Jaguar's lack of success here - Can new XE change it?

goochy · 29-03-2015 4:02pm #1

Jaguar in ireland seem to be a bit like saab ,never a big no. of new cars sold but a very common sight on our roads. obviously alot of used cars imported and there seems to be decent demand for used cars.

however jaguar still remain a niche brand here. can a half decent 3 series rival - the xe -change that ? jaguar did not have decent models during the celtic tiger years so couldnt succeed here during those years- the hi end xj and xk models were good though - then when the current xj and xf arrived during the recession which didnt help.

The 2.2dsl xf has sold reasonably well but no where near german rivals figures

i can only put it down to the old man image and small dealer network . being a british brand doesnt hold land rover back here and their reliability isnt great.
hear joe duffy/ hb dennis are building a new JLR dealership which should help sales

lyons of limerick - after over 2 years as a dealer sell the cars from a prefab showroom and bolands sell jags in a ford showroom so the dealer network needs improving too

RandomAccess · 29-03-2015 7:49pm

To put it bluntly the only thing thats going to matter for volume sales is the road tax.

colm_mcm · 29-03-2015 7:51pm

And (projected) resale value for PCP, along with low cost financing.

liam7831 · 29-03-2015 8:12pm

There muck anyway & the price of parts is a joke

kooga · 29-03-2015 8:15pm

Unless the importer becomes a subsidiary of jag UK it will be a small player plus the strength of sterling won't help in addition spec has to be the same as the UK

OldMrBrennan83 · 29-03-2015 8:16pm

This post has been deleted.

HandsomeDan · 29-03-2015 8:24pm

RandomAccess wrote: »

To put it bluntly the only thing thats going to matter for volume sales is the road tax.

Low tax gains it entry to the market.

At this price point, and given the lack of brand cache, the car needs to be good to sell in large quantities.

Leonard Hofstadter · 29-03-2015 8:56pm

The feedback from the press suggests that it's top of the class. It was the British press, though....

L-M · 29-03-2015 8:58pm

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

If you are in a position to buy a new Jaguar you can be sure cost of everything is an issue.

Drummerboy08 · 29-03-2015 8:59pm

That type of car is a big player in the fleet market, and i cant see it doing well there. It'll be blown out of the water by the 3 series and A4.

listermint · 29-03-2015 9:07pm

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

That type of car is a big player in the fleet market, and i cant see it doing well there. It'll be blown out of the water by the 3 series and A4.

Bar the fact it looks better and the interior is a nicer more interesting place to be.

HandsomeDan · 29-03-2015 9:11pm

listermint wrote: »

Bar the fact it looks better and the interior is a nicer more interesting place to be.

From the pics the interior looks subpar. Like something from 2005.

Oafley Jones · 29-03-2015 9:22pm

HandsomeDan wrote: »

From the pics the interior looks subpar. Like something from 2005.

I'm a fan of the newer Jags, but I think the XE is fairly disappointing. I can't see it taking many sales from anyone. I agree about the interior, it's gotten a fair amount of flak and rightly so; It's just so dreary and dull. Not a fan of the new XF either.

MadYaker · 29-03-2015 9:26pm

The XF would have sold better if it came with a 2l diesel like all the germans its going head to head with (5 series, E class, A6 etc) For ages there was only the 2.9 or 3.0 and the a 2.2 which sold reasonably well but like others said it all comes down to road tax and resale value. The XE looks nice but it hasn't a hope of knocking the 3 series off its pedestal, Merc and Audi have been trying for decades to no avail.

goochy · 29-03-2015 9:53pm

uk mags are very pro jag - list loads of faults but then say a jag is best in class. sales there are no where near german brands either

trabpc · 29-03-2015 11:20pm

goochy wrote: »

uk mags are very pro jag - list loads of faults but then say a jag is best in class. sales there are no where near german brands either

I think it will do well. Not as if BMW can build a decent diesel that does not self implode over past 8 years. Far nicer looking than any a4 or 320

Tragedy · 29-03-2015 11:28pm

The XE interior is heavily based on the XJ, which had (imho) the nicest interior of any of the large luxury cars. Go see it in person! I was lucky enough to get a look at one while in Coventry.

mickdw · 29-03-2015 11:52pm

Tragedy wrote: »

The XE interior is heavily based on the XJ, which had (imho) the nicest interior of any of the large luxury cars. Go see it in person! I was lucky enough to get a look at one while in Coventry.

The current xj is stunning inside. The xe while using similar idea doesn't do it for me at all.

Tropheus · 29-03-2015 11:55pm

Jag are sponsoring some of the Sky primetime programs. Oddly, the ads don't show a picture of the car. Doesn't say much for their confidence in the design.

Tragedy · 30-03-2015 12:54am

mickdw wrote: »

The current xj is stunning inside. The xe while using similar idea doesn't do it for me at all.

There isn't a huge difference in dash, steering wheel or centre column other than in quality of materials and switchgear, and the XJ using round vents. They both have the defining crease that runs from door to door atop the dash, and a fairly...'sparse' dash top featuring a vast expanse of leather (i'm assuming some sort of textured faux leather on the XE though).

If one wants to talk awful, one only needs to look at the mess that is the 2014 A4 interior

Drummerboy08 · 30-03-2015 9:21am

listermint wrote: »

Bar the fact it looks better and the interior is a nicer more interesting place to be.

Grand. Still doesn't mean it will do well in a fleet market.

Driver decides he wants it, financial controller decides its too expensive and you get an A4 instead.

tw0nk · 30-03-2015 9:41am

really like this car, my friend has the current model XF and it's now one of my favourite cars. Driving position and feel is great, suitably powered with the 3.0 litre diesel engine. Only caveat of the XF is the rear visibility when reverse and parallel parking, however the reverse camera and sensors go some way to making up for that.

I have to laugh when people comment on dull/poor interiors for cars like XE, I have yet to be in an a4/a6, 3/5 series with a non-dull interior, especially with the specs most cars are sold with in Ireland. Admittedly the higher end cars under these marques do offer nice interiors (7 series, A7/A8) and practically all the new Mercs.

I think Jaguar should be applauded for standing out a bit and really changing their image, going more towards their sporting heritage (XJ220/etype etc) than their last 2 decades of 'grande' cars.

Why they dont sell so well in Ireland? My opinion is 3 things:
1. They are expensive cars
2. The dealer network doesn't exist
3. Irish car buyers are mostly of sheep mentality and driven by reg plate and badge than choice

ShaunieVW · 30-03-2015 9:43am

4. The built quality is poor.
5. Price of parts are a joke.

tw0nk · 30-03-2015 10:09am

ShaunieVW wrote: »

4. The built quality is poor.
5. Price of parts are a joke.

Apply the same to both BMW and Audi

I have owned BMW, and some good friends own Audi's, both marques have had a lot of repairs and components fail and cost a lot to replace.

I do expect, the more mass-produced cars like BMW and Audi to be a little better in terms of reliability alright, but not enough to make this the reason to buy over a Jag.

ShaunieVW · 30-03-2015 10:39am

I own an Audi, Parts are cheap enough thanks to the size of the VAG range and how many different cars one part is applied too. I had a BMW too parts were above average but not as bad as people make out. Id buy a 10 year old Jag no bother as they are worth F all and a lot of car for the money. But only one with a decent engine. Would I buy one new that isn't the f-type? No.

tw0nk · 30-03-2015 10:41am

haha, would love an f-type!

mickdw · 30-03-2015 1:28pm

Just saw pics of 2016 xf.
It's fantastic.

jimgoose · 30-03-2015 1:52pm

liam7831 wrote: »

There muck anyway & the price of parts is a joke

I have a sixteen-year old Jag with 154,000 miles on it. It's built like a brick shat-hoose and pulls like a Napier Deltic, only silently.

HandsomeDan wrote: »

From the pics the interior looks subpar. Like something from 2005.

The XE interior does remind me somewhat of the latest Insignia or even Passat, only more understated, classy and very Jaaag. :cool:

MadYaker wrote: »

The XF would have sold better if it came with a 2l diesel like all the germans its going head to head with (5 series, E class, A6 etc) For ages there was only the 2.9 or 3.0 and the a 2.2 which sold reasonably well but like others said it all comes down to road tax and resale value. The XE looks nice but it hasn't a hope of knocking the 3 series off its pedestal, Merc and Audi have been trying for decades to no avail.

The AJD-V6 twin-turbodiesel unit was 2.7l until 2009, then it became 3.0l. The 2.2l diesel XFs seem to have sold like hot cakes down here during 2013 particularly, and 2014. They're a lovely bitta kit, I test-drove one of the first of them back in 2008. The current 2.2l unit is hitting the €280pa tax-band which is a bit of a pain from a marketing point of view, but I don't think in reality XF customers are too bothered about it, especially given that they are a tremendous amount of motorcar for the price. To me, it goes to show that that capacity and design was engineer-led, as opposed to marketing-led, or "gobadaws who formulate motor-tax policy"-led.

The entry-level diesel XE will come in at €180pa, which is higher than an F10 BMW but so what! :pac:

trabpc · 30-03-2015 9:52pm

Can't believe tax of 280 vs 180 matters one bit on a 50k car. Oh wait, "chape tax lad" land.

listermint · 30-03-2015 10:21pm

I've been in and out of the F10 and the father has An A6 C7 in interior on both are as bland in comparison to the XE. Bland.

trabpc · 30-03-2015 10:34pm

listermint wrote: »

I've been in and out of the F10 and the father has An A6 C7 in interior on both are as bland in comparison to the XE. Bland.

I wouldn't trust a current BMW diesel but the F10 internally and ex must be one of the best out there currently. The XE IMO is v nice looking too

hfallada · 30-03-2015 10:38pm

I think its an image problem. You consider BMW, Audi to be young and sexy. Where as Jag is very much a old, rich man car. I dont think very many thirty somethings would consider a Jag over a BMW due to the their older image

Tragedy · 30-03-2015 10:46pm

I don't see any young people driving F10's, and while I appreciate their presence they are ANYTHING but sexy or youthful.

road_high · 30-03-2015 10:48pm

Jag need to work on their branding. It's not all that clear what/who they are and even the badge logo doesn't have the household revered status of BMW/Audi or even their sister Land Rover.

listermint · 31-03-2015 5:58am

hfallada wrote: »

I think its an image problem. You consider BMW, Audi to be young and sexy. Where as Jag is very much a old, rich man car. I dont think very many thirty somethings would consider a Jag over a BMW due to the their older image

This was a conversation I had with the lads in the pub. All early thirties. There wasn't one who wouldn't drive the XE they all thing the internal and external styling is fantastic especially the sport. From experience I don't know anyone that doesn't like it from what captive audience I have. Also they all appreciate the badge and view the car as being not typical of the 3 series in the car park so that made them appreciate it more.

Id say it's down to dealer network.

ba_barabus · 31-03-2015 9:19am

OSI wrote: »

Can't even find prices for the XE on their Irish site. Half of a thought of one in the back of my mind, but I'd like to have some idea of what to expect before travelling for an hour to the opposite end of the city to take a look at one, assuming they even have one on display.

A quick look at the website suggests more info will be available from April 1st.

RedorDead · 31-03-2015 10:46pm

MadYaker wrote: »

The XE looks nice but it hasn't a hope of knocking the 3 series off its pedestal, Merc and Audi have been trying for decades to no avail.

Maybe in the UK? Here and in Germany A4 outsells 3er despite being priced above it. Here A4 has outsold 3er for 6 off the last 7 years.

Tragedy wrote: »

There isn't a huge difference in dash, steering wheel or centre column other than in quality of materials and switchgear, and the XJ using round vents. They both have the defining crease that runs from door to door atop the dash, and a fairly...'sparse' dash top featuring a vast expanse of leather (i'm assuming some sort of textured faux leather on the XE though).

If one wants to talk awful, one only needs to look at the mess that is the 2014 A4 interior

This car was launched in 07 and hasnt changed a whole lot since then and its successor will be unveiled in the summer. Hardly a fair comparison to a car that when it was launched was generally lauded as the best interior in its class.

hfallada wrote: »

I think its an image problem. You consider BMW, Audi to be young and sexy. Where as Jag is very much a old, rich man car. I dont think very many thirty somethings would consider a Jag over a BMW due to the their older image

This! The two main issues Jaguar have here in Ireland are the lack of a network and the positioning. Jaguar is perceived as old luxury. How many young people aspire to own a jag? Massive investment needed in its product range with small SUVs and hatchback required if they are ever going to go after younger buyers.

Tragedy · 31-03-2015 11:32pm

RedorDead wrote: »

This car was launched in 07 and hasnt changed a whole lot since then and its successor will be unveiled in the summer. Hardly a fair comparison to a car that when it was launched was generally lauded as the best interior in its class.

It doesn't really matter until the new one is launched, as that's what it's competing against.

People on here always seem to love Audi interiors but I've never gotten it. Functional aesthetics, very little design flair, zero ingenuity and always irredeemably dull.

goochy · 01-04-2015 8:32am