how to crack irish prepostional pronouns

f140

can sing off all the lists domn, duit, do... orm ,ort, air,uirthi bjut cant use them in context. how do you master to know which one to use.


for example how do you learn when to use uaim,or chugam. for example its Scríobh litir chugam. how would one learn that chugam is the right prepositional pronoun here? the only way that I knew it was from learning the basic phrase off by heart but if I broke it up I couldn't explain

AnLonDubh

f140 wrote: »

for example how do you learn when to use uaim,or chugam. for example its Scríobh litir chugam. how would one learn that chugam is the right prepositional pronoun here? the only way that I knew it was from learning the basic phrase off by heart but if I broke it up I couldn't explain

What you are really talking about is not the prepositions themselves as such, but their use with verbs, so called prepositional verbs, which the Celtic languages are unusual fond of compared to other languages.

A piece of advice I got from an old native speaker is that each of the prepositions has a certain meaning in Irish, that doesn't correspond exactly with the English translation ("le" is not exactly "with" for instance.) Eventually you just learn enough of these verbs to get a feeling for what a preposition means and you naturally begin to use the correct ones, but a bit of a break down (I have Munster Irish, so some things might seem odd if you're not familiar with it):

Le:
"With", but closer to "together with". Also used instrumentally, i.e. I swept the floor with the broom.
The meaning of "together with" causes it to be used in a lot of verbs where two parties or objects interact.
ag éist leis = listening to it
ag díol leis = paying him

ar
(a) "on"
(b) "looks like/appears that way". Tá sneachta air = Looks like it'll snow.
(c) "above", in the sense of power, authority, being better or having an advantage. Rugadh bua air = "They" bet him.
(d) concerning, about. Scéal ar na Fiannaibh = A story about the Fianna.

ar has all these meanings, because it actually used to be three prepositions for, iar and ar, which all came to be pronounced ar, although today most dialects pronounce it air anyway.

chun
Toward, to, but only spatially.
Seol leitir chugham = Send a letter to me.

The meaning of toward has lead to a derived meaning of "in order to" (similar to the older English use of "toward" to mean "in order to")
Chuas go dtí an sosadh chun mo mháthair a dh'fheiscint = I went to the station (in order) to see my mother.

as
from, out of.
Either in the sense of "originating from" or "outside of".

as obair = out of work
as Gaillimh = from Galway
as mo radharc = out of sight (Fág as m' radharc a mhic = Get the **** out of my way)

In many dialects this is just a before a consonant:
a' Cíll Dara = from Kildare.

ag
Leaving aside its broad use with the verbal noun (ag rith) and possession (tá cat ag an bhfear) this mostly means:
(a) spatial "at".
ag an mBuailtín = at Buailtín (a village)
(b) part of (a group of people)
Bhí cuid acu ann = Some of them were there.

fé/faoi/fá: Many dialectal forms of this preposition.
(a) under. Fén mbord = under the table
(b) Some dialects use this to mean about about:
ag caint fé rud = talking about something
(c) plan/intend. Tá fúm dul = I plan/intent to go.

idir
(a) Both, idir mnáibh agus fearaibh = both men and women
(b) between

I'll be back with more.

gaiscioch

AnLonDubh wrote: »

What you are really talking about is not the prepositions themselves as such, but their use with verbs, so called prepositional verbs, which the Celtic languages are unusual fond of compared to other languages.

A piece of advice I got from an old native speaker is that each of the prepositions has a certain meaning in Irish, that doesn't correspond exactly with the English translation ("le" is not exactly "with" for instance.) Eventually you just learn enough of these verbs to get a feeling for what a preposition means and you naturally begin to use the correct ones, but a bit of a break down (I have Munster Irish, so some things might seem odd if you're not familiar with it):

Le:
"With", but closer to "together with". Also used instrumentally, i.e. I swept the floor with the broom.
The meaning of "together with" causes it to be used in a lot of verbs where two parties or objects interact.
ag éist leis = listening to it
ag díol leis = paying him

ar
(a) "on"
(b) "looks like/appears that way". Tá sneachta air = Looks like it'll snow.
(c) "above", in the sense of power, authority, being better or having an advantage. Rugadh bua air = "They" bet him.
(d) concerning, about. Scéal ar na Fiannaibh = A story about the Fianna.

ar has all these meanings, because it actually used to be three prepositions for, iar and ar, which all came to be pronounced ar, although today most dialects pronounce it air anyway.

chun
Toward, to, but only spatially.
Seol leitir chugham = Send a letter to me.

The meaning of toward has lead to a derived meaning of "in order to" (similar to the older English use of "toward" to mean "in order to")
Chuas go dtí an sosadh chun mo mháthair a dh'fheiscint = I went to the station (in order) to see my mother.

as
from, out of.
Either in the sense of "originating from" or "outside of".

as obair = out of work
as Gaillimh = from Galway
as mo radharc = out of sight (Fág as m' radharc a mhic = Get the **** out of my way)

In many dialects this is just a before a consonant:
a' Cíll Dara = from Kildare.

ag
Leaving aside its broad use with the verbal noun (ag rith) and possession (tá cat ag an bhfear) this mostly means:
(a) spatial "at".
ag an mBuailtín = at Buailtín (a village)
(b) part of (a group of people)
Bhí cuid acu ann = Some of them were there.

fé/faoi/fá: Many dialectal forms of this preposition.
(a) under. Fén mbord = under the table
(b) Some dialects use this to mean about about:
ag caint fé rud = talking about something
(c) plan/intend. Tá fúm dul = I plan/intent to go.

idir
(a) Both, idir mnáibh agus fearaibh = both men and women
(b) between

I'll be back with more.

Fantastically helpful post, ALD - the various uses of "ar" has always stumped me. Is there any book which you (or anybody else) would recommend that explains ways of matching the correct preposition with the correct verb?