ride in the classics. Quite possible he will end up with less group 1s than he would have had anyway

Lt J.R. Bell

Gregk961 wrote: »

The thing is he had all those things anyway, with the only real exception being the no.1 ride in the classics. Quite possible he will end up with less group 1s than he would have had anyway

Yes, but, will he this year?

Who has Stoute got this year? I am not sure that he had any good 2 year olds from last year. The older horses, okay Dank and Integral maybe still have it,if in trainin. What about the over rated Hillsstar and Telescope? Domest Domestically, no, but Internationals in Canada okay,but that's hardly going to keep you going.

Hannon will always throw him a decent ride, but for Group 1?

Haggas And Fahy?

Charlie Hill seemed to have a good bunch of Prince Khalid two year olds last year

No guarantee the Grey Gatsby will be as good this year. Okay, Dubai, he was running at a short distance and sweated up and he ran well, but...

While I have little confidence that Obrien will have a super year; which older horse not called Leading Light and Adelaide (will he be good enough in Newmarket and Ascot?) do they now have?

Not sure of many of the classics bar Glen eagles and JFK, (I haven't seen much of the Fillies) he is still guaranteed to be on contenders and has potential to be top jockey at Ascot. The O'Briens didn't have the best Ascot for winners last year but lots of seconds that might have being wins on another Jockey like Moore.

He is in a strong position. He can demand to have freedom to ride for others. Its worth taking the chance now at least for 2 years. If Barry Geraghty and Ruby Walsh did the plane hopping, so could Moore. It's not like he is millions of miles away, sure, he travels further for one race.

It's not like his trophy cabinet is brimming with Classics, whether in Ireland or UK. No St Ledger, No 2000 Guineas...

Hughes will run away with the jockeys titles as Hannon has alot of Arsenal, unless Goldolpin are truly back and continue using Buick, Doyle, Kirby


Ballydoyle genuinely have a battle this year with Welds as he had added Agha Khan to his long list of patrons. Bolger and Halford have Goldolpin Horses and of Goldolpin are serious, they will send over their best jockeys (I rate Foley however).

Last year had a lot of disappointments (but still placed)even though the did the Derby double. They need the best jockeys around and would likely not make it an issue over money

shamdrog63

Ballydoyle deserve the best and Ryan Moore IS the best.Stoute doesn,t have the ammo & riding Hannons 2nd string doesn,t compare with having good chances in all the top races in Britain & Ireland for the next few years.He,s not bothered about the jockeys championship.Buick & Doyle and the excellent Graham Lee can scrap with Hughes for that.Joseph O Brien has had a brilliant time of it but I suspect he knew this time would come and he seems to be a quick learner so wouldn,t discount his NH career but wouldn,t recommend he try his luck over fences any time soon.

Lt J.R. Bell

shamdrog63 wrote: »

Ballydoyle deserve the best and Ryan Moore IS the best.Stoute doesn,t have the ammo & riding Hannons 2nd string doesn,t compare with having good chances in all the top races in Britain & Ireland for the next few years.He,s not bothered about the jockeys championship.Buick & Doyle and the excellent Graham Lee can scrap with Hughes for that.Joseph O Brien has had a brilliant time of it but I suspect he knew this time would come and he seems to be a quick learner so wouldn,t discount his NH career but wouldn,t recommend he try his luck over fences any time soon.

He is still younger than some of the conditional jockeys lol.

Don't know where he will get his rides from.Aidan's horses aren't in any great shake

fizzyboy

Lt J.R. Bell wrote: »

He might not have even got anywhere near the job in the first place, being so young.Sure Spencer got the job but he was related to Magnier

It would be funny if Joey wins a few big ones as the second jockey, like Moore has done for theybloss two years (eg Derby, Guineas..)

It would be nice if he shuts people up with some decent wins over hurdles

Not his biggest fan, but, its easy for us armchair jockeys to have a go, not knowing what 8stone 9 has felt like since we were very young.

It's mad, his only 21 and had done more than some jockeys in a lifetime. Look at Richard Hughes, a fine jockey with a huge yard and look at the amount of classics he has won compared to Joseph.

Murtagh,Smullen all multiple champion jockeys. Yet Joseph broke Kinanes long standing record in a season.

Smullen will break the record this year the way he's going...

Lt J.R. Bell

fizzyboy wrote: »

Smullen will break the record this year the way he's going...

The season is still young, Ballydoyle haven't started yet. Let's see about that. Ballydoyle are only interested in Group 1s Smullen is welcome to the Group3 and listed and handicaps.

Based on last year, O'Brien had a shocker at the start but reeled in Bolger and Weld. Like Joey, Smullen rides/wins mainly for one guy.

Champion yes, record of over 125? Wouldn't be keen on betting on that

Still whose's his competition? Kevin Manning? Ha.

Time for Wayne Lordan to get his act together, as too Chris Hayes and Shane Folely

Peintre Celebre

Do you seriously think Weld will be challenging O'Briem for the Classics, no chance, forget the Aga they're too backward, am I right in thinking Alandi was his last gr.1 winner in Ireland? Get the fillies to win a maiden early in the season and at least they can get a win on their page any black type is a bonus. Most of the colts will be gelded and be running over hurdles this time next year

Lt J.R. Bell

Peintre Celebre wrote: »

Do you seriously think Weld will be challenging O'Briem for the Classics, no chance, forget the Aga they're too backward, am I right in thinking Alandi was his last gr.1 winner in Ireland? Get the fillies to win a maiden early in the season and at least they can get a win on their page any black type is a bonus. Most of the colts will be gelded and be running over hurdles this time next year

Do I think? No , but I disagree that he has no chance. The English, if brave enough, should try and raid a few

I don't think O'Briens group, bar Gleneagles and JFK are that great this year. The luck has got to run out eventually.last year wasn't great for him compared to other years

Jake Stiles

Good appointment for both parties involved.

longshotvalue

I know that horse was miles clear but he is just different gravy. Unlike most jockeys he is thinking his way around for the whole race. That was a pleasure to watch..